Re: Reminder for crm114 translation updates
> "CP" == Christian Perrier writes: CP> Currently existing but incomplete languages: cs No need to wait for this, I'll update it myself as the package maintainer when updating the package (I speak Czech). -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-i18n-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
I18n - status, plans, jobs?
Hi, we have formed a group of people in Czech Republic and Slovakia interested in Debian internationalization (two Debian maintainers and several non-maintainers). Lack of national support is a big problem of free operating systems in our countries and we would like to help removing this drawback in Debian. We had some discussion about short term and long term topics. Of course, we would firstly like to know what i18n support is available right know and what i18n plans already exist. AFAIK, there is a support mostly for translating messages (boot floppies, dselect) and possibly some language selection at boot time. This could be a little more complicated for us than for people in Western Europe, because our languages belong to ISO Latin 2 encoding, which raises some problems not known for Latin 1 languages (fonts, etc.). (We feel that proper environment setup is currently more important for Czech/Slovak speaking Debian users than translations.) Could someone point me to existing Debian i18n projects please? What can we do for our languages already before Debian 2.0? What projects can we help? What future i18n plans exist? Are they some people especially from Latin 2 countries around Debian i18n? Our resources are not much big, but we feel i18n being very important topic and want to do as much as possible in this area. Thanks, Milan Zamazal -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Why don't we put the .po template in /usr/doc/package ?
>>>>> "YD" == Yann Dirson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: YD: Giovanni Bortolozzo writes: :: :: All po files waste at most a Mbyte on the disk: I think it isn't :: so much space, don't you. Perhaps if someone can simple find a :: po file to translate in his system, there will be more than 50 :: translators in all the world. YD: Yes, the more visibility the translation project gets, the YD: sooner we'll have a fully i18n'd distrib. I agree. If I could find *.po files somewhere on my disk (no, I don't have time to bother with fetching and exploring source packages), I'd consider to translate several of them myself. Milan Zamazal -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Languages for Description
>>>>> "YD" == Yann Dirson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: YD: While we're talking about language issues and people not YD: speaking english: if we want Debian to be one day a valid choice YD: for a lambda user in a random country, we *will* have to work YD: out some mechanism that allows translated Descriptions: fields. I've heard RedHat uses .po file for this purpose. Perhaps dpkg, APT, and dselect could use gettext for package descriptions too? Milan Zamazal -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package Descrption I18N Proposal
>>>>> "KM" == Keita Maehara <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: KM> Any comments are welcome. This proposal sounds basically reasonably to me. However I can see some problems with per package translations: - it could be difficult for maintainers to collect translations from many translators to various languages as number of Debian languages will grow - many small translated files in a package - it would be more difficult for translators to translate many single files from different packages than a single Package file - anonymous contributors could incorporate abusive translations into packages and maintainer would sign them Maybe some of these problems could be solved if there was one coordinator with a status of Debian maintainer for each language. He would collect translations and from time to time sign some collection of translated descriptions and upload it. dinstall could check signature and then attach translations to appropriate packages. However this would require change of package format, which is introduction of further problems. I don't know how GNU translation teams work exactly, maybe we could get some experience of them. Could someone elaborate? BTW, we work on translation of Packages into Czech and also can see lack of any good way of incorporating the translated Packages into Debian. Milan Zamazal
Re: Package Descrption I18N Proposal
>>>>> "KM" == Keita Maehara <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: KM> First, we have to include translated description in each KM> package, then generate Packages-$LANG, because we cannot always KM> get Packages-$LANG (we cannot get translated description in KM> doing "dpkg --info" for a new package without updating the KM> package database, for example). I agree description translations belong *logically* into their packages. KM> Then where should the translated description reside? I've only KM> installed a few files named debian/description.$LANG into KM> debian/tmp/DEBIAN directory when the package was built, and it KM> works fine. Well, how did they reach this destination? When I (as a foo package maintainer) want to release new version of foo with updated description, do I have to wait until I receive *all* the updated translations (at least one month)? Or should I upload the package and after receiving translations make new version? Possibly to be recompiled then needlessly for other architectures? Or possibly with new description making received translations immediately obsolete? Or is it no problem, since descriptions do not change much? Maybe, but *logically*, each package should have exactly corresponding description translations. :-) If descriptions were parts of upstream packages, there would be no problem with your proposal. However I don't think this happens soon (if ever), so I have to look at descriptions as a Debian specific add-on. I can see the following problems with description translations in packages: - The "synchronization" problem mentioned above. - Extra work for package maintainer. Currently, if we simply get Packages and translate it, we need no maintainer assistance. We can also update translations ourselves. The "dpkg -I" problem with all descriptions together in one place is not fatal. You can either have older translation available or you can get the latest destrans-X.Y.Z.deb package. I'm not sure which approach is better. Could you please elaborate on the two problems mentioned above? Milan Zamazal
Re: Package Descrption I18N Proposal
>>>>> "KM" == Keita Maehara <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> - The "synchronization" problem mentioned above. KM> This will never be avoided as far as we translate the KM> description. However with centralized translations there are less synchronization points (no back incorporation of translations, no waiting for several languages). KM> If we use destrans-X.Y.Z.deb package or similar method, all of KM> the translation will go to the destrans-X.Y.Z.deb maintainer and KM> he have to do a (perhaps more) hard work. Yes, it's more hard work for the translation maintainer, but it's less work than sum of little work of all maintainers. So it's more work efficient in summary. It needn't be more efficient in quality. KM> I understood that we cannot do a thing beyond the current KM> framework (but develop packages). Well, so you say Debian is not a working project anymore? I don't agree but since it's about feelings, we can't conclude on this. :-) Anyway, IMHO Packages translation is an important issue needed for moving Debian in next directions. So let's to solve it in some way. Milan Zamazal
Translation of Packages
There has been some discussion about package description translations. I can't remember any conclusion was accepted. Any suggestions what to do about it? Milan Zamazal
