Re: 3 features that hmm?
Donnna, I could not have said it better myself. No, Windows is not the darkside and I feel I have to say that whenever I listen to Windows or Windows AT related podcasts which I do regularly, I have never - as far as i can remember heard these folks disparage Apple's efforts. There are of course those in the AT and Windows communities who have dismissed the Mac out of hand, but these narrow minded folks are few and far between. I think we can all agree that people should use what works for them - or what works for them in a given situation - whether that be Linux, Mac or Windows is irrelevant. Yes, Apple has made great steps forward in the accessibility of Mac OS X, Windows AT developers and Microsoft have also done the same for Windows as have Linux folks. As you said, there are definite weaknesses to both - indeeed all the OS's as there are definite advantages. None of these operating systems are in any way perfect but we should respect everyone and their choice. I am not criticizing anyone - personally, I think it's a good thing that Apple have added the ability for people to decide on how they want to edit as well as other things. It is always nice and convenient to have options and multiple ways of doing things. Take care all James - Original Message - From: "Donna Goodin" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 4:06 AM Subject: RE: 3 features that hmm? > > Hello all, > > I have to support Rich here. The attitude displayed by many Mac users > toward Windows, and toward Windows users who are doing their best to learn > the Mac OS is frankly despicable. Many mac users--definitely not all--are > nothing more than a bunch of narrow-minded snobs. Windows is not "the > dark > side". It is a viable choice, perhaps a better choice for some people. > JAWS and Windows worked very well for me for nearly 20 years. I am only > here because I want to support Apple's efforts, not because I believe > Windows or JAWS to be the devil incarnate. Yes, editing is different. > Those who prefer editing in Windows are not wrong, they just prefer > something different. They are entitled to that preference, just as all on > this list are entitled to their preference for the Mac. If Apple > implements > some choices to facilitate transition from Windows, there's nothing wrong > with that. No one has to use it unless they want to. > > Personally, I think it's great that there are multiple alternatives now > available for blind users. Yes, what Apple has done for accessibility is > tremendous. That said, I just applied for a job at a place where they > pretty much come out and tell you that if you choose to use a Mac, you > won't > be able to utilize all of their materials. So, if I get that position, > I'll > be using Windows for all things work-related. I therefore hope that > Windows > continues to be a viable option for blind users. The best possible > scenario > for us is to have as many options as possible, so that each of us can > decide > which is the best fit for us and for our immediate needs. The Mac has > many > things to recommend it. But you all who choose to use it, are in no way > superior to anyone else, and you have no right to disdain others who > either > choose the Windows option, or are willing to point out the Mac's > weaknesses. > And yes, the Mac does have very definite weaknesses, as does Windows. > > Why can't we all just be supportive and respectful of one another? I > think > the thing I find saddest about this whole movement toward the Mac, is the > way it seems to polarize everyone. Let's just support each person's > right > to find what works best for them and be happy about that. > > Donna >> -Original Message- >> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Rich Ring >> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 9:16 PM >> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >> >> >> With all respect, I am sure there was a time when you were a beginner. >> I am >> an extremely competent Windows user. This doesn't in and of itself >> make me >> the spawn of Satan, it is simply a statement concerning my current >> technological status. One of the things that has kept me from >> purchasing a >> Mac until today is the condescending manner in which some (certainly >> not >> all) Mac users treat those of us who are investigating this pltform who >> have >> been Windows users. >> >> - Original Message - >> From: "Marie Howarth" >> To: >> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 7:45 PM >> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >> >> >> >> think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to >> accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way it is >> meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are here >> now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need their >> screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. as
Re: Does anyone know how to install RAM on the White MacBooks?
Thanks - Original Message - From: "Buddy Brannan" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 4:45 AM Subject: Re: Does anyone know how to install RAM on the White MacBooks? > > Hi, > > It's dead easy. I found it on Google (google knows everything, > including how to install RAM on a white Macbook). > > 1) Remove the battery. Take a quarter and turn the thingy that has a > slot that's just right for putting a quarter in on the bottom of your > Macbook, next to (oddly enough) the battery. > > 2) Remove the little bracket. It's L-shaped and has a couple screws to > loosen. The memory's under there. You'll see a couple little plastic > handles that pop the old memory out. Be careful not to break those. > Pop the old memory, stick the new memory in, push the handles back in, > screw the bracket back on, stick the battery back in, turn the thingy. > That's pretty much it, but if you want more detailed instructions, ask > Google. It came up with some nice ones. > -- > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY > > > > On Aug 29, 2009, at 4:59 AM, James & Nash wrote: > >> >> Hi folks, >> Does anyone know how to install RAM on the White MacBooks? can >> anyone give >> step by step instructions please? >> >> >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> James >> >> >> > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Does anyone know how to install RAM on the White MacBooks?
Thanks Tim. I might give this a go - or I might let the folks at the store do it lol. But it's always good to now how to do these things. - Original Message - From: Tim Kilburn To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 5:08 AM Subject: Re: Does anyone know how to install RAM on the White MacBooks? Hi James, You asked: Does anyone know how to install RAM on the White MacBooks? can anyone give step by step instructions please? TK: The installation of RAM is fairly straight forward on those machines. You'll need a set of precision screwdrivers in order to do this and make sure you're in a location that does not have static electricity. A static strip is always a good idea. 1. Shutdown your MacBook and ensure the power cable is disconnected. 2. close it up and turn it upside down. 3. Use a coin or your fingernail to unlock the battery and remove it. 4. On the long side of the battery opening, there are three little screws that you'll need to loosen. The screws will be evenly spaced along that side. The screws do not actually totally come away from the casing as they have a stopper to keep them attached to the plastic shielding. 5. Once they are sufficiently loose, you can pull the shielding away to reveal access to the RAM. This shielding comes out in the shape of an "L". Be extremely careful not to damage this. 6. Now there are usually two sticks of RAM that you can access. There should be a lever sort of thing that you pull from one side of, that will partially release the RAM. You can then gently grab it with your fingers and pull it out and place it on the static bag that your new RAM came in. 7. Put the new RAM in the same slot that the old RAM was in. You need to press firmly and it will sort of snap into place. this is the tricky area as you need to press firmly but do not force it in. If you have the RAM upside down it should not actually seat properly but if you force it, you will damage the receiving end of the slot. 8. Perform #6 and #7 for the other stick of RAM. 9. Replace the shield and then tighten the screws. 10. Replace your battery and lock it in place. That should do it. You should place the old RAM in the static bags that your new RAM came in for safe keeping. If your computer does not make the chime noise when you attempt to start it after the installation then you've either installed it incorrectly, you have a bad stick of RAM or the RAM is not compatible with your unit. In these cases, try removing one stick at a time to determine if one or the other is bad or if the problem is something else. HTH. Later... Tim Kilburn & Carter the Canine Fort McMurray, AB Canada --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: the doc, interesting change in sl
Thanks for that tip Marie. Can you also use up arrow as in Leopard and Tiger? - Original Message - From: "Marie Howarth" Cc: ; Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 3:02 AM Subject: the doc, interesting change in sl > > in the doc, instead of just being able to arrow down to see > applications options, such as keep in doc, open at log in, you are no > longer able to arrow. now use the contextual menu, vo--shift--m to get > to these mini doc menus. > hth > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: way files are sorted on os x
Hi. You can sort files and folders by "kind," which means it sorts files and folders by the file extension. If you have a big folder with a lot of files and sub folders, it will sort the file extension in alphabetically order. If you have a lot of applications, it will show them first, and then it will show all the folders when the file extension comes to f. I hope that makes sense. You can change the view by doing the following: 1: When you are in Finder, press command j 2: move the VO cursor to the right until you've reached the popup button. 3: Press VO spacebar on the button, and choose "kind." 4: Press command j again to hide the view options. You can't sort the files so the folders are shown first in Finder. There is a replacement for Finder called Path Finder which is able to sort things so the folders are shown first, but this application is pretty expensive as far as I remember. Best regards: Søren Jensen Mail & MSN: s...@coolfortheblind.dk Website: http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/ On 30/08/2009, at 06.12, Tim Kilburn wrote: >> Hi, > > You asked: I am now copying over some files from my windows machine > to the mac (no better way to learn the system then just using it) i > am noticing though that it seems as if folders are not sorted first > (in windows i first got a list of all the folders and then the > files) this seems to be different on the mac, this is a bit of a > problem for me sinc emy music folder consists of a fes bufrolders > and about 2000 loose files (messy i know) is there a way to sort > stuff so that folders are shown first? > > TK: Not that I'm aware of. Sorry. > > Later... > > Tim Kilburn > & Carter the Canine > Fort McMurray, AB Canada > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: ejecting a cd
Rich, Just press Command-E. Best, Donna -Original Message- From: Rich Ring Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:39 PM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: ejecting a cd How do you eject a cd? In my finder window, the only volume I see is my Leopard install cd. I have Voiceover, but I cannot see my hard drive. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: I've Entered MacLand
Hi, I find it slow at surfing the web and I don't know why. I even reinstalled with a full erase. Safari is the only program that's slow for me. Not running a monitor on my Mac mini, but this is how I did it in leopard. Weird. On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 15:26:43 -0500 Mike Arrigo wrote: > > Hey, that's cool Rich, hope you get one. I'm typing this message in > the new snow leopard, the improvements in voiceover are great, and no > sighted help needed to install. and it's incredible when cruising the > web > On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Rich Ring wrote: > > > > > Good luck to you. I may be purchasing one today. > > - Original Message - > > From: "Les Kriegler" > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 12:16 AM > > Subject: I've Entered MacLand > > > > > > > > I've purchased our first Apple System since 1985 when we bought an > > Apple 2E. > > How's that for dating myself? It's a MacBook Pro and it should arrive > > within the week. I was informed that Snow Leopard may be installed, > > but if > > not, I'll receive the installation package. Very much looking > > forward to > > some hands-on experience and using VoiceOver! > > > > Les > > > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > > signature > > database 4378 (20090828) __ > > > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Chris G --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: 3 features that hmm?
I completely agree Max. Editing wasn't hard for me to learn, but web browsing and getting used to where certain things are in the system has been more of a challenge. And at least five times a day I still press Enter instead of Command-O to open a file or launch an app. And conversely, it's also gotten to the point where when I'm on my Windows machine, I try and press Command-shift-D to send an email message. I guess that's just the nature of moving back and forth between two systems. I think the more choices we as blind users have, the better, and I'd encourage anyone to just find the one that is the best fit for them. Take care, Donna -Original Message- From: Maxwell Ivey Jr. Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:44 PM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? Hi Donna; It could have just been me, but that is the point. there are people out there who have been doing it one way for so long that any change can be frustrating. I remember how many times i deleted the wrong character or inserted a character in the wrong spot and had to do it over. Now, I'm used to it. And the few times i use the windows computer I have to remember things like pressing the spacebar before entering text in a form field. Mac is the way to go. Just wish we could convince the makers of adobe, flash, eudora, and others that we can't currently use on the mac. Take care, Max On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: > > Well, I guess we all have our things. Ironically, the adjustment to > editing > text has been one of the easier parts of my adjustment to the Mac. > *smile* > Take care, > Donna >> -Original Message- >> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey >> Jr. >> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:16 PM >> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >> >> >> Thanks donna; only wish my transition from doss to windows had been >> as easy. That was a real mind cramp sort of thing. Take care, Max >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:07 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: >> >>> >>> Nice post, Max. >>> Donna >>> -Original Message- From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey Jr. Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 9:29 PM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? Hello; Just speaking for myself the hardest adjustment i had to >> make when moving to a mac was getting used to the way you have to edit text. Now, that I understand it, it is second nature; but it was a real headache in the beginning. Another one that was a tough one to get my mind around was not having multiple windows in my browser. I finallly found out that you can have multiple finder and safari windows you just cycle through them differently. It sounds like apple was doing its best to listen and adapt to what people were saying were short comings in voiceover. To me this is a good thing. Maybe they didn't get this one issue right, but I believe they continually make an honest effort to give us the most accessible easiest to use product out there. I'm still planning to wait on snow lepard. You know >> why? Its because of all the times I upgraded in windows and found things were worse instead of better. Its for all the times I kept using >> the previous version of software out of fear that the next one wouldn't work with jaws. So, thanks to apple for voiceover and their continuing commitment to universal access. You all take care, Max On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:45 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: > > think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to > accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way it > is > meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are here > now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need >> their > screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. as >> I > stated, opinion, that's all. everyone's allowed those :) > > On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:39 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> >> Come on this is crazy. You just can't imagine the number of >> people >> who >> bitched and complained about this whole editing issue and I >> believe >> Apple was taken to task by one of the rags put out by the NFB or some >> organization about the editing issue. APparently enough people >> complained that Apple was trying to provide the flexibility for those >> users who need it. Yeah, I am one of the Scotts who made this >> point >> because I remember clearly the noise about this editing issue. I see >> no benefit in removing it and quite frankly since it
RE: Just got a Mac Mini
Hey Mike, Thanks for posting these instructions. It does soun like an easy straight-forward process. And, I just received email notification that my copy of SL has shipped! Yay! I'm looking forward to checking it out! Best, Donna -Original Message- From: Mike Arrigo Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 12:11 AM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Just got a Mac Mini Hey Rich, that's awesome that you got a mac, you're going to love it. Insert the DVD, then hold the c key to boot it up. Hold the command key and press F5 to start voice over, and the first thing you will need to do is choose the language for the install. Select continue, you can then go to the menu bar, and choose utilities. Select disk utility and this will allow you to erase your hard drive so you can do a clean install. And it's all completely accessible. Let me know if you need any more help. On Aug 29, 2009, at 5:57 PM, Rich Ring wrote: > Hello all you helpful wonderful veteran Mac users! > Just got back from the Apple store with a Mac Mini. I've been told > by many that if I fire it up I will hear a spoken message telling me > how to get Voiceover running. Is this true? > Second, we have SL, and we will need to install it. My thought was > that since this is a brand new machine, I might as well do a clean > upgrade. Should I just put the SL DVD in the drive press C and > eventually press command f5 and do the upgrade, or do I have to set > up the Mac first. > I know, stupid questions, but if you don't ask, you don't know. > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Braille during installation
Hello, that is fantastic since I cant read contracted braille. Greetings, Anouk, - Original Message - From: "Anne Robertson" To: Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 3:02 PM Subject: Braille during installation > > Hello everyone, > > It is now possible for non-English speakers to install Snow Leopard > using a Braille display as uncontracted Braille is used during > installation. > > Cheers, > > Anne > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Snow Leopard and dropbox any ideas?
Hi, i don't have any info about this, but since upgrading i have noticed that the context menu for Dropbox has vanished, therefore i don't even know if i have dropbox properly installed or not. What to do? /Krister 30 aug 2009 kl. 00.08 skrev Scott Rutkowski: > > Hi all. > > Just wondering if anyone on the list may have an idea on how to > resolve this issue please? > > Since upgrading to Snow Leopard and now finding out dropbox menus > can't be accessed by using the window chooser vo f2 twice and arrow > down to untitled and hit enter and do a vo shift space to access the > menus, these commands no longer work on snow leopard. > > From what I read in the dropbox forums you can control click on > dropbox supposedly and access options but so far i've not been able to > accomplish this. > > Has anyone else tried using dropbox with Snow Leopard to see if there > is a work around? > > I realize there's not much we need to access in dropbox but having > access to the menus in dropbox under leopard was awesome because you > could tell if files were transferring or not. > > Is there something I should tell the developers to make it vo friendly > under snow leopard? > > If anyone has any info or suggestions on the above, please let us all > know. > > > Thanks very much for your time. > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
Hi donna; well said. I actually got my first mac because I couldn't figure out which windows computer to replace my last laptop with. We had read that the sound cards need to be a 32 bit if not 64 bit to run jaws and other windows features without a strain, and we couldn't find any off the shelf laptops where we could even find out what the sound cards were. And ordering a custom built one would have cost more money than i had to spend. Finally, my brother decided to help me buy a used ibook g4 to get my feet wet. Now, I'm apple all the way. I just wish we could get the flash player and the adobe reader accessible. At least the overdrive media console now has a mac version. I don't see me buying an iphone because I would have to switch cell phone providers, but I'm hopeful the next round of ipod touch will have speech. Then I'd get everything accept for th ephone as long as i was in range of a wifi signal. Should be asleep. take care, Max On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:26 AM, Donna Goodin wrote: > > I completely agree Max. Editing wasn't hard for me to learn, but > web browsing and getting used to where certain things are in the > system has been more of a challenge. And at least five times a day > I still press Enter instead of Command-O to open a file or launch an > app. And conversely, it's also gotten to the point where when I'm on > my Windows machine, I try and press Command-shift-D to send an email > message. I guess that's just the nature of moving back and forth > between two systems. I think the more choices we as blind users > have, the better, and I'd encourage anyone to just find the one that > is the best fit for them. > Take care, > Donna > > -Original Message- > From: Maxwell Ivey Jr. > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:44 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > Hi Donna; It could have just been me, but that is the point. there > are people out there who have been doing it one way for so long that > any change can be frustrating. I remember how many times i deleted > the wrong character or inserted a character in the wrong spot and had > to do it over. Now, I'm used to it. And the few times i use the > windows computer I have to remember things like pressing the spacebar > before entering text in a form field. Mac is the way to go. Just > wish we could convince the makers of adobe, flash, eudora, and others > that we can't currently use on the mac. Take care, Max > On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: > >> >> Well, I guess we all have our things. Ironically, the adjustment to >> editing >> text has been one of the easier parts of my adjustment to the Mac. >> *smile* >> Take care, >> Donna >>> -Original Message- >>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey >>> Jr. >>> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:16 PM >>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >>> >>> >>> Thanks donna; only wish my transition from doss to windows had been >>> as easy. That was a real mind cramp sort of thing. Take care, Max >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:07 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: >>> Nice post, Max. Donna > -Original Message- > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey > Jr. > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 9:29 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > Hello; Just speaking for myself the hardest adjustment i had to >>> make > when moving to a mac was getting used to the way you have to edit > text. Now, that I understand it, it is second nature; but it > was a > real headache in the beginning. Another one that was a tough one > to > get my mind around was not having multiple windows in my > browser. I > finallly found out that you can have multiple finder and safari > windows you just cycle through them differently. It sounds like > apple > was doing its best to listen and adapt to what people were saying > were > short comings in voiceover. To me this is a good thing. Maybe > they > didn't get this one issue right, but I believe they continually > make > an honest effort to give us the most accessible easiest to use > product > out there. I'm still planning to wait on snow lepard. You know >>> why? > Its because of all the times I upgraded in windows and found > things > were worse instead of better. Its for all the times I kept using >>> the > previous version of software out of fear that the next one > wouldn't > work with jaws. So, thanks to apple for voiceover and their > continuing commitment to universal access. You all take care, Max > On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:45 PM, Marie Howart
Re: 3 features that hmm?
Hi, What i had the biggest problem with when transfering to the Mac, was the finder and how to work with folders and such. I wasn't used to the sidebar and so on, but that problem is gone now. /Krister 30 aug 2009 kl. 10.26 skrev Donna Goodin: > > I completely agree Max. Editing wasn't hard for me to learn, but > web browsing and getting used to where certain things are in the > system has been more of a challenge. And at least five times a day > I still press Enter instead of Command-O to open a file or launch an > app. And conversely, it's also gotten to the point where when I'm on > my Windows machine, I try and press Command-shift-D to send an email > message. I guess that's just the nature of moving back and forth > between two systems. I think the more choices we as blind users > have, the better, and I'd encourage anyone to just find the one that > is the best fit for them. > Take care, > Donna > > -Original Message- > From: Maxwell Ivey Jr. > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:44 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > Hi Donna; It could have just been me, but that is the point. there > are people out there who have been doing it one way for so long that > any change can be frustrating. I remember how many times i deleted > the wrong character or inserted a character in the wrong spot and had > to do it over. Now, I'm used to it. And the few times i use the > windows computer I have to remember things like pressing the spacebar > before entering text in a form field. Mac is the way to go. Just > wish we could convince the makers of adobe, flash, eudora, and others > that we can't currently use on the mac. Take care, Max > On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: > >> >> Well, I guess we all have our things. Ironically, the adjustment to >> editing >> text has been one of the easier parts of my adjustment to the Mac. >> *smile* >> Take care, >> Donna >>> -Original Message- >>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey >>> Jr. >>> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:16 PM >>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >>> >>> >>> Thanks donna; only wish my transition from doss to windows had been >>> as easy. That was a real mind cramp sort of thing. Take care, Max >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:07 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: >>> Nice post, Max. Donna > -Original Message- > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey > Jr. > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 9:29 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > Hello; Just speaking for myself the hardest adjustment i had to >>> make > when moving to a mac was getting used to the way you have to edit > text. Now, that I understand it, it is second nature; but it > was a > real headache in the beginning. Another one that was a tough one > to > get my mind around was not having multiple windows in my > browser. I > finallly found out that you can have multiple finder and safari > windows you just cycle through them differently. It sounds like > apple > was doing its best to listen and adapt to what people were saying > were > short comings in voiceover. To me this is a good thing. Maybe > they > didn't get this one issue right, but I believe they continually > make > an honest effort to give us the most accessible easiest to use > product > out there. I'm still planning to wait on snow lepard. You know >>> why? > Its because of all the times I upgraded in windows and found > things > were worse instead of better. Its for all the times I kept using >>> the > previous version of software out of fear that the next one > wouldn't > work with jaws. So, thanks to apple for voiceover and their > continuing commitment to universal access. You all take care, Max > On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:45 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: > >> >> think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to >> accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way >> it >> is >> meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are >> here >> now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need >>> their >> screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. >> as >>> I >> stated, opinion, that's all. everyone's allowed those :) >> >> On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:39 AM, Scott Howell wrote: >> >>> >>> Come on this is crazy. You just can't imagine the number of >>> people >>> who >>> bitched and complained about this whole editing issue and I >>> believe >>> Apple was taken to task by one
Baby Steps with the White Cat and, Mark Has A Question
Hello Everyone, Well, I took a few baby steps today. Not as many as I had hoped but enough to make me even more glad I decided to take a walk with the white cat. 1. I customized my desktop and setup Safari to launch on my preferred home page. 2. I setup and configured iTunes so that it and my Windows computers are all now sharing the same media library. 3. I configured the startup setting options and created some new accounts and configured some network workgroups. 4. I setup my Verizon Wireless Air card so that I can have access to the Net when I'm out and about. Yes, this was the first third-party app I've installed on my Mac. It went well, a little confusing but I suspect that had more to do with Verizon Wireless than the Mac OS. 5. I ran the Boot Camp utility and installed Windows 7. I only used 32 gigs for Windows 7 as I do not intend to use this machine as a Windows computer until I gain much, much more experience using the Mac OS. I installed it for the experience of doing so and so I may assist others in the future. I was impressed that the Snow Leopard 10.6 DVD came with all of the correct drivers for Windows 7 thus, all of the hardware works correctly. This Mac is a beautiful thing. I promise I will not write everyday telling of my progress but I just wanted to share that I have begun taking baby steps with the Mac and so far it's a great experience. One thing is for certain, for iPhone 3GS users, the Mac OS is a must. In fact, Windows, even my beloved Windows 7 is already beginning to pale in comparison to Snow Leopard. If someone had told me two weeks ago I would be this enamored with the Mac, I would have thought him crazy but, as the saying goes, "Never say Never." Even in this short time, I feel quite at home using the iPhone 3GS VoiceOver gestures on the MacBook track pad. I have a question about Safari: Is there a way to maximize the size of the Safari Windows so that it takes up more of the Desktop than it does when it is supposed to be sizable? Currently, regardless of whether I select the Zoom button, I cannot get the Safari Windows to fill most of the display screen. Any tips on this will be greatly appreciated. Thank you, Mark --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
Marie I dont' disagree it is rediculous that Apple provide the option because it does only reenforce a bad habit that screen reading developers continued. My point again is you and I both are entitled to our opinions, but it seriously is not a feature needing to be removed. My only hope is that people will learn to edit in the way VoiceOver provided originally and this was one of those features I would not have bothered with, but apparently some just couldn't imagine or master the concept as it was and thus the feature was born. Perhaps it's more my amazement that someone understands the fact the feature really isn't needed, more a shift in the understanding of how the cursor works, but seriously the confusion for people was apparently quite painful. On Aug 29, 2009, at 8:45 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: > > think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to > accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way it is > meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are here > now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need their > screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. as I > stated, opinion, that's all. everyone's allowed those :) > > On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:39 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> >> Come on this is crazy. You just can't imagine the number of people >> who >> bitched and complained about this whole editing issue and I believe >> Apple was taken to task by one of the rags put out by the NFB or some >> organization about the editing issue. APparently enough people >> complained that Apple was trying to provide the flexibility for those >> users who need it. Yeah, I am one of the Scotts who made this point >> because I remember clearly the noise about this editing issue. I see >> no benefit in removing it and quite frankly since it's here, whatever >> at this point. If it really helps someone , fine because there are >> those who would simply not consider the Mac for this reason. It is >> an >> option and not a default and that is why it's a feature not worth >> removing. My point is you have to think beyond what you have stated >> and I don't entirely disagree with your point of what is or is not a >> standard way of editing etc. At the same time, it obviously didn't >> take a great deal of effort to implement it and at least it is an >> option. >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:14 PM, Scott Chesworth wrote: >> >>> >>> Also just my oppinion, but I disagree about points 1 and 2. >>> >>> Can't say I ever have used feature numero uno in any OS as there are >>> so few webpages I'd actually want to read 100% of their content, but >>> someone somewhere will find it useful. You could argue that the >>> reading webpages automatically is as close as Apple could get to a >>> sighted person glancing at the screen when the page comes up and >>> taking in the bigger picture, which we can't do. >>> >>> Voiceover hints are definitely useful and a good thing. Context >>> sensitive help like that enables most people to be on a way shorter >>> learning curve usually than reading a whole manual and trying to >>> apply >>> things to a ton of situations at once. It's annoying that they're >>> enabled by default for you or I perhaps, but newbies are going to >>> thank Apple for it no doubt. Come to that, so will developers who >>> fire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled email >>> from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to their >>> applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the difference >>> between what works and what doesn't, it gives them instructions >>> equally as precise as that email from the VI user would in most >>> cases. >>> >>> Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get this >>> one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason the >>> option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that doesn't in any >>> way >>> need to be modified, purely because of some VI people's rut that >>> they're firmly jammed into. To add weight to a big sweeping >>> oppinion >>> like that, I should say that I was raised on Windows, still use >>> Windows more often than many on here I expect, and I make my fair >>> share of mistakes editing in Mac OS if I haven't done any in a >>> while. >>> I don't see this option as the solution, I see it as cheating. I >>> doubt that many people will see this as an option to ease their >>> progression into Mac OS as one of the other Scott's suggested, >>> human's >>> just don't work that way, for the most part we're creatures of habit >>> even if they're bad ones. >>> >>> Tricky one though isn't it. Emailing Apple and asking that a >>> feature >>> be removed seems somehow wrong in my mind. In any case, I'm not >>> sure >>> they'd get it. I just tried to explain why I disagree with the >>> feature and what's potentially at stake here to a sighted mac user, >>> and she point blank didn't get it. I'm not sure that
Re: 3 features that hmm?
And that should not be the reason to delay/prevent you from purchasing a Mac. Who cares what others say/think and you use what you need to get the job done. Personally I detest windows and make every effort possible to avoid using it, but then again, I have to use it for now at the office and that's just the way it goes. I however, personally made the choice to do something different personally and I did. I was fortunate to have started with Tiger and moved on from there. I however can't believe what someone says etc. would prevent you from making the switch. personally yeah, I'll tell you that getting away from windows is the best thing you could do for yourself, but I know there is a learning curve you'll have to deal with, but I'd bet you the learning curve is considerably less then if you were learning windows and a windows screen reader. On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:15 PM, Rich Ring wrote: > > With all respect, I am sure there was a time when you were a > beginner. I am > an extremely competent Windows user. This doesn't in and of itself > make me > the spawn of Satan, it is simply a statement concerning my current > technological status. One of the things that has kept me from > purchasing a > Mac until today is the condescending manner in which some (certainly > not > all) Mac users treat those of us who are investigating this pltform > who have > been Windows users. > > - Original Message - > From: "Marie Howarth" > To: > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 7:45 PM > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > > think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to > accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way it is > meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are here > now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need their > screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. as I > stated, opinion, that's all. everyone's allowed those :) > > On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:39 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> >> Come on this is crazy. You just can't imagine the number of people >> who >> bitched and complained about this whole editing issue and I believe >> Apple was taken to task by one of the rags put out by the NFB or some >> organization about the editing issue. APparently enough people >> complained that Apple was trying to provide the flexibility for those >> users who need it. Yeah, I am one of the Scotts who made this point >> because I remember clearly the noise about this editing issue. I see >> no benefit in removing it and quite frankly since it's here, whatever >> at this point. If it really helps someone , fine because there are >> those who would simply not consider the Mac for this reason. It is >> an >> option and not a default and that is why it's a feature not worth >> removing. My point is you have to think beyond what you have stated >> and I don't entirely disagree with your point of what is or is not a >> standard way of editing etc. At the same time, it obviously didn't >> take a great deal of effort to implement it and at least it is an >> option. >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:14 PM, Scott Chesworth wrote: >> >>> >>> Also just my oppinion, but I disagree about points 1 and 2. >>> >>> Can't say I ever have used feature numero uno in any OS as there are >>> so few webpages I'd actually want to read 100% of their content, but >>> someone somewhere will find it useful. You could argue that the >>> reading webpages automatically is as close as Apple could get to a >>> sighted person glancing at the screen when the page comes up and >>> taking in the bigger picture, which we can't do. >>> >>> Voiceover hints are definitely useful and a good thing. Context >>> sensitive help like that enables most people to be on a way shorter >>> learning curve usually than reading a whole manual and trying to >>> apply >>> things to a ton of situations at once. It's annoying that they're >>> enabled by default for you or I perhaps, but newbies are going to >>> thank Apple for it no doubt. Come to that, so will developers who >>> fire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled email >>> from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to their >>> applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the difference >>> between what works and what doesn't, it gives them instructions >>> equally as precise as that email from the VI user would in most >>> cases. >>> >>> Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get this >>> one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason the >>> option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that doesn't in any >>> way >>> need to be modified, purely because of some VI people's rut that >>> they're firmly jammed into. To add weight to a big sweeping >>> oppinion >>> like that, I should say that I was raised on Windows, still use >>> Windows more often than many on here I expect, and I make my fair >>> share of mist
Re: 3 features that hmm?
I too have used Mac OS X since Tiger and have only noticed improvements - Original Message - From: "Scott Howell" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 10:32 AM Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > And that should not be the reason to delay/prevent you from purchasing > a Mac. Who cares what others say/think and you use what you need to > get the job done. Personally I detest windows and make every effort > possible to avoid using it, but then again, I have to use it for now > at the office and that's just the way it goes. I however, personally > made the choice to do something different personally and I did. I was > fortunate to have started with Tiger and moved on from there. I > however can't believe what someone says etc. would prevent you from > making the switch. personally yeah, I'll tell you that getting away > from windows is the best thing you could do for yourself, but I know > there is a learning curve you'll have to deal with, but I'd bet you > the learning curve is considerably less then if you were learning > windows and a windows screen reader. > On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:15 PM, Rich Ring wrote: > >> >> With all respect, I am sure there was a time when you were a >> beginner. I am >> an extremely competent Windows user. This doesn't in and of itself >> make me >> the spawn of Satan, it is simply a statement concerning my current >> technological status. One of the things that has kept me from >> purchasing a >> Mac until today is the condescending manner in which some (certainly >> not >> all) Mac users treat those of us who are investigating this pltform >> who have >> been Windows users. >> >> - Original Message - >> From: "Marie Howarth" >> To: >> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 7:45 PM >> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >> >> >> >> think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to >> accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way it is >> meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are here >> now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need their >> screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. as I >> stated, opinion, that's all. everyone's allowed those :) >> >> On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:39 AM, Scott Howell wrote: >> >>> >>> Come on this is crazy. You just can't imagine the number of people >>> who >>> bitched and complained about this whole editing issue and I believe >>> Apple was taken to task by one of the rags put out by the NFB or some >>> organization about the editing issue. APparently enough people >>> complained that Apple was trying to provide the flexibility for those >>> users who need it. Yeah, I am one of the Scotts who made this point >>> because I remember clearly the noise about this editing issue. I see >>> no benefit in removing it and quite frankly since it's here, whatever >>> at this point. If it really helps someone , fine because there are >>> those who would simply not consider the Mac for this reason. It is >>> an >>> option and not a default and that is why it's a feature not worth >>> removing. My point is you have to think beyond what you have stated >>> and I don't entirely disagree with your point of what is or is not a >>> standard way of editing etc. At the same time, it obviously didn't >>> take a great deal of effort to implement it and at least it is an >>> option. >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:14 PM, Scott Chesworth wrote: >>> Also just my oppinion, but I disagree about points 1 and 2. Can't say I ever have used feature numero uno in any OS as there are so few webpages I'd actually want to read 100% of their content, but someone somewhere will find it useful. You could argue that the reading webpages automatically is as close as Apple could get to a sighted person glancing at the screen when the page comes up and taking in the bigger picture, which we can't do. Voiceover hints are definitely useful and a good thing. Context sensitive help like that enables most people to be on a way shorter learning curve usually than reading a whole manual and trying to apply things to a ton of situations at once. It's annoying that they're enabled by default for you or I perhaps, but newbies are going to thank Apple for it no doubt. Come to that, so will developers who fire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled email from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to their applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the difference between what works and what doesn't, it gives them instructions equally as precise as that email from the VI user would in most cases. Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get this one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason the option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that doesn't in any way need to be modified, p
Re: 3 features that hmm?
Hmmm, maybe I'm having issues in articulation. My point is and has been that I don't disagree the feature does more harm then good, because yes, it does hold one back from truly getting the concept of editing from the perspective of the majority; if that makes sense. Asking Apple to remove it at this point makes little sense is what I'm saying. I recall the debate and all the crap surrounding the issue of editing one way vs. the other. Personally I would not have wasted the code, but at the same time if it really proves to be beneficial then great. I'd hate to think someone would choose not to switch based on the issue of editing and so, since the feature is here, then great. Gee, I think this thread has generated nearly as much noise as the entire editing thread. Hey I see her point and I'm not disagreeing, just saying since it's here I hope someone will benefit if that is what is holding them up and yeah, this sure generated a lot of issues when it came up as a topic. Hell, I had trouble understanding this initially and now when I do use windows-based screen reader, I have to work hard at remembering the old way of editing. :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
What would be nice is if the windows-based screen readers just had done it right from the beginning and we wouldn't be having this discussion. :) On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Woody Anna Dresner wrote: > > Hi, > > I'm pretty much used to editing on a Mac now, but I'll have to say I'm > glad there's the option to edit the way you do in Windows. I write > books that have to be structured with headings and lists and such so > they can be converted to DAISY. This means I have to write them in > Word. This means that up until now, I've had to edit part of the time > the Windows way and part of the time the Mac way. this can be really > irritating after a while; I end up making silly mistakes because I'm > having to switch back and forth all the time. So I will probably set > VO to edit the Windows way, so I don't have to think about which > operating system I'm using at the moment and can think about what I'm > writing, not how to edit it. I realize that if I were sighted, editing > would resemble the mac way more than the Windows way, but if I were > sighted, editing would be the same for me regardless of the operating > system. Being able to edit in both operating systems the same way will > make my experience more similar to what a sighted person experiences, > even if the method of editing is different. > > Best, > Anna > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: way files are sorted on os x
Hi, i guess i will have to actually organize my music library for once then, lol since all my files are flac files. Greetings, Anouk, - Original Message - From: Søren Jensen To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 10:09 AM Subject: Re: way files are sorted on os x Hi. You can sort files and folders by "kind," which means it sorts files and folders by the file extension. If you have a big folder with a lot of files and sub folders, it will sort the file extension in alphabetically order. If you have a lot of applications, it will show them first, and then it will show all the folders when the file extension comes to f. I hope that makes sense. You can change the view by doing the following: 1: When you are in Finder, press command j 2: move the VO cursor to the right until you've reached the popup button. 3: Press VO spacebar on the button, and choose "kind." 4: Press command j again to hide the view options. You can't sort the files so the folders are shown first in Finder. There is a replacement for Finder called Path Finder which is able to sort things so the folders are shown first, but this application is pretty expensive as far as I remember. Best regards: Søren Jensen Mail & MSN: s...@coolfortheblind.dk Website: http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/ On 30/08/2009, at 06.12, Tim Kilburn wrote: Hi, You asked: I am now copying over some files from my windows machine to the mac (no better way to learn the system then just using it) i am noticing though that it seems as if folders are not sorted first (in windows i first got a list of all the folders and then the files) this seems to be different on the mac, this is a bit of a problem for me sinc emy music folder consists of a fes bufrolders and about 2000 loose files (messy i know) is there a way to sort stuff so that folders are shown first? TK: Not that I'm aware of. Sorry. Later... Tim Kilburn & Carter the Canine Fort McMurray, AB Canada --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
Well stated Donna and all my jabs at windows really is more poking fun, but I still can't stand windows and glad to have a choice. I use windows at work and that is what we have, but luckily there is even there a choice. I personally don't care what you use as long as your productive. After all, no one os earns you a paycheck and quite frankly I'll learn to use a pencil and paper if that is what earns me a paycheck, so I can go buy a Mac. :) Couldn't let that slide by. :) On Aug 29, 2009, at 11:06 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: > > Hello all, > > I have to support Rich here. The attitude displayed by many Mac users > toward Windows, and toward Windows users who are doing their best to > learn > the Mac OS is frankly despicable. Many mac users--definitely not > all--are > nothing more than a bunch of narrow-minded snobs. Windows is not > "the dark > side". It is a viable choice, perhaps a better choice for some > people. > JAWS and Windows worked very well for me for nearly 20 years. I am > only > here because I want to support Apple's efforts, not because I believe > Windows or JAWS to be the devil incarnate. Yes, editing is different. > Those who prefer editing in Windows are not wrong, they just prefer > something different. They are entitled to that preference, just as > all on > this list are entitled to their preference for the Mac. If Apple > implements > some choices to facilitate transition from Windows, there's nothing > wrong > with that. No one has to use it unless they want to. > > Personally, I think it's great that there are multiple alternatives > now > available for blind users. Yes, what Apple has done for > accessibility is > tremendous. That said, I just applied for a job at a place where they > pretty much come out and tell you that if you choose to use a Mac, > you won't > be able to utilize all of their materials. So, if I get that > position, I'll > be using Windows for all things work-related. I therefore hope that > Windows > continues to be a viable option for blind users. The best possible > scenario > for us is to have as many options as possible, so that each of us > can decide > which is the best fit for us and for our immediate needs. The Mac > has many > things to recommend it. But you all who choose to use it, are in no > way > superior to anyone else, and you have no right to disdain others who > either > choose the Windows option, or are willing to point out the Mac's > weaknesses. > And yes, the Mac does have very definite weaknesses, as does Windows. > > Why can't we all just be supportive and respectful of one another? > I think > the thing I find saddest about this whole movement toward the Mac, > is the > way it seems to polarize everyone. Let's just support each > person's right > to find what works best for them and be happy about that. > > Donna >> -Original Message- >> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Rich Ring >> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 9:16 PM >> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >> >> >> With all respect, I am sure there was a time when you were a >> beginner. >> I am >> an extremely competent Windows user. This doesn't in and of itself >> make me >> the spawn of Satan, it is simply a statement concerning my current >> technological status. One of the things that has kept me from >> purchasing a >> Mac until today is the condescending manner in which some (certainly >> not >> all) Mac users treat those of us who are investigating this pltform >> who >> have >> been Windows users. >> >> - Original Message - >> From: "Marie Howarth" >> To: >> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 7:45 PM >> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >> >> >> >> think I did say I was glad of the choice, just sad apple had to >> accomodate those who find it impossible to edit text in the way it is >> meant to be edited. they are features that yes, fine they are here >> now, just weren't really missing in my opinion. If others need their >> screen reader to hold their hand cool. whatever everyone needs. as I >> stated, opinion, that's all. everyone's allowed those :) >> >> On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:39 AM, Scott Howell wrote: >> >>> >>> Come on this is crazy. You just can't imagine the number of people >> who >>> bitched and complained about this whole editing issue and I believe >>> Apple was taken to task by one of the rags put out by the NFB or >>> some >>> organization about the editing issue. APparently enough people >>> complained that Apple was trying to provide the flexibility for >>> those >>> users who need it. Yeah, I am one of the Scotts who made this point >>> because I remember clearly the noise about this editing issue. I >>> see >>> no benefit in removing it and quite frankly since it's here, >>> whatever >>> at this point. If it really helps someone , fine because there
Re: Baby Steps with the White Cat and, Mark Has A Question
Mark, not sure how to help with the Safari issue, but good deal on your progress. It's always an exciting thing when you make progress. On Aug 30, 2009, at 5:23 AM, M. Taylor wrote: > > Hello Everyone, > > Well, I took a few baby steps today. Not as many as I had hoped but > enough > to make me even more glad I decided to take a walk with the white cat. > > 1. > I customized my desktop and setup Safari to launch on my preferred > home > page. > > 2. > I setup and configured iTunes so that it and my Windows computers > are all > now sharing the same media library. > > 3. > I configured the startup setting options and created some new > accounts and > configured some network workgroups. > > 4. > I setup my Verizon Wireless Air card so that I can have access to > the Net > when I'm out and about. Yes, this was the first third-party app I've > installed on my Mac. It went well, a little confusing but I suspect > that > had more to do with Verizon Wireless than the Mac OS. > > 5. > I ran the Boot Camp utility and installed Windows 7. I only used 32 > gigs > for Windows 7 as I do not intend to use this machine as a Windows > computer > until I gain much, much more experience using the Mac OS. I > installed it > for the experience of doing so and so I may assist others in the > future. I > was impressed that the Snow Leopard 10.6 DVD came with all of the > correct > drivers for Windows 7 thus, all of the hardware works correctly. > This Mac > is a beautiful thing. > > I promise I will not write everyday telling of my progress but I > just wanted > to share that I have begun taking baby steps with the Mac and so far > it's a > great experience. > > One thing is for certain, for iPhone 3GS users, the Mac OS is a > must. In > fact, Windows, even my beloved Windows 7 is already beginning to > pale in > comparison to Snow Leopard. If someone had told me two weeks ago I > would be > this enamored with the Mac, I would have thought him crazy but, as the > saying goes, "Never say Never." > > Even in this short time, I feel quite at home using the iPhone 3GS > VoiceOver > gestures on the MacBook track pad. > > I have a question about Safari: > > Is there a way to maximize the size of the Safari Windows so that it > takes > up more of the Desktop than it does when it is supposed to be sizable? > Currently, regardless of whether I select the Zoom button, I cannot > get the > Safari Windows to fill most of the display screen. > > Any tips on this will be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you, > > Mark > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Snow Leopard and dropbox any ideas?
Have you all gone into System Preferences, Keyboard, and checked the box to use the f1, f2, etc. keys as standard function keys? That will no longer require you hold the fn key down on a notebook or desktop machine's keyboard. hth, On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:43 PM, Scott Rutkowski wrote: > > Hi there. > > I am having the same issue with the window chooser. > How are you getting around the dropbox issue finding the dropbox > preferences etc? > > > On 30/08/2009, at 11:23 AM, Fonzie wrote: > >> >> Thsi is strange to me. >> >> I am not have any issues with drop boxes in any application or >> preference paine, or even in Safari. >> >> What I am having an issue with is... >> >> VoiceOver + F1 and VoiceOver + F2 no longer works for me. >> >> Using oiceOver + F1 X2 and VoiceOver + F2 x2 no longer works either. >> >> So, neither the window chooser, nor hte applicaiton chooser comes up >> for me. >> >> Strange it is, but oh well, I get around it. >> >> Take care all. >> >> Fonzie >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 5:08 PM, Scott Rutkowski wrote: >> >>> >>> Hi all. >>> >>> Just wondering if anyone on the list may have an idea on how to >>> resolve this issue please? >>> >>> Since upgrading to Snow Leopard and now finding out dropbox menus >>> can't be accessed by using the window chooser vo f2 twice and arrow >>> down to untitled and hit enter and do a vo shift space to access the >>> menus, these commands no longer work on snow leopard. >>> >>> From what I read in the dropbox forums you can control click on >>> dropbox supposedly and access options but so far i've not been able >>> to >>> accomplish this. >>> >>> Has anyone else tried using dropbox with Snow Leopard to see if >>> there >>> is a work around? >>> >>> I realize there's not much we need to access in dropbox but having >>> access to the menus in dropbox under leopard was awesome because you >>> could tell if files were transferring or not. >>> >>> Is there something I should tell the developers to make it vo >>> friendly >>> under snow leopard? >>> >>> If anyone has any info or suggestions on the above, please let us >>> all >>> know. >>> >>> >>> Thanks very much for your time. >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: choppy reading in mail
Fonzie, what type of Mac do you have? I'm not encountering this issue, but I am looking to see if there is any patterns perhaps. Did you do a clean install or upgrade? On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Fonzie wrote: > > I second the no issue with choppy reading area. > > The sub menu thing? > > I have seen that happen once or twice. > > I mainly see it when I pull up the main menu bar though, where apple > and program related menus are located. What seems to happen is, > VoiceOver will stop speaking here and there, and only when scrolling. > This only happens if I go into the menu bar, pull down any menu of my > choosing, and read it's contents. Then, I leave the menu bar, and > immediately pull it up once more, and pull down a menu of my choosing, > VoiceOver begins the small silence issue, even when scrolling through > the menu items. > > For now, I just solve this by doing the following. ONce I attempt to > go into the menu bar the second time, I wait a couple of seconds, and > pull down the menu of my choice. Either that, or I pull down the menu > I want, and then wait a couple of seconds, and start scrolling > afterwards. > > Take care. > > Fonzie > On Aug 29, 2009, at 5:24 PM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> >> Funny, I'm having no issues with submenus in Mail or any other app I >> have used so far. There seems to be some slightly roughness to the >> reading, but not sure what the cause is and I noticed it only as a >> slight thing, but of course level of annoyance is subjective for >> sure. >> >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:08 PM, Brett Campbell wrote: >> >>> >>> Yes, I'm glad you mentioned this. The mail is read choppy. Alex >>> reads smooth as ever in Safari. I currently only have my rate at >>> 50, >>> so I don't think rate is causing it. I'm also having no luck >>> getting >>> sub menus to work, Such as when I try to move a message to another >>> box. >>> >>> Brett >>> >>> >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:50 AM, John J Herzog wrote: >>> Hi all, I'm liking the snow leopard update so far, but I'm running into an annoyance with mail. Since the update, I noticed that voiceover reads messages much more choppy than before. Specifically, it pauses too long when it encounters a new line in the middle of text. Is there an option to have voiceover keep speaking normally as if that new line did not occur in the middle of a sentence? Thanks for your help, John > >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
I've found that too lol. Ah well horses for courses - Original Message - From: "Scott Howell" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 10:41 AM Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > Hmmm, maybe I'm having issues in articulation. My point is and has > been that I don't disagree the feature does more harm then good, > because yes, it does hold one back from truly getting the concept of > editing from the perspective of the majority; if that makes sense. > Asking Apple to remove it at this point makes little sense is what I'm > saying. I recall the debate and all the crap surrounding the issue of > editing one way vs. the other. Personally I would not have wasted the > code, but at the same time if it really proves to be beneficial then > great. I'd hate to think someone would choose not to switch based on > the issue of editing and so, since the feature is here, then great. > Gee, I think this thread has generated nearly as much noise as the > entire editing thread. Hey I see her point and I'm not disagreeing, > just saying since it's here I hope someone will benefit if that is > what is holding them up and yeah, this sure generated a lot of issues > when it came up as a topic. Hell, I had trouble understanding this > initially and now when I do use windows-based screen reader, I have to > work hard at remembering the old way of editing. :) > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
OT: emacspeak
Hi, The standard emacspeak distribution that comes with Ubuntu, when compared with orca or other graphical things, has minimal requirements. I would go so far as to say that you can run emacspeak on any hardware on which your favorite GNU/Linux distro will also run and hardly notice your resources changing. Ubuntu makes installing emacspeak very easy, I do not know about other distros but the one from GNU itself would certainly do so as well. cdh On Aug 29, 2009, at 4:53 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote: > Chris, > > What are the requirements for emacs speak? When last I used emacs > regularly on a Ultra-2, I had no need for a screen reader, just > setting my fonts at 28 pt and reverse video (thanks Kyle Jones for > the help). I know there is a copy of emacs in /usr/bin and I think > it might even be GNU's version. If so what would need to happen to > use emacspeak on my Leopard machine and could it interface with the > Mac synthesizers or would GNU ones have to be added. > > Jon > > On Aug 29, 2009, at 8:30 AM, Chris Hofstader wrote: > >> >>> Hank asked: does that mean orca will die in linux to? >> >> cdh replies: >> >> The beauty of free software like orca versus proprietary software >> like JAWS (for instance) is that although Sun Microsystems has led >> the orca development, virtually any hacker or group thereof can >> take the source and continue the project. The nation of Brazil has >> elected to standardize all of its government owned and operated >> computing devices on free, GNU/Linux operating systems. They have >> two major reasons: the first, they fear that Apple and/or Microsoft >> may have built in some code into Windows and OSX to spy for the >> American government. Given the human rights record demonstrated by >> Yahoo and others spying for the Chinese government, why not think >> that the two biggest OS vendors may be helping out Uncle Sam? >> >> With the GNU/Linux OS, they have every line of source code and >> their own security personnel can go through one line at a time and >> make sure no such code exists before the Brazilian secrets show up >> at Fort Mead. >> >> The second reason is price. A GNU/Linux distribution will run >> pretty nicely on a clunky, single core, 32 bit used Dell; Snow >> Leopard and Windows 7 require pretty hefty hardware to be used >> effectively. >> >> The orca question comes in as Brazil has laws regarding people with >> disabilities that are far stronger than our wimpy ADA and their >> laws include explicit language about technology. So, while Sun is >> organizing the project, Brazil and other nations are contributing >> hackers to the project to help keep it moving forward. >> >> There are a number of other governments making similar decisions >> for similar reasons - after our government got caught spying on >> Americans, all credibility that we were not spying on everyone else >> flew out the window and closed and complicated technology is in the >> James Bond book of tricks. >> >> Those of us who get to use Macintosh and even Windows with our >> screen reader of choice really need to realize just how fortunate >> we are. I spend a fair amount of time in Ubuntu with orca and, >> often, emacspeak. The latter is highly stable and crusty old farts >> like me still remember a large portion of the complex emacs >> keystroke catalogue. Orca does a not bad job in a few high profile >> programs but, because few developers are coding to the gnome >> standard and, therefore, few programs support the excellent gnome >> accessibility API, orca gets a lot less "for free" than Macintosh >> or Windows. >> >> For we who write programs or test systems on GNU/Linux platforms, >> it is pretty good as it has fully accessible tools fart in excess >> of anything Mac or Windows offer. For most others who need orca, >> though, it is a bit clunky and often unstable. >> >> I'd love to suggest that we all walk away from the world of >> proprietary software but, developing for niche audiences like us >> blinks fails to meet the critical mass necessary to sustain a world >> of free software hackers like the server tools, Apache, etc. >> >> So, while we love to praise Apple and boo Microsoft, they are >> really the only alternatives for blinks who don't want to spend a >> whole lot of time fixing their environment. >> >> cdh >> >> >> >> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: As unreliable as Windows
Justin, what you finding different about finder and itunes? maybe I'm missing something here. once I played around with some of the settings in VO, everything worked great, if not better. On Aug 30, 2009, at 7:24 AM, Justin Harford wrote: > > I found it went faster, about 30 mins, when I did a clean install. > > It's sort of more accessible. I mean they improved the internet quite > a lot. But I would argue that finder and iTunes were more better > integrated with voiceover under leopard. They really let cursor > tracking get all mucked up. > > Oh well, I was more prepared for this transfering from leopard to snow > leopard than I was going from tiger to leopard. It's just that things > change when apple does upgrades. I guess there are things that get > added like braille that make the system ultimately a step forward, but > then they go and break things that worked really well in the prior > system which leaves one wondering if it is really a step forward. I > guess ultimately it might be a step forward. I like the new antonio > voice in the castellian spanish package from acapela. > > Regards > Justin Harford > On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote: > >> >> I found that around 42 percent, it really sped up quite a bit. >> Probably the first part copies a bunch of temporary files and then it >> does the actual install. One thing's for sure, it's more accessible >> than any windows install has ever been. >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Rich Ring wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> Well, one thing about the Mac is about as reliable as Windows. >>> I am currently doing a clean install of SL on my brand new Mac >>> Mini. About >>> twenty minutes ago, I was advised that the install was 19.8 per cent >>> complete, and that the time remaining was 29 minutes. Now, I'm told >>> that >>> the install is at 55 per cent and the time remaining is 28 minutes. >>> Go >>> figure! >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: the doc, interesting change in sl
Nope, arrow keys are completely out to get to these menus. On Aug 30, 2009, at 8:48 AM, James & Nash wrote: > > Thanks for that tip Marie. Can you also use up arrow as in Leopard and > Tiger? > - Original Message - > From: "Marie Howarth" > Cc: ; > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 3:02 AM > Subject: the doc, interesting change in sl > > >> >> in the doc, instead of just being able to arrow down to see >> applications options, such as keep in doc, open at log in, you are no >> longer able to arrow. now use the contextual menu, vo--shift--m to >> get >> to these mini doc menus. >> hth >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Baby Steps with the White Cat and, Mark Has A Question
Hello Mark, You wrote: > > I have a question about Safari: > > Is there a way to maximize the size of the Safari Windows so that it > takes > up more of the Desktop than it does when it is supposed to be sizable? > Currently, regardless of whether I select the Zoom button, I cannot > get the > Safari Windows to fill most of the display screen. I haven't yet upgraded to Snow Leopard, but for any application window you should be able to navigate to the Zoom button and use Control- Option-Space to expand the window to match your display. In the case of Safari, it may be that it does not expand the window beyond what is required to remove the horizontal scroll bar. If you wish to expand beyond that, it is possible to manually move and resize windows, and this is described in the Appendix (page 108) of the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide for Leopard (PDF file). To manually resize windows with VoiceOver: 1. Press Control-Option-Tilde, where the "Tilde" key is the shifted key to the left of the number "1" and just below the escape key at the left side of your keyboard. (That is, you're holding down four keys: Control, Option, Shift, and the (Grave) Accent key). You should hear VoiceOver say "Resize window". 2. Then use the arrow keys to make the window taller, shorter, wider, or narrower. Use Shift with the arrow keys to resize in smaller increments. 3. Press Escape to stop resizing the window. To move windows with VoiceOver: 1. Press Control-Option-(Grave) Accent (the same sequence as above, with no Shift key) 2. Then use the arrow keys to move the window. Use Shift with the arrow keys to move in smaller increments. 3. Press Escape to stop moving the window. There's an alternative setup with the "Zoom" option under the Universal Access menu that low vision users can use. I'm sure there is a spiffer way to do this with gestures, and I know you can use either the scroll wheel or enable a two-finger scroll on the trackpad to zoom without going through the Universal Access menu, but I set this up for someone a long time ago (smile). In these instructions, "VO" means hold down the VoiceOver Control and Option keys. 1. Go to System Preferences under the Apple menu (VO-M to the menu bar; arrow down, press "s y" to go to "System Preferences") and press Enter 2. In the System Preferences window, navigate (e.g., tab, use VO-right arrow, or bring up item chooser menu (VO-I) and press "u n i") to the Universal Access button an press (VO-Space). 3. In the Universal Access window, VO-Right to the "Seeing" tab and select it (with VO-Space) if it is not already selected. 4. Navigate (VO-Right Arrow) to the "Zoom" radio button and use VO- Space to turn on zoom. 5. Navigate to the "Options" button and press (VO-Space). 6. Set the range for maximum and minimum zoom (up to factor of 20) by interacting with each slider and using your arrow keys. This is the default zoom applied when your press Command-Option-"=" to zoom in. Continuing to press or tap the "=" button while the Command and Option keys are held down increases the zoom. 7. I set up these options with "Smooth images" checked and "When zoomed in, the screen image moves" "only when the pointer reaches an edge" for someone who only wanted a mild zoom. There are other options you can check, such as having zoom follow the keyboard focus. You can also activate a scroll wheel on a mouse. Press enter, or navigate to the "Done" button and use VO-Space to commit selections. 8. On the Universal Access menu, check the boxes the enable assistive devices and to show universal access status in the menu bar. (The latter is not needed, but I use it to check whether zoom is on or whether other features, such as mouse keys -- sometimes used to move to locations where VoiceOver does not have a "hook" -- is enabled.) 9. Use Command-W to close the window when done. Now with the zoom feature enabled, you can use Command-Option-"=" to zoom in and Command-Option-"-" to zoom out around focused regions. Turn zoom on or off with Command-Option-8. HTH. Great progress, and let us know if you have more questions. I enjoy reading all your posts on the VIPhone list. Cheers, Esther --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
is it possible to cut files?
Hello, going to boot my mac later today again, is it possible to not just copy files but cut them or script this? Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
muting voice with a key?
Hello, mostly i just use braille but sometimes when navigating an application its easier to have speech assist me, but is there a keystroke i can use to mute/unmute speech? Thanks, Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: is it possible to cut files?
Le 30 août 2009 à 20:45, a radix a écrit : > Hello, going to boot my mac later today again, is it possible to not > just copy files but cut them or script this? My understanding is that when you copy a file, OSX does not put the file in memory but only its location, so that when you paste the file, it fetches the file from its location and copies it to the paste location. That seems to be the reason why you can't cut a file: if the file is removed then there is nothing to fetch for the later copy. The Finder equivalent of "cut" would be "move", with the mouse. Jean-Christophe Helary --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: muting voice with a key?
Hi Anou, Press Control to mute speech. best, Anna --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
here here! but they seem to play into the way of thinking that Vi's need to have a product specifically designed. sure a screen reader should do what jaws and window eyes does on that platform, read the contents of the screen and allow the user to interact succesfully. However, it is making me giggle somewhat of how many people are defending their windows screen readers as much as they are. do you guys honestly tell me that jaws never freezes, you don't have to use the jaws cursor in order to interact with some things. I think a lot of you have me wrong, I only switched last year, I very much remember the transition, but I forced myself to forget I was using windows and took the mac on face value. This, is what I believe helped me to transition very easily. I understand some may have to use windows for work or certain other tasks, but someone earlier commented windows has made strides in regards to accessibility, really? you consider narrator a stride after, what is it now, three versions of the OS? I think windows have done the bear minimum and if you want to use windows, no one is saying you shouldn't or it is wrong, cool, keep with it to your heart's content, but at least be honest about the down falls. I'm not stating mac and vo are perfect, and even though I personally don't like these features, I am grateful to apple to not force them upon me. I just find it sad that some people can't let go of their windows experience and learn the mac for what it is, it's own OS. constant comparison of the two is definitely frustrating as I see them as two different entities. one piece of advice I took from a switchers guide on lioncourt.com was forget you ever used a windows computer and screen reader. that is why I am frustrated. not because I see windows as the "dark side" my opinion on that is irrelevant here as it is a vo list, I merely stated my frustration and opinion. and to those nubis, if you need to use windows alongside, go ahead, but take five minutes or more to clear your head of that OS and treat the mac as a new territory. keep harping back to well I did it on windows this way will desperately lead you to frustration and just learn the kitty as if you'd never used a computer before. Seriously, so many need to heed on that great advice. and sorry to upset you windows people, but hey, I may hate marmite, you may love it, it's what makes the world what it is. On Aug 30, 2009, at 10:42 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > > What would be nice is if the windows-based screen readers just had > done it right from the beginning and we wouldn't be having this > discussion. :) > On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Woody Anna Dresner wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> >> I'm pretty much used to editing on a Mac now, but I'll have to say >> I'm >> glad there's the option to edit the way you do in Windows. I write >> books that have to be structured with headings and lists and such so >> they can be converted to DAISY. This means I have to write them in >> Word. This means that up until now, I've had to edit part of the time >> the Windows way and part of the time the Mac way. this can be really >> irritating after a while; I end up making silly mistakes because I'm >> having to switch back and forth all the time. So I will probably set >> VO to edit the Windows way, so I don't have to think about which >> operating system I'm using at the moment and can think about what I'm >> writing, not how to edit it. I realize that if I were sighted, >> editing >> would resemble the mac way more than the Windows way, but if I were >> sighted, editing would be the same for me regardless of the operating >> system. Being able to edit in both operating systems the same way >> will >> make my experience more similar to what a sighted person experiences, >> even if the method of editing is different. >> >> Best, >> Anna >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: muting voice with a key?
Hi, yes but i actually meant like permanent, i think control only mutes till you move the cursor, i will try it though (still doing mail on the windows machine till i have time to read the switching to apple book). Greetings, Anouk, - Original Message - From: "Woody Anna Dresner" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 1:58 PM Subject: Re: muting voice with a key? > > Hi Anou, > > Press Control to mute speech. > > best, > Anna > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: 3 features that hmm?
ire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled >>>>>>> email from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to >>>>>>> their applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the >>>>>>> difference between what works and what doesn't, it gives them >>>>>>> instructions equally as precise as that email from the VI user >>>>>>> would in most cases. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get >> this >>>>>>> one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason >>>>>>> the option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that doesn't >>>>>>> in >> any >>>>>>> way >>>>>>> need to be modified, purely because of some VI people's rut that >>>>>>> they're firmly jammed into. To add weight to a big sweeping >>>>>>> oppinion like that, I should say that I was raised on Windows, >>>>>>> still use Windows more often than many on here I expect, and I >>>>>>> make my fair share of mistakes editing in Mac OS if I haven't >>>>>>> done any in a while. >>>>>>> I don't see this option as the solution, I see it as cheating. >>>>>>> I doubt that many people will see this as an option to ease >>>>>>> their progression into Mac OS as one of the other Scott's >>>>>>> suggested, human's just don't work that way, for the most part >>>>>>> we're creatures of >>>> habit >>>>>>> even if they're bad ones. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Tricky one though isn't it. Emailing Apple and asking that a >>>>>>> feature be removed seems somehow wrong in my mind. In any case, >>>>>>> I'm not sure they'd get it. I just tried to explain why I >>>>>>> disagree with the feature and what's potentially at stake here >>>>>>> to a sighted mac user, and she point blank didn't get it. I'm >>>>>>> not sure that anyone who hasn't had to appreciate how cool >>>>>>> mainstream technology that >> works >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> us out of the box would, even Apple themselves might not, they >>>>>>> probably see the introduction of this feature as the best thing >>>> they >>>>>>> could've done to silence a lot of whinging lol. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my 2 cents, or perhaps pennies worth for those on this side >>>>>>> of the pond... >>>>>>> Scott >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 8/29/09, Scott Howell wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Well good for you, I'm glad you did not need these features and >>>> you >>>>>>>> learned the way we all started out. However, of course the >>>>>>>> only plus side is that for those who want to make the >>>>>>>> transition and >> really >>>>>>>> find >>>>>>>> what we "grew up with" difficult, will at least have a way to >>>>>>>> ease their transition over from the dark side. :) So, I agree >>>>>>>> with >>>> you, >>>>>>>> but these are small prices to pay if it will truly help someone >>>>>>>> make the transition. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> well, this is purely my opinion but 3 features that horribly >>>>>>>>> remind me of windows are as follows. >>>>>>>>> 1. automatic reading of a webpage. >>>>>>>>> 2. voice over hints. I know what to do in a text area, >>>>>>>>> especially when it already says edit text. >>>>>>>>> 3. insertion point. this has been discussed, it's counter >>>>>>>>> intuitive and doesn't teach the vi community how it would look >>>>>>>>> to sighties. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> all I can say is I'm so glad these features are optional. they >>>> are >>>>>>>>> just horrific and no one can tell me that it will help >>>> progression >>>>>>>>> from windows to mac. I didn't have these features and I am so >>>>>>>>> glad I did. mac is not windows, when will people realise this. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> overall vo rocks even more in this version, and I am grateful >> to >>>>>>>>> apple >>>>>>>>> for giving us a choice. really glad. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >>>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >>> >>> >>>> >> >> >>> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >> 08/29/09 17:51:00 > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4381 (20090830) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4381 (20090830) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4381 (20090830) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
Yes, I also made a concious descision not to use Windows when I switched to the Mac. I think this really helped. I've met so many people who came to the Mac with the mindset that it would and should behave like what they were used to. It was very dificult to get them to see things differently. Take care James - Original Message - From: "Marie Howarth" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 12:06 PM Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > here here! but they seem to play into the way of thinking that Vi's > need to have a product specifically designed. sure a screen reader > should do what jaws and window eyes does on that platform, read the > contents of the screen and allow the user to interact succesfully. > However, it is making me giggle somewhat of how many people are > defending their windows screen readers as much as they are. do you > guys honestly tell me that jaws never freezes, you don't have to use > the jaws cursor in order to interact with some things. I think a lot > of you have me wrong, I only switched last year, I very much remember > the transition, but I forced myself to forget I was using windows and > took the mac on face value. This, is what I believe helped me to > transition very easily. I understand some may have to use windows for > work or certain other tasks, but someone earlier commented windows has > made strides in regards to accessibility, really? you consider > narrator a stride after, what is it now, three versions of the OS? I > think windows have done the bear minimum and if you want to use > windows, no one is saying you shouldn't or it is wrong, cool, keep > with it to your heart's content, but at least be honest about the down > falls. I'm not stating mac and vo are perfect, and even though I > personally don't like these features, I am grateful to apple to not > force them upon me. I just find it sad that some people can't let go > of their windows experience and learn the mac for what it is, it's own > OS. constant comparison of the two is definitely frustrating as I see > them as two different entities. one piece of advice I took from a > switchers guide on lioncourt.com was forget you ever used a windows > computer and screen reader. that is why I am frustrated. not because I > see windows as the "dark side" my opinion on that is irrelevant here > as it is a vo list, I merely stated my frustration and opinion. and to > those nubis, if you need to use windows alongside, go ahead, but take > five minutes or more to clear your head of that OS and treat the mac > as a new territory. keep harping back to well I did it on windows this > way will desperately lead you to frustration and just learn the kitty > as if you'd never used a computer before. Seriously, so many need to > heed on that great advice. and sorry to upset you windows people, but > hey, I may hate marmite, you may love it, it's what makes the world > what it is. > > On Aug 30, 2009, at 10:42 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> >> What would be nice is if the windows-based screen readers just had >> done it right from the beginning and we wouldn't be having this >> discussion. :) >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Woody Anna Dresner wrote: >> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I'm pretty much used to editing on a Mac now, but I'll have to say >>> I'm >>> glad there's the option to edit the way you do in Windows. I write >>> books that have to be structured with headings and lists and such so >>> they can be converted to DAISY. This means I have to write them in >>> Word. This means that up until now, I've had to edit part of the time >>> the Windows way and part of the time the Mac way. this can be really >>> irritating after a while; I end up making silly mistakes because I'm >>> having to switch back and forth all the time. So I will probably set >>> VO to edit the Windows way, so I don't have to think about which >>> operating system I'm using at the moment and can think about what I'm >>> writing, not how to edit it. I realize that if I were sighted, >>> editing >>> would resemble the mac way more than the Windows way, but if I were >>> sighted, editing would be the same for me regardless of the operating >>> system. Being able to edit in both operating systems the same way >>> will >>> make my experience more similar to what a sighted person experiences, >>> even if the method of editing is different. >>> >>> Best, >>> Anna >>> >>> >> >> >> > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
>> someone somewhere will find it useful. You could argue that the >>>>>>>> reading webpages automatically is as close as Apple could get to >>> a >>>>>>>> sighted person glancing at the screen when the page comes up and >>>>>>>> taking in the bigger picture, which we can't do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Voiceover hints are definitely useful and a good thing. Context >>>>>>>> sensitive help like that enables most people to be on a way >>>>>>>> shorter learning curve usually than reading a whole manual and >>>>>>>> trying to apply things to a ton of situations at once. It's >>>>>>>> annoying that >>> they're >>>>>>>> enabled by default for you or I perhaps, but newbies are going >>>>>>>> to thank Apple for it no doubt. Come to that, so will >>>>>>>> developers >>> who >>>>>>>> fire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled >>>>>>>> email from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to >>>>>>>> their applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the >>>>>>>> difference between what works and what doesn't, it gives them >>>>>>>> instructions equally as precise as that email from the VI user >>>>>>>> would in most cases. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get >>> this >>>>>>>> one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason >>>>>>>> the option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that doesn't >>>>>>>> in >>> any >>>>>>>> way >>>>>>>> need to be modified, purely because of some VI people's rut that >>>>>>>> they're firmly jammed into. To add weight to a big sweeping >>>>>>>> oppinion like that, I should say that I was raised on Windows, >>>>>>>> still use Windows more often than many on here I expect, and I >>>>>>>> make my fair share of mistakes editing in Mac OS if I haven't >>>>>>>> done any in a while. >>>>>>>> I don't see this option as the solution, I see it as cheating. >>>>>>>> I doubt that many people will see this as an option to ease >>>>>>>> their progression into Mac OS as one of the other Scott's >>>>>>>> suggested, human's just don't work that way, for the most part >>>>>>>> we're creatures of >>>>> habit >>>>>>>> even if they're bad ones. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Tricky one though isn't it. Emailing Apple and asking that a >>>>>>>> feature be removed seems somehow wrong in my mind. In any case, >>>>>>>> I'm not sure they'd get it. I just tried to explain why I >>>>>>>> disagree with the feature and what's potentially at stake here >>>>>>>> to a sighted mac user, and she point blank didn't get it. I'm >>>>>>>> not sure that anyone who hasn't had to appreciate how cool >>>>>>>> mainstream technology that >>> works >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> us out of the box would, even Apple themselves might not, they >>>>>>>> probably see the introduction of this feature as the best thing >>>>> they >>>>>>>> could've done to silence a lot of whinging lol. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just my 2 cents, or perhaps pennies worth for those on this side >>>>>>>> of the pond... >>>>>>>> Scott >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 8/29/09, Scott Howell wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Well good for you, I'm glad you did not need these features and >>>>> you >>>>>>>>> learned the way we all started out. However, of course the >>>>>>>>> only plus side is that for those who want to make the >>>>>>>>> transition and >>> really >>>>>>>>> find >>>>>>>>> what we "grew up with" difficult, will at least have a way to >>>>>>>>> ease their transition over from the dark side. :) So, I agree >>>>>>>>> with >>>>> you, >>>>>>>>> but these are small prices to pay if it will truly help someone >>>>>>>>> make the transition. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> well, this is purely my opinion but 3 features that horribly >>>>>>>>>> remind me of windows are as follows. >>>>>>>>>> 1. automatic reading of a webpage. >>>>>>>>>> 2. voice over hints. I know what to do in a text area, >>>>>>>>>> especially when it already says edit text. >>>>>>>>>> 3. insertion point. this has been discussed, it's counter >>>>>>>>>> intuitive and doesn't teach the vi community how it would look >>>>>>>>>> to sighties. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> all I can say is I'm so glad these features are optional. they >>>>> are >>>>>>>>>> just horrific and no one can tell me that it will help >>>>> progression >>>>>>>>>> from windows to mac. I didn't have these features and I am so >>>>>>>>>> glad I did. mac is not windows, when will people realise this. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> overall vo rocks even more in this version, and I am grateful >>> to >>>>>>>>>> apple >>>>>>>>>> for giving us a choice. really glad. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >>>>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>> >>> >>>> >>> >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >> >> >> > > > > > > > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4381 (20090830) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4381 (20090830) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4381 (20090830) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
SL Install?
Hi All, I've now got my copy of SL. Will a simple upgrade allow me to install with out erasing all my data such as iLife and all my applications. Also all the data store on my HD? Any help would be appreciated. Many thanks, Mark --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: SL Install?
Le 30 août 2009 à 21:30, M AUSTEN a écrit : > Hi All, > I've now got my copy of SL. > Will a simple upgrade allow me to install with out erasing all my > data such as iLife and all my applications. Also all the data store > on my HD? It is always better to backup all your data and check that it can be restored in case any problem occurs, before upgrading the OS. But in any case, yes, the upgrade will not (is not supposed to) erase anything. You will even end up with more space on your disk since SL takes less space (I had 12gb left before SL, I had 24 after SL was installed). Jean-Christophe Helary --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: 3 features that hmm?
Oh, that's funny. That's pretty much the same reason I got my Mac this summer. My Windows desktop really needs to go to the computer happy hunting ground. I'd been interested in a Mac for a while, but hadn't moved on it because I already had a working computer. So when it became clear I was going to have to get a new machine, I figured it didn't make sense to buy a new Windows machine only to switch to a Mac a year later. So I just moved the time-frame up a bit. Now if we just had a decent OCR option on the Mac, I could let my windows machine go to its very well-deserved rest. Hope you got some sleep. Good to know I'm not the only insomniac on the list. :) Take care, Donna -Original Message- From: Maxwell Ivey Jr. Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 4:49 AM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? Hi donna; well said. I actually got my first mac because I couldn't figure out which windows computer to replace my last laptop with. We had read that the sound cards need to be a 32 bit if not 64 bit to run jaws and other windows features without a strain, and we couldn't find any off the shelf laptops where we could even find out what the sound cards were. And ordering a custom built one would have cost more money than i had to spend. Finally, my brother decided to help me buy a used ibook g4 to get my feet wet. Now, I'm apple all the way. I just wish we could get the flash player and the adobe reader accessible. At least the overdrive media console now has a mac version. I don't see me buying an iphone because I would have to switch cell phone providers, but I'm hopeful the next round of ipod touch will have speech. Then I'd get everything accept for th ephone as long as i was in range of a wifi signal. Should be asleep. take care, Max On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:26 AM, Donna Goodin wrote: > > I completely agree Max. Editing wasn't hard for me to learn, but > web browsing and getting used to where certain things are in the > system has been more of a challenge. And at least five times a day > I still press Enter instead of Command-O to open a file or launch an > app. And conversely, it's also gotten to the point where when I'm on > my Windows machine, I try and press Command-shift-D to send an email > message. I guess that's just the nature of moving back and forth > between two systems. I think the more choices we as blind users > have, the better, and I'd encourage anyone to just find the one that > is the best fit for them. > Take care, > Donna > > -Original Message- > From: Maxwell Ivey Jr. > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:44 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > Hi Donna; It could have just been me, but that is the point. there > are people out there who have been doing it one way for so long that > any change can be frustrating. I remember how many times i deleted > the wrong character or inserted a character in the wrong spot and had > to do it over. Now, I'm used to it. And the few times i use the > windows computer I have to remember things like pressing the spacebar > before entering text in a form field. Mac is the way to go. Just > wish we could convince the makers of adobe, flash, eudora, and others > that we can't currently use on the mac. Take care, Max > On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: > >> >> Well, I guess we all have our things. Ironically, the adjustment to >> editing >> text has been one of the easier parts of my adjustment to the Mac. >> *smile* >> Take care, >> Donna >>> -Original Message- >>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey >>> Jr. >>> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:16 PM >>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? >>> >>> >>> Thanks donna; only wish my transition from doss to windows had been >>> as easy. That was a real mind cramp sort of thing. Take care, Max >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:07 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: >>> Nice post, Max. Donna > -Original Message- > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Maxwell Ivey > Jr. > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 9:29 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > Hello; Just speaking for myself the hardest adjustment i had to >>> make > when moving to a mac was getting used to the way you have to edit > text. Now, that I understand it, it is second nature; but it > was a > real headache in the beginning. Another one that was a tough one > to > get my mind around was not having multiple windows in my > browser. I > finallly found out that you can have multiple finder and safari > windows you just cycle through them differently. It soun
Re: SL Install?
Many Thanks. Mark --- On Sun, 30/8/09, JC Helary wrote: From: JC Helary Subject: Re: SL Install? To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Date: Sunday, 30 August, 2009, 1:34 PM Le 30 août 2009 à 21:30, M AUSTEN a écrit : > Hi All, > I've now got my copy of SL. > Will a simple upgrade allow me to install with out erasing all my > data such as iLife and all my applications. Also all the data store > on my HD? It is always better to backup all your data and check that it can be restored in case any problem occurs, before upgrading the OS. But in any case, yes, the upgrade will not (is not supposed to) erase anything. You will even end up with more space on your disk since SL takes less space (I had 12gb left before SL, I had 24 after SL was installed). Jean-Christophe Helary --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: 3 features that hmm?
It wouldn't have been a priority for me, either. I just don't think it's the end of the world now that it's here. Donna -Original Message- From: Scott Howell Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 5:41 AM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? Hmmm, maybe I'm having issues in articulation. My point is and has been that I don't disagree the feature does more harm then good, because yes, it does hold one back from truly getting the concept of editing from the perspective of the majority; if that makes sense. Asking Apple to remove it at this point makes little sense is what I'm saying. I recall the debate and all the crap surrounding the issue of editing one way vs. the other. Personally I would not have wasted the code, but at the same time if it really proves to be beneficial then great. I'd hate to think someone would choose not to switch based on the issue of editing and so, since the feature is here, then great. Gee, I think this thread has generated nearly as much noise as the entire editing thread. Hey I see her point and I'm not disagreeing, just saying since it's here I hope someone will benefit if that is what is holding them up and yeah, this sure generated a lot of issues when it came up as a topic. Hell, I had trouble understanding this initially and now when I do use windows-based screen reader, I have to work hard at remembering the old way of editing. :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: As unreliable as Windows
Amen to that. I was just commenting on the fact that the time and percentage were weird just like Windows. I mean, I can install it by myself. that's great. - Original Message - From: "Mike Arrigo" To: Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 11:18 PM Subject: Re: As unreliable as Windows I found that around 42 percent, it really sped up quite a bit. Probably the first part copies a bunch of temporary files and then it does the actual install. One thing's for sure, it's more accessible than any windows install has ever been. On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Rich Ring wrote: > > > Well, one thing about the Mac is about as reliable as Windows. > I am currently doing a clean install of SL on my brand new Mac > Mini. About > twenty minutes ago, I was advised that the install was 19.8 per cent > complete, and that the time remaining was 29 minutes. Now, I'm told > that > the install is at 55 per cent and the time remaining is 28 minutes. > Go > figure! > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
going up a folder
Hello everyone, is it possible in fidner to go back a folder like you can do with backspace in windows? I dont have it set so that a fodler opens in a new window. Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: 3 features that hmm?
Hey Scott, Joking is always good. :) And sometimes Windows deserves your jabs. And I'm totally with you about the paycheck! *grin* But in the six weeks I've had my Mac, I can't count how many off-list exchanges I've had with people who felt put off or uncomfortable by the way many Mac users disdain Windows, and Windows users. I personally received a pretty ugly message from someone on another list. I talked to enough people who felt this way that for a while I actually considered starting a new Mac list, specifically for those transitioning from Windows and JAWS or Window-Eyes. It's natural and even appropriate to take what you know from previous experiences and apply that knowledge to hnhew ones, even if we're not deliberately trying to do that. If you learn a foreign language, for example, you're initially going to apply the strategies and concepts from your first language, even though you know intellectually that the phonetics, the orthography, and the syntax are different. Of course, if you're going to be successful, you need to move beyond that stage, and that is the goal. But that linguistic interference is well-documented, and is anticipated by people like me who teach language. Likewise, it's impossible to approach a new computer system without having some expectations or hold-over behaviors from your prior computer experience. The eventual goal is to be able to work comfortably with the Mac on its own, but it can take a while to get to that stage. I think the old addage that you can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar definitely applies here. The Mac has a lot to offer, and it would be a shame for folks not to choose it because they think they'll get slammed. Anyway, I'll stop my rant. :) this topic has probably already gotten more attention than it should have. Take care, Donna -Original Message- From: Scott Howell Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 5:46 AM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? Well stated Donna and all my jabs at windows really is more poking fun, but I still can't stand windows and glad to have a choice. I use windows at work and that is what we have, but luckily there is even there a choice. I personally don't care what you use as long as your productive. After all, no one os earns you a paycheck and quite frankly I'll learn to use a pencil and paper if that is what earns me a paycheck, so I can go buy a Mac. :) Couldn't let that slide by. :) On Aug 29, 2009, at 11:06 PM, Donna Goodin wrote: > > Hello all, > > I have to support Rich here. The attitude displayed by many Mac users > toward Windows, and toward Windows users who are doing their best to > learn > the Mac OS is frankly despicable. Many mac users--definitely not > all--are > nothing more than a bunch of narrow-minded snobs. Windows is not > "the dark > side". It is a viable choice, perhaps a better choice for some > people. > JAWS and Windows worked very well for me for nearly 20 years. I am > only > here because I want to support Apple's efforts, not because I believe > Windows or JAWS to be the devil incarnate. Yes, editing is different. > Those who prefer editing in Windows are not wrong, they just prefer > something different. They are entitled to that preference, just as > all on > this list are entitled to their preference for the Mac. If Apple > implements > some choices to facilitate transition from Windows, there's nothing > wrong > with that. No one has to use it unless they want to. > > Personally, I think it's great that there are multiple alternatives > now > available for blind users. Yes, what Apple has done for > accessibility is > tremendous. That said, I just applied for a job at a place where they > pretty much come out and tell you that if you choose to use a Mac, > you won't > be able to utilize all of their materials. So, if I get that > position, I'll > be using Windows for all things work-related. I therefore hope that > Windows > continues to be a viable option for blind users. The best possible > scenario > for us is to have as many options as possible, so that each of us > can decide > which is the best fit for us and for our immediate needs. The Mac > has many > things to recommend it. But you all who choose to use it, are in no > way > superior to anyone else, and you have no right to disdain others who > either > choose the Windows option, or are willing to point out the Mac's > weaknesses. > And yes, the Mac does have very definite weaknesses, as does Windows. > > Why can't we all just be supportive and respectful of one another? > I think > the thing I find saddest about this whole movement toward the Mac, > is the > way it seems to polarize everyone. Let's just support each > person's right > to find what works best for them and be happy about that. > > Donna >> -Original Message- >> From: macvisionaries@googleg
itunes newbie
Hello everyone, Is there maybe a tutorial or podcast about learning itunes? I am new to it and although i can import stuff into the library i now wonder how i can play that whole library in shuffle mode, so not just the last added files. Also, what does itunes do with my files, does it only copy them or also convert them to another format? They were mp3-files. Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: going up a folder
Le 30 août 2009 à 22:27, a radix a écrit : > Hello everyone, is it possible in fidner to go back a folder like > you can do with backspace in windows? I dont have it set so that a > fodler opens in a new window. This is usually command + up arrow. Jean-Christophe Helary --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: ejecting a cd
Yes, patience is good as you learn a new operating system. Yes, command e will do the trick. On Aug 30, 2009, at 12:47 AM, Les Kriegler wrote: > > Hi Mike, > > I thought in your podcast, you used the keystroke command-E to eject > a CD? > Your podcasts were definitely a major factor in my taking the plunge > into > the Mac world. I'm encouraged by what you and others have written. > I just > have to remember the word "patience" as I go through the learning > curve. > Hope it's not too steep. > > Les > > -Original Message- > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mike Arrigo > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 12:20 AM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: ejecting a cd > > > Ok, I had the same thing, press command comma to open the finder > preferences. Now navigate to the right and you will see some check > boxes for > what to show on the desktop, check the option for hard disks. > On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Rich Ring wrote: > >> >> >> >> How do you eject a cd? >> In my finder window, the only volume I see is my Leopard install cd. >> I have Voiceover, but I cannot see my hard drive. >> >> >>> > > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4380 (20090829) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4380 (20090829) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4380 (20090829) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: I've Entered MacLand
If you don't have a monitor, that could cause problems. For some reason, and I'm not sure why, it wants a monitor connected, or some programs will be very slow. There is a work around though, apple sells an adapter, it allows you to connect the mac's DVI port to a TV, if you connect that adapter, it will solve the problem. I bought one of these for times when I take my mac mini to other places. On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:17 AM, Chris G wrote: > > Hi, > > I find it slow at surfing the web and I don't know why. > > I even reinstalled with a full erase. > Safari is the only program that's slow for me. > Not running a monitor on my Mac mini, but this is how I did it in > leopard. > > Weird. > > > > On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 15:26:43 -0500 > Mike Arrigo wrote: > >> >> Hey, that's cool Rich, hope you get one. I'm typing this message in >> the new snow leopard, the improvements in voiceover are great, and no >> sighted help needed to install. and it's incredible when cruising the >> web >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Rich Ring wrote: >> >>> >>> Good luck to you. I may be purchasing one today. >>> - Original Message - >>> From: "Les Kriegler" >>> To: >>> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 12:16 AM >>> Subject: I've Entered MacLand >>> >>> >>> >>> I've purchased our first Apple System since 1985 when we bought an >>> Apple 2E. >>> How's that for dating myself? It's a MacBook Pro and it should >>> arrive >>> within the week. I was informed that Snow Leopard may be installed, >>> but if >>> not, I'll receive the installation package. Very much looking >>> forward to >>> some hands-on experience and using VoiceOver! >>> >>> Les >>> >>> >>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4378 (20090828) __ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > -- > Chris G > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Just got a Mac Mini
Cool, I'm loving mine, just about have everything working great, one or two more things to reinstall, the new voice over features, especially on the web are awesome. On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:29 AM, Donna Goodin wrote: > > Hey Mike, > > Thanks for posting these instructions. It does soun like an easy > straight-forward process. And, I just received email notification > that my copy of SL has shipped! Yay! I'm looking forward to > checking it out! > Best, > Donna > > -Original Message- > From: Mike Arrigo > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 12:11 AM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: Just got a Mac Mini > > > Hey Rich, that's awesome that you got a mac, you're going to love it. > Insert the DVD, then hold the c key to boot it up. Hold the command > key and press F5 to start voice over, and the first thing you will > need to do is choose the language for the install. Select continue, > you can then go to the menu bar, and choose utilities. Select disk > utility and this will allow you to erase your hard drive so you can do > a clean install. And it's all completely accessible. Let me know if > you need any more help. > On Aug 29, 2009, at 5:57 PM, Rich Ring wrote: > >> Hello all you helpful wonderful veteran Mac users! >> Just got back from the Apple store with a Mac Mini. I've been told >> by many that if I fire it up I will hear a spoken message telling me >> how to get Voiceover running. Is this true? >> Second, we have SL, and we will need to install it. My thought was >> that since this is a brand new machine, I might as well do a clean >> upgrade. Should I just put the SL DVD in the drive press C and >> eventually press command f5 and do the upgrade, or do I have to set >> up the Mac first. >> I know, stupid questions, but if you don't ask, you don't know. >> Any help would be greatly appreciated. >> >> >>> > > > > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Baby Steps with the White Cat and, Mark Has A Question
Hey mark, I would say you're off to a great start. And feel free to write each day about your experiences, sounds like the mac is working well for you. Yes, voice over has a way to resize a window. Press control option shift accent, or I guess you could also say press control option tilda. You will now have 2 options, to resize how wide and how tall the window is. Press enter on the first option, and then press and hold the right arrow key for a few seconds. Press escape to leave this mode, then repeat the process, and this time choose to resize how tall the window is. Press and hold the down arrow key for a few seconds. That should make the window fill the screen. On Aug 30, 2009, at 4:23 AM, M. Taylor wrote: > > Hello Everyone, > > Well, I took a few baby steps today. Not as many as I had hoped but > enough > to make me even more glad I decided to take a walk with the white cat. > > 1. > I customized my desktop and setup Safari to launch on my preferred > home > page. > > 2. > I setup and configured iTunes so that it and my Windows computers > are all > now sharing the same media library. > > 3. > I configured the startup setting options and created some new > accounts and > configured some network workgroups. > > 4. > I setup my Verizon Wireless Air card so that I can have access to > the Net > when I'm out and about. Yes, this was the first third-party app I've > installed on my Mac. It went well, a little confusing but I suspect > that > had more to do with Verizon Wireless than the Mac OS. > > 5. > I ran the Boot Camp utility and installed Windows 7. I only used 32 > gigs > for Windows 7 as I do not intend to use this machine as a Windows > computer > until I gain much, much more experience using the Mac OS. I > installed it > for the experience of doing so and so I may assist others in the > future. I > was impressed that the Snow Leopard 10.6 DVD came with all of the > correct > drivers for Windows 7 thus, all of the hardware works correctly. > This Mac > is a beautiful thing. > > I promise I will not write everyday telling of my progress but I > just wanted > to share that I have begun taking baby steps with the Mac and so far > it's a > great experience. > > One thing is for certain, for iPhone 3GS users, the Mac OS is a > must. In > fact, Windows, even my beloved Windows 7 is already beginning to > pale in > comparison to Snow Leopard. If someone had told me two weeks ago I > would be > this enamored with the Mac, I would have thought him crazy but, as the > saying goes, "Never say Never." > > Even in this short time, I feel quite at home using the iPhone 3GS > VoiceOver > gestures on the MacBook track pad. > > I have a question about Safari: > > Is there a way to maximize the size of the Safari Windows so that it > takes > up more of the Desktop than it does when it is supposed to be sizable? > Currently, regardless of whether I select the Zoom button, I cannot > get the > Safari Windows to fill most of the display screen. > > Any tips on this will be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you, > > Mark > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Services gone
Hi there. Ok here's a strange thing that i can't seem to do anything about now. It looks that if i go into the applications menu on my mac and go into the "services" menu, VO informs me that no services are available, although there should be. There's a settings command and choosing it takes me to the keyboard shortcuts panel of the system settings, but i don't want to define keyboard shortcuts, all i want is to enable services if such beast of a command exists, and otherwise i want to know what gives and if i can do something about it. Oh, and when i try enabling the services i want, which i have to do one by one, i get an error that the command already is taken by another program. Now i'm confused again. /Krister --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Services gone
Le 30 août 2009 à 23:38, Krister Ekstrom a écrit : > It looks that if i go into the applications menu on my mac and go into > the "services" menu, VO informs me that no services are available, > although there should be. It looks as if the services available in the application menu depend on the context. If there is no "context" a service can use then that service won't be available. For ex, the services available if you select a string are different from those when you select a file. If nothing is selected then no services are available. > There's a settings command and choosing it > takes me to the keyboard shortcuts panel of the system settings, but i > don't want to define keyboard shortcuts, all i want is to enable > services if such beast of a command exists, and otherwise i want to > know what gives and if i can do something about it. You should select something on which to apply a service. > Oh, and when i try enabling the services i want, which i have to do > one by one, i get an error that the command already is taken by > another program. Now i'm confused again. I think it is safe to use the defaults. Jean-Christophe Helary --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: I've Entered MacLand
Hi, It's interesting why it wasn't an issue for me until I upgraded to SL. I'll take your advice, right now I have the cable attached that connects to a VGA port but that isn't doing the trick. On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 09:23:38 -0500 Mike Arrigo wrote: > > If you don't have a monitor, that could cause problems. For some > reason, and I'm not sure why, it wants a monitor connected, or some > programs will be very slow. There is a work around though, apple sells > an adapter, it allows you to connect the mac's DVI port to a TV, if > you connect that adapter, it will solve the problem. I bought one of > these for times when I take my mac mini to other places. > On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:17 AM, Chris G wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > I find it slow at surfing the web and I don't know why. > > > > I even reinstalled with a full erase. > > Safari is the only program that's slow for me. > > Not running a monitor on my Mac mini, but this is how I did it in > > leopard. > > > > Weird. > > > > > > > > On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 15:26:43 -0500 > > Mike Arrigo wrote: > > > >> > >> Hey, that's cool Rich, hope you get one. I'm typing this message in > >> the new snow leopard, the improvements in voiceover are great, and no > >> sighted help needed to install. and it's incredible when cruising the > >> web > >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Rich Ring wrote: > >> > >>> > >>> Good luck to you. I may be purchasing one today. > >>> - Original Message - > >>> From: "Les Kriegler" > >>> To: > >>> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 12:16 AM > >>> Subject: I've Entered MacLand > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> I've purchased our first Apple System since 1985 when we bought an > >>> Apple 2E. > >>> How's that for dating myself? It's a MacBook Pro and it should > >>> arrive > >>> within the week. I was informed that Snow Leopard may be installed, > >>> but if > >>> not, I'll receive the installation package. Very much looking > >>> forward to > >>> some hands-on experience and using VoiceOver! > >>> > >>> Les > >>> > >>> > >>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > >>> signature > >>> database 4378 (20090828) __ > >>> > >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>> > >>> http://www.eset.com > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > > >> > >> > >> > > > > -- > > Chris G > > > > > > > > > > -- Chris G --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Baby Steps with the White Cat and, Mark Has A Question
Mark, Probably off topic, but what are you using the Network groups for? I havn't spent much time configuring macs for use on a shared network, but since I am going to buy a large disk drive soon, and have intentions of allowing family to float from computer to computer without losing their documents, and the ability to share files as appropriate. (Music libraries perhaps without iTunes sharing. I decided to ask. Jon On Aug 30, 2009, at 5:23 AM, M. Taylor wrote: > > Hello Everyone, > > Well, I took a few baby steps today. Not as many as I had hoped but > enough > to make me even more glad I decided to take a walk with the white cat. > > 1. > I customized my desktop and setup Safari to launch on my preferred > home > page. > > 2. > I setup and configured iTunes so that it and my Windows computers > are all > now sharing the same media library. > > 3. > I configured the startup setting options and created some new > accounts and > configured some network workgroups. > > 4. > I setup my Verizon Wireless Air card so that I can have access to > the Net > when I'm out and about. Yes, this was the first third-party app I've > installed on my Mac. It went well, a little confusing but I suspect > that > had more to do with Verizon Wireless than the Mac OS. > > 5. > I ran the Boot Camp utility and installed Windows 7. I only used 32 > gigs > for Windows 7 as I do not intend to use this machine as a Windows > computer > until I gain much, much more experience using the Mac OS. I > installed it > for the experience of doing so and so I may assist others in the > future. I > was impressed that the Snow Leopard 10.6 DVD came with all of the > correct > drivers for Windows 7 thus, all of the hardware works correctly. > This Mac > is a beautiful thing. > > I promise I will not write everyday telling of my progress but I > just wanted > to share that I have begun taking baby steps with the Mac and so far > it's a > great experience. > > One thing is for certain, for iPhone 3GS users, the Mac OS is a > must. In > fact, Windows, even my beloved Windows 7 is already beginning to > pale in > comparison to Snow Leopard. If someone had told me two weeks ago I > would be > this enamored with the Mac, I would have thought him crazy but, as the > saying goes, "Never say Never." > > Even in this short time, I feel quite at home using the iPhone 3GS > VoiceOver > gestures on the MacBook track pad. > > I have a question about Safari: > > Is there a way to maximize the size of the Safari Windows so that it > takes > up more of the Desktop than it does when it is supposed to be sizable? > Currently, regardless of whether I select the Zoom button, I cannot > get the > Safari Windows to fill most of the display screen. > > Any tips on this will be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you, > > Mark > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: muting voice with a key?
Hello Anouk, You can create a Keyboard Commander command to toggle Mute Speech on and off. In VoiceOver Utility, select Commanders and select the Keyboard Commander pane. Click on Add and put in the shortcut you want, then choose Audio from the menus, and there you'll find Mute Speech. Cheers, Anne --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Services gone
Hi, Nope, this doesn't seem to be true, unless there's something completely a miss in my brains. An example: I tried to search for something on Google, which worked well under Leopard. Pressing cmd- shift-l yealded no result, no search dialog or anything and now when i'm in mail, you could expect that there would turn up any services, but no, no services are available a dimmed text informs me. Something is screwed up here or i'm too stupid to understand this new kitty. /Krister 30 aug 2009 kl. 16.51 skrev JC Helary: > > > Le 30 août 2009 à 23:38, Krister Ekstrom a écrit : > >> It looks that if i go into the applications menu on my mac and go >> into >> the "services" menu, VO informs me that no services are available, >> although there should be. > > It looks as if the services available in the application menu depend > on the context. If there is no "context" a service can use then that > service won't be available. For ex, the services available if you > select a string are different from those when you select a file. > > If nothing is selected then no services are available. > >> There's a settings command and choosing it >> takes me to the keyboard shortcuts panel of the system settings, >> but i >> don't want to define keyboard shortcuts, all i want is to enable >> services if such beast of a command exists, and otherwise i want to >> know what gives and if i can do something about it. > > You should select something on which to apply a service. > >> Oh, and when i try enabling the services i want, which i have to do >> one by one, i get an error that the command already is taken by >> another program. Now i'm confused again. > > I think it is safe to use the defaults. > > Jean-Christophe Helary > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Mike Arigo - Mac Podcast
Hi Mike, I know you've not long installed SL, but I'm very interested in hearing your podcast. Do you know when it will be up on BCT please? Thanks Take care james --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: I've Entered MacLand
I just tried it here, it does seem a bit slower. You will notice that when pages load in snow leopard, it will seem a bit slower at first, because voice over now does much more analysis of the pages. You might be able to speed things up too by turning off the announcement of the page summary when the page first loads. Once it's loaded though, it's much faster than 10.5 was I think. On Aug 30, 2009, at 9:58 AM, Chris G wrote: > > Hi, > > It's interesting why it wasn't an issue for me until I upgraded to SL. > > I'll take your advice, right now I have the cable attached that > connects > to a VGA port but that isn't doing the trick. > > > > On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 09:23:38 -0500 > Mike Arrigo wrote: > >> >> If you don't have a monitor, that could cause problems. For some >> reason, and I'm not sure why, it wants a monitor connected, or some >> programs will be very slow. There is a work around though, apple >> sells >> an adapter, it allows you to connect the mac's DVI port to a TV, if >> you connect that adapter, it will solve the problem. I bought one of >> these for times when I take my mac mini to other places. >> On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:17 AM, Chris G wrote: >> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I find it slow at surfing the web and I don't know why. >>> >>> I even reinstalled with a full erase. >>> Safari is the only program that's slow for me. >>> Not running a monitor on my Mac mini, but this is how I did it in >>> leopard. >>> >>> Weird. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 15:26:43 -0500 >>> Mike Arrigo wrote: >>> Hey, that's cool Rich, hope you get one. I'm typing this message in the new snow leopard, the improvements in voiceover are great, and no sighted help needed to install. and it's incredible when cruising the web On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Rich Ring wrote: > > Good luck to you. I may be purchasing one today. > - Original Message - > From: "Les Kriegler" > To: > Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 12:16 AM > Subject: I've Entered MacLand > > > > I've purchased our first Apple System since 1985 when we bought an > Apple 2E. > How's that for dating myself? It's a MacBook Pro and it should > arrive > within the week. I was informed that Snow Leopard may be > installed, > but if > not, I'll receive the installation package. Very much looking > forward to > some hands-on experience and using VoiceOver! > > Les > > > __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4378 (20090828) __ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > >> >>> >>> -- >>> Chris G >>> >>> >> >> >> > > -- > Chris G > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mike Arigo - Mac Podcast
I've uploaded it, so it should be there soon, the first 9 that I have done are already there. This one mainly focused on installing snow leopard, I also plan to do one on the new voice over features. On Aug 30, 2009, at 10:38 AM, James & Nash wrote: > > Hi Mike, > > I know you've not long installed SL, but I'm very interested in > hearing your > podcast. Do you know when it will be up on BCT please? > > Thanks > > Take care > > james > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
64 Bit Mode?
Hi everyone, I hope your morning/afternoon, or whatever time it is goes well. I noticed that Snow Leopard boots in 32 bit mode. I check the list of supported 64 bit Macs, and mine is surely on the list. Should I worry about booting into 64 bit mode? If so, how would you make it so that it boots into 64 bit mode every time, and not one that you would have to tell it too. Right now, the only way I know of to boot into 64 bit mode, is to start up, and hold 6 and 4 keys down. Take care. Fonzie --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: going up a folder
Hi. If you are using column mode, you can open folders by pressing the right arrow, and close folders by pressing the left arrow. If you are using one of the other modes, you can press command up arrow to close a folder. I find column mode most useful. Best regards: Søren Jensen Mail & MSN: s...@coolfortheblind.dk Website: http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/ On 30/08/2009, at 15.27, a radix wrote: > Hello everyone, is it possible in fidner to go back a folder like > you can do with backspace in windows? I dont have it set so that a > fodler opens in a new window. > Greetings, Anouk, > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Services gone
I never looked at services in mail before, but I just opened text edit and services are working fine for me there. and as I interacted with the email I'm writing, services comes up fine here too. when I wasn't interacting however, so vo wasn't really interacting with anything, services was dimmed. try interacting with something and see if that helps. you're not stupid, things are slightly different, as to be expected with our new kitty. soon we'll love it more than the last :) any help give me a yell :) On Aug 30, 2009, at 4:23 PM, Krister Ekstrom wrote: > > Hi, > Nope, this doesn't seem to be true, unless there's something > completely a miss in my brains. An example: I tried to search for > something on Google, which worked well under Leopard. Pressing cmd- > shift-l yealded no result, no search dialog or anything and now when > i'm in mail, you could expect that there would turn up any services, > but no, no services are available a dimmed text informs me. Something > is screwed up here or i'm too stupid to understand this new kitty. > /Krister > > 30 aug 2009 kl. 16.51 skrev JC Helary: > >> >> >> Le 30 août 2009 à 23:38, Krister Ekstrom a écrit : >> >>> It looks that if i go into the applications menu on my mac and go >>> into >>> the "services" menu, VO informs me that no services are available, >>> although there should be. >> >> It looks as if the services available in the application menu depend >> on the context. If there is no "context" a service can use then that >> service won't be available. For ex, the services available if you >> select a string are different from those when you select a file. >> >> If nothing is selected then no services are available. >> >>> There's a settings command and choosing it >>> takes me to the keyboard shortcuts panel of the system settings, >>> but i >>> don't want to define keyboard shortcuts, all i want is to enable >>> services if such beast of a command exists, and otherwise i want to >>> know what gives and if i can do something about it. >> >> You should select something on which to apply a service. >> >>> Oh, and when i try enabling the services i want, which i have to do >>> one by one, i get an error that the command already is taken by >>> another program. Now i'm confused again. >> >> I think it is safe to use the defaults. >> >> Jean-Christophe Helary >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: choppy reading in mail
Hi there Scott, how are youd oing? Sorry for the late reply. I noticed that Mail added all my AIM iMap folders upon installing Snow Leopard, and I just saw them just now. I was only used to seeing "Inbox", and now it shows all my folders associated with AIM Mail, like Spam, and such. A lot of the message from the list went into the Spam folder, so I am fixing that just now. As for what kind of mac I have. I bought my mac in August of 2008 So I have the folllowing: iMac Core 2 Duo 2.66GHZ 4G Ram ATI HD2600 Pro If there is anything else, let me know. Again, I apologize for the delayed response. Take care Fonzie On Aug 30, 2009, at 4:57 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > > Fonzie, what type of Mac do you have? I'm not encountering this issue, > but I am looking to see if there is any patterns perhaps. Did you do > a clean install or upgrade? > On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Fonzie wrote: > >> >> I second the no issue with choppy reading area. >> >> The sub menu thing? >> >> I have seen that happen once or twice. >> >> I mainly see it when I pull up the main menu bar though, where apple >> and program related menus are located. What seems to happen is, >> VoiceOver will stop speaking here and there, and only when scrolling. >> This only happens if I go into the menu bar, pull down any menu of my >> choosing, and read it's contents. Then, I leave the menu bar, and >> immediately pull it up once more, and pull down a menu of my >> choosing, >> VoiceOver begins the small silence issue, even when scrolling through >> the menu items. >> >> For now, I just solve this by doing the following. ONce I attempt to >> go into the menu bar the second time, I wait a couple of seconds, and >> pull down the menu of my choice. Either that, or I pull down the >> menu >> I want, and then wait a couple of seconds, and start scrolling >> afterwards. >> >> Take care. >> >> Fonzie >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 5:24 PM, Scott Howell wrote: >> >>> >>> Funny, I'm having no issues with submenus in Mail or any other app I >>> have used so far. There seems to be some slightly roughness to the >>> reading, but not sure what the cause is and I noticed it only as a >>> slight thing, but of course level of annoyance is subjective for >>> sure. >>> >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:08 PM, Brett Campbell wrote: >>> Yes, I'm glad you mentioned this. The mail is read choppy. Alex reads smooth as ever in Safari. I currently only have my rate at 50, so I don't think rate is causing it. I'm also having no luck getting sub menus to work, Such as when I try to move a message to another box. Brett On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:50 AM, John J Herzog wrote: > > Hi all, > I'm liking the snow leopard update so far, but I'm running into an > annoyance with mail. Since the update, I noticed that voiceover > reads > messages much more choppy than before. Specifically, it pauses too > long when it encounters a new line in the middle of text. Is there > an > option to have voiceover keep speaking normally as if that new > line > did not occur in the middle of a sentence? > Thanks for your help, > > John > >> > >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
quickly junping from page to page in preview
Hi everyone, I recently asked if acrobat reader was accessible, as it was installed on my system upon purchase, to my dismay it wasn't. But thanks to you guys i found out preview was in fact fully accessible, and better i many respects to reading pdf as compared to acrobat reader as it's not cluttered. I wanted to know though how you manage to jump from page to page in a big document, and can you apply hotspots which you can then access the next time you open preview? IF this is the case, than jaws has some sweat to throw as i don't remember hotspots saving itself when you created one. Thanks in advance for your attention --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Strange Voiceover thing
Please forgive and excuse me. I am so new at this, I will continue to ask dumb questions. I bought a Mac Mini yesterday. I performed a clean install of Snow Leopard. I have set my wireless network up. I have successfully changed my finder preferences so that my hard drive is shown in the initial finder window. However, when I start my Mac, I keep hearing this human being tell me that if I know voiceover I should press v, and if I don't I should press space. How do I get rid of that guy? --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
adium, again
Hello, i explored the events pane but found it a bit confusing, anyway on there i could not find an option to give me a popup on my current screen if someone talked to me, jus tpopup on the dock which i am not sure I would notice. But, i was wodnering, does maybe a new window open within adium if someone sent me a message, then i guess i could see it in the window chooser? Sorry, I am very new at this. Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
toolbar button?
Hi everyone, a flurry of noob questions for productivity: -whenever i stumble on a toolbar button, i don't seem to be able to do anything to it. Is it normal, or is there a command to individually open the toolbar button instead of vo space? Thanks again, and again... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
I agree: choice is not a bad thing. I use all three (Windows, Mac, and GNU/Linux) for different things. While my main fun downtime machine is a Mac, I definitely still use Windows for some things and in some situations. I also have a couple of things I do where GNU/Linux is the best choice. It's all good, and I say if it works for you, use it and be productive. If something else works for you, use that. While I've seen some Windows is the antichrist stuff here and on the GNU/Linux lists, I've seen similar, though different, things on the Windows side, mostly to do with people thinking that these are not viable alternatives at all, or not useful, or that those of us who use non-Windows alternatives are only doing so out of some cultish need to not use Microsoft products simply for the fact that they come from Microsoft. While I don't deny there is sometimes a certain amount of that latter attitude with some of us, it's no different, and no less divisive, than the "Windows is the antichrist" attitude. It just manifests itself differently. -- Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:39 AM, James & Nash wrote: > > Donnna, I could not have said it better myself. No, Windows is not the > darkside and I feel I have to say that whenever I listen to Windows or > Windows AT related podcasts which I do regularly, I have never - as > far as i > can remember heard these folks disparage Apple's efforts. There are of > course those in the AT and Windows communities who have dismissed > the Mac > out of hand, but these narrow minded folks are few and far between. > > I think we can all agree that people should use what works for them > - or > what works for them in a given situation - whether that be Linux, > Mac or > Windows is irrelevant. Yes, Apple has made great steps forward in the > accessibility of Mac OS X, Windows AT developers and Microsoft have > also > done the same for Windows as have Linux folks. As you said, there are > definite weaknesses to both - indeeed all the OS's as there are > definite > advantages. None of these operating systems are in any way perfect > but we > should respect everyone and their choice. > > I am not criticizing anyone - personally, I think it's a good thing > that > Apple have added the ability for people to decide on how they want > to edit > as well as other things. It is always nice and convenient to have > options > and multiple ways of doing things. > > Take care all > > James > - Original Message - > From: "Donna Goodin" > To: > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 4:06 AM > Subject: RE: 3 features that hmm? > > >> >> Hello all, >> >> I have to support Rich here. The attitude displayed by many Mac >> users >> toward Windows, and toward Windows users who are doing their best >> to learn >> the Mac OS is frankly despicable. Many mac users--definitely not >> all--are >> nothing more than a bunch of narrow-minded snobs. Windows is not >> "the >> dark >> side". It is a viable choice, perhaps a better choice for some >> people. >> JAWS and Windows worked very well for me for nearly 20 years. I am >> only >> here because I want to support Apple's efforts, not because I believe >> Windows or JAWS to be the devil incarnate. Yes, editing is >> different. >> Those who prefer editing in Windows are not wrong, they just prefer >> something different. They are entitled to that preference, just as >> all on >> this list are entitled to their preference for the Mac. If Apple >> implements >> some choices to facilitate transition from Windows, there's nothing >> wrong >> with that. No one has to use it unless they want to. >> >> Personally, I think it's great that there are multiple alternatives >> now >> available for blind users. Yes, what Apple has done for >> accessibility is >> tremendous. That said, I just applied for a job at a place where >> they >> pretty much come out and tell you that if you choose to use a Mac, >> you >> won't >> be able to utilize all of their materials. So, if I get that >> position, >> I'll >> be using Windows for all things work-related. I therefore hope that >> Windows >> continues to be a viable option for blind users. The best possible >> scenario >> for us is to have as many options as possible, so that each of us can >> decide >> which is the best fit for us and for our immediate needs. The Mac >> has >> many >> things to recommend it. But you all who choose to use it, are in >> no way >> superior to anyone else, and you have no right to disdain others who >> either >> choose the Windows option, or are willing to point out the Mac's >> weaknesses. >> And yes, the Mac does have very definite weaknesses, as does Windows. >> >> Why can't we all just be supportive and respectful of one another? I >> think >> the thing I find saddest about this whole movement toward the Mac, >> is the >> way it seems
Re: Services gone
Interacting doesn't help. No services are available. Something is wrong here. /Krister 30 aug 2009 kl. 18.10 skrev Marie Howarth: > > I never looked at services in mail before, but I just opened text edit > and services are working fine for me there. and as I interacted with > the email I'm writing, services comes up fine here too. when I wasn't > interacting however, so vo wasn't really interacting with anything, > services was dimmed. try interacting with something and see if that > helps. you're not stupid, things are slightly different, as to be > expected with our new kitty. soon we'll love it more than the last :) > any help give me a yell :) > On Aug 30, 2009, at 4:23 PM, Krister Ekstrom wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> Nope, this doesn't seem to be true, unless there's something >> completely a miss in my brains. An example: I tried to search for >> something on Google, which worked well under Leopard. Pressing cmd- >> shift-l yealded no result, no search dialog or anything and now when >> i'm in mail, you could expect that there would turn up any services, >> but no, no services are available a dimmed text informs me. Something >> is screwed up here or i'm too stupid to understand this new kitty. >> /Krister >> >> 30 aug 2009 kl. 16.51 skrev JC Helary: >> >>> >>> >>> Le 30 août 2009 à 23:38, Krister Ekstrom a écrit : >>> It looks that if i go into the applications menu on my mac and go into the "services" menu, VO informs me that no services are available, although there should be. >>> >>> It looks as if the services available in the application menu depend >>> on the context. If there is no "context" a service can use then that >>> service won't be available. For ex, the services available if you >>> select a string are different from those when you select a file. >>> >>> If nothing is selected then no services are available. >>> There's a settings command and choosing it takes me to the keyboard shortcuts panel of the system settings, but i don't want to define keyboard shortcuts, all i want is to enable services if such beast of a command exists, and otherwise i want to know what gives and if i can do something about it. >>> >>> You should select something on which to apply a service. >>> Oh, and when i try enabling the services i want, which i have to do one by one, i get an error that the command already is taken by another program. Now i'm confused again. >>> >>> I think it is safe to use the defaults. >>> >>> Jean-Christophe Helary >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: toolbar button?
Just Interact with it, - Original Message - From: "Yuma Antoine Decaux" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 6:34 PM Subject: toolbar button? > > Hi everyone, > > a flurry of noob questions for productivity: > > -whenever i stumble on a toolbar button, i don't seem to be able to do > anything to it. Is it normal, or is there a command to individually > open the toolbar button instead of vo space? > > Thanks again, and again... > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: muting voice with a key?
Hello Anouk, On my MacBook the mute/unmute key is (Fn)+F10. If you have installed Snow Leopard, I think that whether you press the Fn key along with the F10 key depends on whether you have set up System Preferences for the "Keyboard & Mouse" (VO-M to menu bar, arrow down into Apple menu, press "s y" to navigate to System Preferences, press enter to select option, then navigate with tab or item chooser menu to the "Keyboard & Mouse" button and press with VO-Space to bring up this window) so that you check the box "Use all F1, F2, etc. keys as standard function keys" on the Keyboard tab). If the sound is not muted when you press the F10 key, it is likely being used as an Exposé key -- a kind of visual analog to VoiceOver's window chooser menu where all windows on the Desktop are displayed in a kind of icon view for selection/switching. Press F10 again to switch out of Exposé mode if this happens, then try Fn+F10 to mute and then unmute your sound. The F11 and F12 keys on recent Mac keyboards are used to decrease or increase volume. The F1 and F2 keys are used to decrease or increase screen brightness. In Leopard, switching VoiceOver on by default meant that you need to press the Fn key, too, to adjust brightness or volume, but this wasn't true in Tiger. HTH Cheers, Esther a radix wrote: > > Hi, yes but i actually meant like permanent, i think control only > mutes till > you move the cursor, i will try it though (still doing mail on the > windows > machine till i have time to read the switching to apple book). > Greetings, Anouk, > - Original Message - > From: "Woody Anna Dresner" > To: > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 1:58 PM > Subject: Re: muting voice with a key? > > >> >> Hi Anou, >> >> Press Control to mute speech. >> >> best, >> Anna >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
navigating through chm reader
Hey once again, Has anyone got some idea on how to navigate through what is normally links to pages on the chmos chm reader? I interact with the drawer then go into the contents tab, go through the collapsed rows, expand then then go into one of the sub-level titles but from there i'm quite not sure what to do next... Still transiting from windows, so pleeease bear with me. :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: toolbar button?
Thanks, but i meant the toolbar button, but thanks anyway --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
>> Also just my oppinion, but I disagree about points 1 and 2. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Can't say I ever have used feature numero uno in any OS as >>>>>>>>> there >>>>>> are >>>>>>>>> so few webpages I'd actually want to read 100% of their >>>>>>>>> content, >>>>>> but >>>>>>>>> someone somewhere will find it useful. You could argue that >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> reading webpages automatically is as close as Apple could >>>>>>>>> get to >>>> a >>>>>>>>> sighted person glancing at the screen when the page comes up >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> taking in the bigger picture, which we can't do. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Voiceover hints are definitely useful and a good thing. >>>>>>>>> Context >>>>>>>>> sensitive help like that enables most people to be on a way >>>>>>>>> shorter learning curve usually than reading a whole manual and >>>>>>>>> trying to apply things to a ton of situations at once. It's >>>>>>>>> annoying that >>>> they're >>>>>>>>> enabled by default for you or I perhaps, but newbies are going >>>>>>>>> to thank Apple for it no doubt. Come to that, so will >>>>>>>>> developers >>>> who >>>>>>>>> fire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled >>>>>>>>> email from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to >>>>>>>>> their applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the >>>>>>>>> difference between what works and what doesn't, it gives them >>>>>>>>> instructions equally as precise as that email from the VI user >>>>>>>>> would in most cases. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get >>>> this >>>>>>>>> one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason >>>>>>>>> the option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that >>>>>>>>> doesn't >>>>>>>>> in >>>> any >>>>>>>>> way >>>>>>>>> need to be modified, purely because of some VI people's rut >>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>> they're firmly jammed into. To add weight to a big sweeping >>>>>>>>> oppinion like that, I should say that I was raised on Windows, >>>>>>>>> still use Windows more often than many on here I expect, and I >>>>>>>>> make my fair share of mistakes editing in Mac OS if I haven't >>>>>>>>> done any in a while. >>>>>>>>> I don't see this option as the solution, I see it as cheating. >>>>>>>>> I doubt that many people will see this as an option to ease >>>>>>>>> their progression into Mac OS as one of the other Scott's >>>>>>>>> suggested, human's just don't work that way, for the most part >>>>>>>>> we're creatures of >>>>>> habit >>>>>>>>> even if they're bad ones. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Tricky one though isn't it. Emailing Apple and asking that a >>>>>>>>> feature be removed seems somehow wrong in my mind. In any >>>>>>>>> case, >>>>>>>>> I'm not sure they'd get it. I just tried to explain why I >>>>>>>>> disagree with the feature and what's potentially at stake here >>>>>>>>> to a sighted mac user, and she point blank didn't get it. I'm >>>>>>>>> not sure that anyone who hasn't had to appreciate how cool >>>>>>>>> mainstream technology that >>>> works >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> us out of the box would, even Apple themselves might not, they >>>>>>>>> probably see the introduction of this feature as the best >>>>>>>>> thing >>>>>> they >>>>>>>>> could've done to silence a lot of whinging lol. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Just my 2 cents, or perhaps pennies worth for those on this >>>>>>>>> side >>>>>>>>> of the pond... >>>>>>>>> Scott >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 8/29/09, Scott Howell wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Well good for you, I'm glad you did not need these features >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>> you >>>>>>>>>> learned the way we all started out. However, of course the >>>>>>>>>> only plus side is that for those who want to make the >>>>>>>>>> transition and >>>> really >>>>>>>>>> find >>>>>>>>>> what we "grew up with" difficult, will at least have a way to >>>>>>>>>> ease their transition over from the dark side. :) So, I >>>>>>>>>> agree >>>>>>>>>> with >>>>>> you, >>>>>>>>>> but these are small prices to pay if it will truly help >>>>>>>>>> someone >>>>>>>>>> make the transition. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> well, this is purely my opinion but 3 features that horribly >>>>>>>>>>> remind me of windows are as follows. >>>>>>>>>>> 1. automatic reading of a webpage. >>>>>>>>>>> 2. voice over hints. I know what to do in a text area, >>>>>>>>>>> especially when it already says edit text. >>>>>>>>>>> 3. insertion point. this has been discussed, it's counter >>>>>>>>>>> intuitive and doesn't teach the vi community how it would >>>>>>>>>>> look >>>>>>>>>>> to sighties. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> all I can say is I'm so glad these features are optional. >>>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>> are >>>>>>>>>>> just horrific and no one can tell me that it will help >>>>>> progression >>>>>>>>>>> from windows to mac. I didn't have these features and I am >>>>>>>>>>> so >>>>>>>>>>> glad I did. mac is not windows, when will people realise >>>>>>>>>>> this. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> overall vo rocks even more in this version, and I am >>>>>>>>>>> grateful >>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> apple >>>>>>>>>>> for giving us a choice. really glad. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >>>>>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >>>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >>> >>> >>>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4381 (20090830) __ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> >> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4381 (20090830) __ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4381 (20090830) __ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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RE: 3 features that hmm?
Hi Buddy, Other than the NFB review--which was just stupid--I can honestly say I haven't run into this on the Windows side. But I can say that if I did, I'd say exactly the same thing. Cheers, Donna > -Original Message- > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Buddy Brannan > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 12:39 PM > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: 3 features that hmm? > > > I agree: choice is not a bad thing. I use all three (Windows, Mac, and > GNU/Linux) for different things. While my main fun downtime machine is > a Mac, I definitely still use Windows for some things and in some > situations. I also have a couple of things I do where GNU/Linux is the > best choice. It's all good, and I say if it works for you, use it and > be productive. If something else works for you, use that. > > While I've seen some Windows is the antichrist stuff here and on the > GNU/Linux lists, I've seen similar, though different, things on the > Windows side, mostly to do with people thinking that these are not > viable alternatives at all, or not useful, or that those of us who use > non-Windows alternatives are only doing so out of some cultish need to > not use Microsoft products simply for the fact that they come from > Microsoft. While I don't deny there is sometimes a certain amount of > that latter attitude with some of us, it's no different, and no less > divisive, than the "Windows is the antichrist" attitude. It just > manifests itself differently. > -- > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY > > > > On Aug 30, 2009, at 3:39 AM, James & Nash wrote: > > > > > Donnna, I could not have said it better myself. No, Windows is not > the > > darkside and I feel I have to say that whenever I listen to Windows > or > > Windows AT related podcasts which I do regularly, I have never - as > > far as i > > can remember heard these folks disparage Apple's efforts. There are > of > > course those in the AT and Windows communities who have dismissed > > the Mac > > out of hand, but these narrow minded folks are few and far between. > > > > I think we can all agree that people should use what works for them > > - or > > what works for them in a given situation - whether that be Linux, > > Mac or > > Windows is irrelevant. Yes, Apple has made great steps forward in the > > accessibility of Mac OS X, Windows AT developers and Microsoft have > > also > > done the same for Windows as have Linux folks. As you said, there are > > definite weaknesses to both - indeeed all the OS's as there are > > definite > > advantages. None of these operating systems are in any way perfect > > but we > > should respect everyone and their choice. > > > > I am not criticizing anyone - personally, I think it's a good thing > > that > > Apple have added the ability for people to decide on how they want > > to edit > > as well as other things. It is always nice and convenient to have > > options > > and multiple ways of doing things. > > > > Take care all > > > > James > > - Original Message - > > From: "Donna Goodin" > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 4:06 AM > > Subject: RE: 3 features that hmm? > > > > > >> > >> Hello all, > >> > >> I have to support Rich here. The attitude displayed by many Mac > >> users > >> toward Windows, and toward Windows users who are doing their best > >> to learn > >> the Mac OS is frankly despicable. Many mac users--definitely not > >> all--are > >> nothing more than a bunch of narrow-minded snobs. Windows is not > >> "the > >> dark > >> side". It is a viable choice, perhaps a better choice for some > >> people. > >> JAWS and Windows worked very well for me for nearly 20 years. I am > >> only > >> here because I want to support Apple's efforts, not because I > believe > >> Windows or JAWS to be the devil incarnate. Yes, editing is > >> different. > >> Those who prefer editing in Windows are not wrong, they just prefer > >> something different. They are entitled to that preference, just as > >> all on > >> this list are entitled to their preference for the Mac. If Apple > >> implements > >> some choices to facilitate transition from Windows, there's nothing > >> wrong > >> with that. No one has to use it unless they want to. > >> > >> Personally, I think it's great that there are multiple alternatives > >> now > >> available for blind users. Yes, what Apple has done for > >> accessibility is > >> tremendous. That said, I just applied for a job at a place where > >> they > >> pretty much come out and tell you that if you choose to use a Mac, > >> you > >> won't > >> be able to utilize all of their materials. So, if I get that > >> position, > >> I'll > >> be using Windows for all things work-related. I therefore hope that > >> Windows > >> continues to be a viable option for blind users. The best possible > >> scenario > >> for us is to have as many options as possible, so t
Re: going up a folder
Hello; someone may have already answered you. I'm getting a late start today. I use command option up arrow. You can also use shift command h to go to the beginning like home in a web browser. If you hit command option m twice in succession it will bring up a menu and you can see some of these key combinations listed after the choices. I hope that helps. good luck, Max On Aug 30, 2009, at 8:50 AM, JC Helary wrote: > > > Le 30 août 2009 à 22:27, a radix a écrit : > >> Hello everyone, is it possible in fidner to go back a folder like >> you can do with backspace in windows? I dont have it set so that a >> fodler opens in a new window. > > This is usually command + up arrow. > > Jean-Christophe Helary > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: quickly junping from page to page in preview
Try Command Right Arrow for jumping from page to page. - Original Message - From: "Yuma Antoine Decaux" To: Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 5:15 PM Subject: quickly junping from page to page in preview > > Hi everyone, > > I recently asked if acrobat reader was accessible, as it was installed > on my system upon purchase, to my dismay it wasn't. But thanks to you > guys i found out preview was in fact fully accessible, and better i > many respects to reading pdf as compared to acrobat reader as it's not > cluttered. > > I wanted to know though how you manage to jump from page to page in a > big document, and can you apply hotspots which you can then access the > next time you open preview? IF this is the case, than jaws has some > sweat to throw as i don't remember hotspots saving itself when you > created one. > > Thanks in advance for your attention > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: 3 features that hmm?
;>>>>> point because I remember clearly the noise about this editing >>>>>>>>> issue. I >>>>>>> see >>>>>>>>> no benefit in removing it and quite frankly since it's here, >>>>>>> whatever >>>>>>>>> at this point. If it really helps someone , fine because >>>>>>>>> there >>>>> are >>>>>>>>> those who would simply not consider the Mac for this reason. >>>>>>>>> It >>>>> is >>>>>>>>> an >>>>>>>>> option and not a default and that is why it's a feature not >>>>>>>>> worth >>>>>>>>> removing. My point is you have to think beyond what you have >>>>> stated >>>>>>>>> and I don't entirely disagree with your point of what is or is >>>>>>>>> not a standard way of editing etc. At the same time, it >>>>>>>>> obviously >>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>> take a great deal of effort to implement it and at least it >>>>>>>>> is an >>>>>>>>> option. >>>>>>>>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:14 PM, Scott Chesworth wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Also just my oppinion, but I disagree about points 1 and 2. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Can't say I ever have used feature numero uno in any OS as >>>>>>>>>> there >>>>>>> are >>>>>>>>>> so few webpages I'd actually want to read 100% of their >>>>>>>>>> content, >>>>>>> but >>>>>>>>>> someone somewhere will find it useful. You could argue that >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> reading webpages automatically is as close as Apple could >>>>>>>>>> get to >>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> sighted person glancing at the screen when the page comes up >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> taking in the bigger picture, which we can't do. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Voiceover hints are definitely useful and a good thing. >>>>>>>>>> Context >>>>>>>>>> sensitive help like that enables most people to be on a way >>>>>>>>>> shorter learning curve usually than reading a whole manual >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> trying to apply things to a ton of situations at once. It's >>>>>>>>>> annoying that >>>>> they're >>>>>>>>>> enabled by default for you or I perhaps, but newbies are >>>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>>> to thank Apple for it no doubt. Come to that, so will >>>>>>>>>> developers >>>>> who >>>>>>>>>> fire up VO for the first time when they receive a disgruntled >>>>>>>>>> email from someone who's asking them to make adjustments to >>>>>>>>>> their applications. It'll instantly demonstrate to them the >>>>>>>>>> difference between what works and what doesn't, it gives them >>>>>>>>>> instructions equally as precise as that email from the VI >>>>>>>>>> user >>>>>>>>>> would in most cases. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Wholeheartedly agreed about point 3 though. I just don't get >>>>> this >>>>>>>>>> one. You also hit the nail right on the head with the reason >>>>>>>>>> the option shouldn't exist, it modifies a standard that >>>>>>>>>> doesn't >>>>>>>>>> in >>>>> any >>>>>>>>>> way >>>>>>>>>> need to be modified, purely because of some VI people's rut >>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> they're firmly jammed into. To add weight to a big sweeping >>>>>>>>>> oppinion like that, I should say that I was raised on >>>>>>>>>> Windows, >>>>>>>>>> still use Windows more often than many on here I expect, >>>>>>>>>> and I >>>>>>>>>> make my fair share of mistakes editing in Mac OS if I haven't >>>>>>>>>> done any in a while. >>>>>>>>>> I don't see this option as the solution, I see it as >>>>>>>>>> cheating. >>>>>>>>>> I doubt that many people will see this as an option to ease >>>>>>>>>> their progression into Mac OS as one of the other Scott's >>>>>>>>>> suggested, human's just don't work that way, for the most >>>>>>>>>> part >>>>>>>>>> we're creatures of >>>>>>> habit >>>>>>>>>> even if they're bad ones. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Tricky one though isn't it. Emailing Apple and asking that a >>>>>>>>>> feature be removed seems somehow wrong in my mind. In any >>>>>>>>>> case, >>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure they'd get it. I just tried to explain why I >>>>>>>>>> disagree with the feature and what's potentially at stake >>>>>>>>>> here >>>>>>>>>> to a sighted mac user, and she point blank didn't get it. >>>>>>>>>> I'm >>>>>>>>>> not sure that anyone who hasn't had to appreciate how cool >>>>>>>>>> mainstream technology that >>>>> works >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> us out of the box would, even Apple themselves might not, >>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>> probably see the introduction of this feature as the best >>>>>>>>>> thing >>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>> could've done to silence a lot of whinging lol. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Just my 2 cents, or perhaps pennies worth for those on this >>>>>>>>>> side >>>>>>>>>> of the pond... >>>>>>>>>> Scott >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 8/29/09, Scott Howell wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Well good for you, I'm glad you did not need these features >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>> you >>>>>>>>>>> learned the way we all started out. However, of course the >>>>>>>>>>> only plus side is that for those who want to make the >>>>>>>>>>> transition and >>>>> really >>>>>>>>>>> find >>>>>>>>>>> what we "grew up with" difficult, will at least have a way >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> ease their transition over from the dark side. :) So, I >>>>>>>>>>> agree >>>>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>> you, >>>>>>>>>>> but these are small prices to pay if it will truly help >>>>>>>>>>> someone >>>>>>>>>>> make the transition. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Marie Howarth wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> well, this is purely my opinion but 3 features that >>>>>>>>>>>> horribly >>>>>>>>>>>> remind me of windows are as follows. >>>>>>>>>>>> 1. automatic reading of a webpage. >>>>>>>>>>>> 2. voice over hints. I know what to do in a text area, >>>>>>>>>>>> especially when it already says edit text. >>>>>>>>>>>> 3. insertion point. this has been discussed, it's counter >>>>>>>>>>>> intuitive and doesn't teach the vi community how it would >>>>>>>>>>>> look >>>>>>>>>>>> to sighties. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> all I can say is I'm so glad these features are optional. >>>>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>> are >>>>>>>>>>>> just horrific and no one can tell me that it will help >>>>>>> progression >>>>>>>>>>>> from windows to mac. I didn't have these features and I am >>>>>>>>>>>> so >>>>>>>>>>>> glad I did. mac is not windows, when will people realise >>>>>>>>>>>> this. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> overall vo rocks even more in this version, and I am >>>>>>>>>>>> grateful >>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>> apple >>>>>>>>>>>> for giving us a choice. really glad. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release >>>>>>> Date: >>>>>>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.71/2333 - Release Date: >>>>> 08/29/09 17:51:00 >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4381 (20090830) __ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4381 (20090830) __ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4381 (20090830) __ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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Re: toolbar button?
If it's a normal toolbar and Voiceover says: "Toolbar button," this button is used to hide the toolbar. You can hide the toolbar by pressing VO spacebar on the button. Best regards: Søren Jensen Mail & MSN: s...@coolfortheblind.dk Website: http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/ On 30/08/2009, at 18.49, Yuma Antoine Decaux wrote: > > Thanks, but i meant the toolbar button, but thanks anyway > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
problems with a website
Hello everyone, i am on the blindcooltech website because I would like to listen to a podcast there. But it does not show them as links it just says heading level 2 (name of podcast) and clicking on them or double clicking, i mean vo-space and vo-shift-space doesnt seem to do anything. What can i do? I am using leopard and the newest version of safari, i dont udnerstand why it does not show them as links since it works fine in ie. Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: quickly junping from page to page in preview
Thanks James, It is one of these obvious ones again, gotta get the hang of it :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Another cool VO 3.0 Feature
Turn your caps lock on and type. Nice to have an indication that caps lock is on now, now I won't accidentally be shouting at people. -- Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: toolbar button?
Cool, thanks for the pointer :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Strange Voiceover thing
The answer lies within your question. Just hit v one time and presto, that guy will be gone, forever. On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 6:22 AM, Rich Ring wrote: > > Please forgive and excuse me. I am so new at this, I will continue to ask > dumb questions. > I bought a Mac Mini yesterday. I performed a clean install of Snow > Leopard. > I have set my wireless network up. I have successfully changed my finder > preferences so that my hard drive is shown in the initial finder window. > However, when I start my Mac, I keep hearing this human being tell me that > if I know voiceover I should press v, and if I don't I should press space. > How do I get rid of that guy? > > > > > -- Check out our web site, www.giantdolphin.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: problems with a website
Hi, since you're using Leopard, what you'll have to do is interact with that heading, and then you'll see the link. IN Snow Leopard, you won't have to do this, the link will just be there. On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:09 PM, a radix wrote: > Hello everyone, i am on the blindcooltech website because I would > like to listen to a podcast there. But it does not show them as > links it just says heading level 2 (name of podcast) and clicking on > them or double clicking, i mean vo-space and vo-shift-space doesnt > seem to do anything. > What can i do? I am using leopard and the newest version of safari, > i dont udnerstand why it does not show them as links since it works > fine in ie. > Greetings, Anouk, > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: problems with a website
Ok! thanks for that, i was rather confused because on my other pc the link showed up immediately. Thanks for the info. Greetings, Anouk, - Original Message - From: Dan Eickmeier To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 7:15 PM Subject: Re: problems with a website Hi, since you're using Leopard, what you'll have to do is interact with that heading, and then you'll see the link. IN Snow Leopard, you won't have to do this, the link will just be there. On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:09 PM, a radix wrote: Hello everyone, i am on the blindcooltech website because I would like to listen to a podcast there. But it does not show them as links it just says heading level 2 (name of podcast) and clicking on them or double clicking, i mean vo-space and vo-shift-space doesnt seem to do anything. What can i do? I am using leopard and the newest version of safari, i dont udnerstand why it does not show them as links since it works fine in ie. Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Another cool VO 3.0 Feature
Shouting at people? - Original Message - From: "Buddy Brannan" To: ; Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 6:10 PM Subject: Another cool VO 3.0 Feature > > Turn your caps lock on and type. Nice to have an indication that caps > lock is on now, now I won't accidentally be shouting at people. > -- > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY > > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Another cool VO 3.0 Feature
Yes. Typing in all caps is considered shouting. -- Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:21 PM, James & Nash wrote: > > Shouting at people? > - Original Message - > From: "Buddy Brannan" > To: ; > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 6:10 PM > Subject: Another cool VO 3.0 Feature > > >> >> Turn your caps lock on and type. Nice to have an indication that caps >> lock is on now, now I won't accidentally be shouting at people. >> -- >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY >> >> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: itunes newbie
Try this link: http://www.apple.com/support/itunes/windows/tutorial/index.html On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 3:43 AM, a radix wrote: > Hello everyone, Is there maybe a tutorial or podcast about learning > itunes? I am new to it and although i can import stuff into the library i > now wonder how i can play that whole library in shuffle mode, so not just > the last added files. Also, what does itunes do with my files, does it only > copy them or also convert them to another format? They were mp3-files. > Greetings, Anouk, > > > > -- Check out our web site, www.giantdolphin.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
for the price
hi will people get the IPod touch if it has speech or for the possibly high price, just get an i phone? --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
adium edit dimmed
Hello, I think i have got a hang of the events window now, but if i am standing on an event and stop interacting the edit button is dimmed and i cant change what it does when this event happens Greetings, Anouk, --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: for the price
Hello; that's a good question that I've already started thinking about for myself. I can't switch to a t & t or verizon even if the iphone becomes available for verizon next year. For my own reasons I'm stuck with sprint. It will probably come down to what costs more. But the comparison won't be easy because the iphone is cheaper, but the ipod touch will have more storage capacity. They both have wireless internet whenever you are near a hot spot. They can both run all the aplications, or at least i haven't heard anything that says the iphone will run programs the ipod touch won't. For now I'm leaning towards the touch, but a lot will change as we get closer to the release and find out more about what is included in the price for a ipod touch with speech. A good place to start a healthy discussion. Thanks, Max On Aug 30, 2009, at 12:43 PM, william lomas wrote: > >hi will people get the IPod touch if it has speech or for the > possibly high price, just get an i phone? > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: embedded voice commands
Take a look at: http://developer.apple.com/mac/library/documentation/Carbon/Reference/Speech_Synthesis_Manager/Reference/reference.html#/ /apple_ref/doc/constant_group/Speech_Channel_Information_Constants This is for Objective C, but I expect the objects exist in java too. Essentially a parameter in setSpeechInfo will change voices for a given channel. It appears a channel is linked to a synthesizer so you would need to create a new channel if you need to change synthesizer . Jon On Aug 29, 2009, at 7:01 PM, louie wrote: > > Ann I want to change the voice from within a java program. thanks. > On Aug 29, 2009, at 2:42 PM, Anne Robertson wrote: > >> >> Hello Louis, >> >> To change the voice on the fly, press VO-Command-left or right arrow >> until you reach "Default Voice", then keep holding down VO-Command >> and >> use the up and down arrows to change the voice. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Anne >> >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:55 PM, louie wrote: >> >>> >>> Hi all, >>> Anyone know the embedded command to change the voice? >>> I have found the below commands. >>> >>> [[volm +0.1]] will change the volume. >>> [[rate 400]] will change the rate. >>> Thanks for any help. >>> >>> >>> louie >>> louiem...@wavecable.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > louie > louiem...@wavecable.com > > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
playing avi files in quicktime
Hello, i am trying to play an avi file in quicktime but dont hear a sound, doesnt quicktime support this filetype? Greetings, Anouk --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Preview navigation and Adobe Reader with VoiceOver [was Re: quickly junping from page to page in preview]
Hi Yuma, In addition to Command-Right arrow and Command-Left arrow to navigate to next and previous pages in Preview, you can go to a specific page with Command-Option-G, then type in the page number and press enter. You can also go backwards and forwards with Command-Left bracket and Command-Right bracket the same way you do in Safari. And you can add a Bookmark with Command-D just as you can in Safari. This is one of the neat features that I like about Preview, since once you set a bookmark, it appears in the Bookmarks menu on the Preview menu bar. If you select your bookmark, Preview will open that document to the bookmarked page -- even if you haven't yet found, selected, or opened that document. You can also navigate through documents that have Table of Contents, like the Apple manuals for VoiceOver Getting Started, and use the Preview sidebar to view and navigate by Table of Contents. You can get some other pointers on using Preview if you check Tim Kilburn's web page about VoiceOver: http://homepage.mac.com/kilburns/voiceover/preview5.html Although these pages have not been updated to reflect recent changes/ additions, they're very helpful. Note that one point of regress from Tiger to Leopard is that you'll need to set a hot spot (VO-Shift-1 or other number up to 9) to go back to your position on the page if you switch applications. Just return by pressing VO-1, etc. This only works temporarily for your current session and is lost if you turn VoiceOver off. Also, it's possible to use Adobe Reader to read documents if you have to -- e.g. for DRM-protected material. It's just rather clunky and unintuitive, since the menu structure is complex, and you're using Text-to-Speech rather than VoiceOver. It can be maddening to try to find the voice controls, since they're set it turns out they're set in the preferences menu, and the default reading rate is really slow. If you want to use a French voice, for example, you'll need to bring up Adobe Reader's preferences (Command-comma), VO-Down arrow to the categories table and Interact, then press "r" to select "Reading" and stop interacting. VO-Right arrow to set the reading options, especially under the "Read out loud" heading where you will want to uncheck the box for default voice (with VO-Space) and select the new voice from the pop up button. You'll also want to uncheck the box for "Use default speech attributes" so you can set the reading rate -- and they won't accept more than 650 words per minute. Command-W to close the preferences menu. When you use Adobe Reader, check the "View" menu on the menu bar for the "Read out loud" sub-menu commands and shortcuts: Activate/Deactivate Read out loud: Command-Shift-Y Read Only this page: Command-Shift-V Read to end of document: Command-Shift-B Pause: Command-Shift-C Stop: Command-Shift-E Use the FInder contextual menu (VO-Shift-M) to "Open with" and select "Adobe Reader" if you want to try this out. Preview, is much, much nicer. There's also a package called Skim, that is like Preview on steroids, which is particularly good for annotating what you read. It basically has another sidebar for notes, in addition to the one for navigating table of contents. HTH Cheers, Esther Yuma Antoine Decaux wrote: > > Thanks James, > > It is one of these obvious ones again, gotta get the hang of it :) > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: problems with a website
Hi Anouk, Alternatively, you can bookmark and use the Blind Cool Tech RSS feed instead: http://www.blindcooltech.com/bct.xml If there's anyone using Tiger, this loads faster, uses fewer resources for VoiceOver, and you don't have to interact on headings. Cheers, Esther a radix wrote: > Ok! thanks for that, i was rather confused because on my other pc > the link showed up immediately. > Thanks for the info. > Greetings, Anouk, > - Original Message - > From: Dan Eickmeier > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2009 7:15 PM > Subject: Re: problems with a website > > Hi, since you're using Leopard, what you'll have to do is interact > with that heading, and then you'll see the link. IN Snow Leopard, > you won't have to do this, the link will just be there. > On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:09 PM, a radix wrote: > >> Hello everyone, i am on the blindcooltech website because I would >> like to listen to a podcast there. But it does not show them as >> links it just says heading level 2 (name of podcast) and clicking >> on them or double clicking, i mean vo-space and vo-shift-space >> doesnt seem to do anything. >> What can i do? I am using leopard and the newest version of safari, >> i dont udnerstand why it does not show them as links since it works >> fine in ie. >> Greetings, Anouk, >> >> >> > > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: 64 Bit Mode?
You're not booting with the 64-bit kernel. Only the Xserves do that. But things still run in 64-bit. If you want a good explanation as well as a program to change booting to the 64-bit kernel, Go here: http://www.ahatfullofsky.comuv.com/English/Programs/SMS/SMS.html > From: sunrisings...@aim.com > Subject: 64 Bit Mode? > Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2009 10:51:28 -0500 > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com > > > Hi everyone, I hope your morning/afternoon, or whatever time it is > goes well. > > I noticed that Snow Leopard boots in 32 bit mode. > > I check the list of supported 64 bit Macs, and mine is surely on the > list. > > Should I worry about booting into 64 bit mode? > > If so, how would you make it so that it boots into 64 bit mode every > time, and not one that you would have to tell it too. > > Right now, the only way I know of to boot into 64 bit mode, is to > start up, and hold 6 and 4 keys down. > > Take care. > > Fonzie > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: choppy reading in mail
Well Fonzie, seems you have enough ram and horsepower, so that is not your issue. I still have not encountered this problem, but I have encountered certain times when apps become busy with no reason that I can determine. I suspect there are some bumps to be worked out despite all the testing that has been done. On Aug 30, 2009, at 12:14 PM, Fonzie wrote: > > Hi there Scott, how are youd oing? > > Sorry for the late reply. > > I noticed that Mail added all my AIM iMap folders upon installing Snow > Leopard, and I just saw them just now. > > I was only used to seeing "Inbox", and now it shows all my folders > associated with AIM Mail, like Spam, and such. > > A lot of the message from the list went into the Spam folder, so I am > fixing that just now. > > As for what kind of mac I have. > > I bought my mac in August of 2008 > > So I have the folllowing: > > iMac Core 2 Duo 2.66GHZ > 4G Ram > ATI HD2600 Pro > > If there is anything else, let me know. > > Again, I apologize for the delayed response. > > Take care > > Fonzie > > > On Aug 30, 2009, at 4:57 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> >> Fonzie, what type of Mac do you have? I'm not encountering this >> issue, >> but I am looking to see if there is any patterns perhaps. Did you do >> a clean install or upgrade? >> On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Fonzie wrote: >> >>> >>> I second the no issue with choppy reading area. >>> >>> The sub menu thing? >>> >>> I have seen that happen once or twice. >>> >>> I mainly see it when I pull up the main menu bar though, where apple >>> and program related menus are located. What seems to happen is, >>> VoiceOver will stop speaking here and there, and only when >>> scrolling. >>> This only happens if I go into the menu bar, pull down any menu of >>> my >>> choosing, and read it's contents. Then, I leave the menu bar, and >>> immediately pull it up once more, and pull down a menu of my >>> choosing, >>> VoiceOver begins the small silence issue, even when scrolling >>> through >>> the menu items. >>> >>> For now, I just solve this by doing the following. ONce I attempt >>> to >>> go into the menu bar the second time, I wait a couple of seconds, >>> and >>> pull down the menu of my choice. Either that, or I pull down the >>> menu >>> I want, and then wait a couple of seconds, and start scrolling >>> afterwards. >>> >>> Take care. >>> >>> Fonzie >>> On Aug 29, 2009, at 5:24 PM, Scott Howell wrote: >>> Funny, I'm having no issues with submenus in Mail or any other app I have used so far. There seems to be some slightly roughness to the reading, but not sure what the cause is and I noticed it only as a slight thing, but of course level of annoyance is subjective for sure. On Aug 29, 2009, at 6:08 PM, Brett Campbell wrote: > > Yes, I'm glad you mentioned this. The mail is read choppy. Alex > reads smooth as ever in Safari. I currently only have my rate at > 50, > so I don't think rate is causing it. I'm also having no luck > getting > sub menus to work, Such as when I try to move a message to another > box. > > Brett > > > On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:50 AM, John J Herzog wrote: > >> >> Hi all, >> I'm liking the snow leopard update so far, but I'm running into >> an >> annoyance with mail. Since the update, I noticed that voiceover >> reads >> messages much more choppy than before. Specifically, it pauses >> too >> long when it encounters a new line in the middle of text. Is >> there >> an >> option to have voiceover keep speaking normally as if that new >> line >> did not occur in the middle of a sentence? >> Thanks for your help, >> >> John >> >>> > > >> > >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
