Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
On Wed, Dec 05, 2018 at 08:47:24AM +0100, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote: > Hi Ingo, > > On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 12:34 AM Ingo Jürgensmann > wrote: > > Am 04.12.2018 um 23:32 schrieb Johny Five : > > > You mean A3000 or A4000 with some onboard/cpu accelerator FastRam + > > > ZorroRAM/BigRAM in Zorro3 slot? > > > On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 11:23 PM Michael Schmitz > > > wrote: > > > anyone on this list with an Amiga running Linux that has both Zorro-II > > > and Zorro-III RAM installed, so would trigger the warning message: > > > > > > "%dK of Zorro II memory will not be used as system memory\n" > > > > > > early during booting the kernel? > > > > > > Would be nice to get Geert's patch (see > > > <20181204195014.21461-1-ge...@linux-m68k.org>) tested on such a system. > > > > Yes, this should be the same with the BigRamPlus extension, except that on > > Amigas the address scheme is of course different and Amigas will use memory > > priorities (the faster the memory is, the higher the priority is). > > ChipRam should be priority 0, normal (fake) FastRam is about priority 20 or > > so while real FastRam on an accel board like Cyberstorm MK2 is about > > priority 40 or so. > > These priorities are purely a matter for AmigaOS, and do not apply to Linux. > > A proper test machine would be an A3000 or A4000 (or T variant), > equipped with a Zorro II expansion card that contains Zorro II RAM > (e.g. a combined SCSI/memory expansion card). I should still have a GVP Series-II SCSI controller with 8M RAM (my first expansion card, perhaps I can still find the huge 100MB disk I bought with it). I do also have an A3000, but this machine has no expansion card, ie only the built 030 CPU, 1(?)MB RAM, no harddisk, no NIC, ... so no Z-II RAM? But if we would place this card in crest or kullervo, we'd have a suitable test machine? Christian
Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
Hi Christian,
On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 9:27 AM Christian T. Steigies wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 05, 2018 at 08:47:24AM +0100, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 12:34 AM Ingo Jürgensmann
> > wrote:
> > > Am 04.12.2018 um 23:32 schrieb Johny Five :
> > > > You mean A3000 or A4000 with some onboard/cpu accelerator FastRam +
> > > > ZorroRAM/BigRAM in Zorro3 slot?
> > > > On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 11:23 PM Michael Schmitz
> > > > wrote:
> > > > anyone on this list with an Amiga running Linux that has both Zorro-II
> > > > and Zorro-III RAM installed, so would trigger the warning message:
> > > >
> > > > "%dK of Zorro II memory will not be used as system memory\n"
> > > >
> > > > early during booting the kernel?
> > > >
> > > > Would be nice to get Geert's patch (see
> > > > <20181204195014.21461-1-ge...@linux-m68k.org>) tested on such a system.
> > >
> > > Yes, this should be the same with the BigRamPlus extension, except that
> > > on Amigas the address scheme is of course different and Amigas will use
> > > memory priorities (the faster the memory is, the higher the priority is).
> > > ChipRam should be priority 0, normal (fake) FastRam is about priority 20
> > > or so while real FastRam on an accel board like Cyberstorm MK2 is about
> > > priority 40 or so.
> >
> > These priorities are purely a matter for AmigaOS, and do not apply to Linux.
> >
> > A proper test machine would be an A3000 or A4000 (or T variant),
> > equipped with a Zorro II expansion card that contains Zorro II RAM
> > (e.g. a combined SCSI/memory expansion card).
>
> I should still have a GVP Series-II SCSI controller with 8M RAM (my first
> expansion card, perhaps I can still find the huge 100MB disk I bought with
> it). I do also have an A3000, but this machine has no expansion card, ie
> only the built 030 CPU, 1(?)MB RAM, no harddisk, no NIC, ... so no Z-II RAM?
> But if we would place this card in crest or kullervo, we'd have a suitable
> test machine?
Adding the GVP Series-II SCSI controller with 8M RAM to the A3000 should
do the trick. You only need to build and boot a small kernel with
Amiga support.
Nothing fancy (no userspace) needed.
Thanks!
Gr{oetje,eeting}s,
Geert
--
Geert Uytterhoeven -- There's lots of Linux beyond ia32 -- ge...@linux-m68k.org
In personal conversations with technical people, I call myself a hacker. But
when I'm talking to journalists I just say "programmer" or something like that.
-- Linus Torvalds
Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
Am 05.12.2018 um 09:27 schrieb Christian T. Steigies : >> A proper test machine would be an A3000 or A4000 (or T variant), >> equipped with a Zorro II expansion card that contains Zorro II RAM >> (e.g. a combined SCSI/memory expansion card). > I should still have a GVP Series-II SCSI controller with 8M RAM (my first > expansion card, perhaps I can still find the huge 100MB disk I bought with > it). I do also have an A3000, but this machine has no expansion card, ie > only the built 030 CPU, 1(?)MB RAM, no harddisk, no NIC, ... so no Z-II RAM? > But if we would place this card in crest or kullervo, we'd have a suitable > test machine? About the NIC: just buy an X-Surf100. That’s the easy part. ;) About ZIII RAM: I still should have a spare BRP available for that purpose of a porter box. But then again it would be a slow memory (12 MB/s vs. >60 MB/s), so the biggest problem is to get a 060 card, which are quite expensive on Ebay, but there are some cards on auction at the moment: - GVP G-Force 040 for A3000: https://www.ebay.de/itm/GVP-G-Force-3040-fur-Amiga-3000/163410730541 - Cyberstorm PPC/060: https://www.ebay.de/itm/AMIGA-Phase-5-CyberStorm-PPC-233MHz-mit-Rev-6-68060-und-128MB-RAM-TOP/202523892233 The GVP card might be cheaper, but it is only a 040 and I think you’ll need expensive, special GVP memory modules whereas the Cyberstorm already comes with 128 MB PS/2 memory, but will rise in cost for that auction. Sometimes you can even buy ZIP-TO-DIMM adaptors on Ebay, but I’m not sure about that, because of the fragile nature of ZIP chip legs… About ZII memory… I still might have a ZII card with some memory on it, but memory with <5 MB/s bandwidth? Come on...!! ;) About disk: there is the Budda IDE card for quite a few bugs: https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/shop/product/buddha-ide.html : > The Linux- and NetBSD drivers for older versions of the Buddha controller can > be used on this new version without change. I still need to re-install Arrakis/Spice. @Adrian: do you have a fresh installation image for me or is that one from the meeting in Essen still good? -- Ciao... //http://blog.windfluechter.net Ingo \X/ XMPP: i...@jabber.windfluechter.net gpg pubkey: http://www.juergensmann.de/ij_public_key.asc
Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
Am 05.12.2018 um 08:47 schrieb Geert Uytterhoeven : >> Yes, this should be the same with the BigRamPlus extension, except that on >> Amigas the address scheme is of course different and Amigas will use memory >> priorities (the faster the memory is, the higher the priority is). >> ChipRam should be priority 0, normal (fake) FastRam is about priority 20 or >> so while real FastRam on an accel board like Cyberstorm MK2 is about >> priority 40 or so. > These priorities are purely a matter for AmigaOS, and do not apply to Linux. Valid point! :-) -- Ciao... //http://blog.windfluechter.net Ingo \X/ XMPP: i...@jabber.windfluechter.net gpg pubkey: http://www.juergensmann.de/ij_public_key.asc
Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
Hi Ingo,
On Wed, Dec 5, 2018 at 9:56 AM Ingo Jürgensmann wrote:
> Am 05.12.2018 um 09:27 schrieb Christian T. Steigies :
> >> A proper test machine would be an A3000 or A4000 (or T variant),
> >> equipped with a Zorro II expansion card that contains Zorro II RAM
> >> (e.g. a combined SCSI/memory expansion card).
> > I should still have a GVP Series-II SCSI controller with 8M RAM (my first
> > expansion card, perhaps I can still find the huge 100MB disk I bought with
> > it). I do also have an A3000, but this machine has no expansion card, ie
> > only the built 030 CPU, 1(?)MB RAM, no harddisk, no NIC, ... so no Z-II RAM?
> > But if we would place this card in crest or kullervo, we'd have a suitable
> > test machine?
>
> About the NIC: just buy an X-Surf100. That’s the easy part. ;)
>
> About ZIII RAM: I still should have a spare BRP available for that purpose of
> a porter box. But then again it would be a slow memory (12 MB/s vs. >60
> MB/s), so the biggest problem is to get a 060 card, which are quite expensive
> on Ebay, but there are some cards on auction at the moment:
>
> - GVP G-Force 040 for A3000:
> https://www.ebay.de/itm/GVP-G-Force-3040-fur-Amiga-3000/163410730541
> - Cyberstorm PPC/060:
> https://www.ebay.de/itm/AMIGA-Phase-5-CyberStorm-PPC-233MHz-mit-Rev-6-68060-und-128MB-RAM-TOP/202523892233
>
> The GVP card might be cheaper, but it is only a 040 and I think you’ll need
> expensive, special GVP memory modules whereas the Cyberstorm already comes
> with 128 MB PS/2 memory, but will rise in cost for that auction.
> Sometimes you can even buy ZIP-TO-DIMM adaptors on Ebay, but I’m not sure
> about that, because of the fragile nature of ZIP chip legs…
> About disk: there is the Budda IDE card for quite a few bugs:
> https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/shop/product/buddha-ide.html :
> > The Linux- and NetBSD drivers for older versions of the Buddha controller
> > can be used on this new version without change.
None of the above should be needed to test this. A plain A3000/030 with
Zorro II expansion card with Zorro II memory should suffice.
> About ZII memory… I still might have a ZII card with some memory on it, but
> memory with <5 MB/s bandwidth? Come on...!! ;)
The point is that the kernel (probably) crashes if there is Zorro II
memory present.
There is no plan to make everything run from that slow memory ;-)
Hmm, perhaps I can just fake Zorro II memory in a memfile, and test it on my
A4000?
Gr{oetje,eeting}s,
Geert
--
Geert Uytterhoeven -- There's lots of Linux beyond ia32 -- ge...@linux-m68k.org
In personal conversations with technical people, I call myself a hacker. But
when I'm talking to journalists I just say "programmer" or something like that.
-- Linus Torvalds
Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
Am 05.12.2018 um 10:16 schrieb Geert Uytterhoeven : >> About disk: there is the Budda IDE card for quite a few bugs: >> https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/shop/product/buddha-ide.html : >>> The Linux- and NetBSD drivers for older versions of the Buddha controller >>> can be used on this new version without change. > None of the above should be needed to test this. A plain A3000/030 with > Zorro II expansion card with Zorro II memory should suffice. Of course… but I assumed that Christian obtained that A3000 for a purpose other than having a nice looking brick on his table… ;) >> About ZII memory… I still might have a ZII card with some memory on it, but >> memory with <5 MB/s bandwidth? Come on...!! ;) > The point is that the kernel (probably) crashes if there is Zorro II > memory present. > There is no plan to make everything run from that slow memory ;-) > Hmm, perhaps I can just fake Zorro II memory in a memfile, and test it on my > A4000? Or maybe use the memory of a graphic card like a PicassoII or so (if available)? -- Ciao... //http://blog.windfluechter.net Ingo \X/ XMPP: i...@jabber.windfluechter.net gpg pubkey: http://www.juergensmann.de/ij_public_key.asc
Re: Amigas with both Zorro-II and Zorro-III RAM?
On Wed, Dec 05, 2018 at 11:22:00AM +0100, Ingo J?rgensmann wrote: > Am 05.12.2018 um 10:16 schrieb Geert Uytterhoeven : > > >> About disk: there is the Budda IDE card for quite a few bugs: > >> https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/shop/product/buddha-ide.html : > >>> The Linux- and NetBSD drivers for older versions of the Buddha controller > >>> can be used on this new version without change. > > None of the above should be needed to test this. A plain A3000/030 with > > Zorro II expansion card with Zorro II memory should suffice. > > Of course??? but I assumed that Christian obtained that A3000 for a purpose > other than having a nice looking brick on his table??? ;) I spent already way too much on outdated m68k hardware. I don't see myself using it much, even if it had an 060. I have already a fully equipped Amiga, Atari and Mac sitting around. The A3k was free, I just could not see it go into the trash. If there were a reasonable priced FPGA accelerator, we could talk again. But the brick looks quite nice next to the Next cube :-) > >> About ZII memory??? I still might have a ZII card with some memory on it, > >> but memory with <5 MB/s bandwidth? Come on...!! ;) > > The point is that the kernel (probably) crashes if there is Zorro II > > memory present. > > There is no plan to make everything run from that slow memory ;-) > > Hmm, perhaps I can just fake Zorro II memory in a memfile, and test it on my > > A4000? > > Or maybe use the memory of a graphic card like a PicassoII or so (if > available)? I should have a spare PicassoII as well, it did not make much of a difference when I bought the PIV for my A2k. I said, I spent already too much on m68k... So I need to get amiboot and a kernel image on a disk? That would be a great use for the 100MB IDE flash modules. I could use the Buddha from the A2k to connect them if needed. Christian
Re: libc6:m68k 2.28-1
On Tue, 4 Dec 2018, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
> On 12/3/18 8:13 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
> > The problem turns out to be dash. I got things working again by replacing
> > /bin/sh and /bin/dash with symlinks to bash and then running
> > 'apt --fix-broken install' to finish the upgrade.
>
> Thanks for the heads-up! I just ran into this problem with qemu-system but
> not with qemu-user. I wonder whether it's related to [1].
>
It happens in aranym too. I tried strace,
execve("/root/dash", ["/root/dash", "-c", "/bin/echo"], ["PWD=/",
"HOME=/", "BOOT_IMAGE=vmlinux", "TERM=linux", "SHLVL=1",
"_=/usr/bin/strace"]) = 0
[...]
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
clone(child_stack=NULL,
flags=CLONE_CHILD_CLEARTID|CLONE_CHILD_SETTID|SIGCHLD, child_tidptr=NULL) = 415
wait4(-1,
0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
--- SIGCHLD {si_signo=SIGCHLD, si_code=CLD_EXITED, si_pid=415, si_uid=0,
si_status=0, si_utime=0, si_stime=2} ---
rt_sigreturn({mask=[]}) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
The last two lines loop indefinitely, and dash never teminates, even
though the child process has terminated already (SIGCHLD can be seen
above).
--
> Adrian
>
> > [1] https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=903514
>
>
Re: libc6:m68k 2.28-1
On 12/6/18 12:10 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
> It happens in aranym too. I tried strace,
>
> execve("/root/dash", ["/root/dash", "-c", "/bin/echo"], ["PWD=/",
> "HOME=/", "BOOT_IMAGE=vmlinux", "TERM=linux", "SHLVL=1",
> "_=/usr/bin/strace"]) = 0
> (...)
> The last two lines loop indefinitely, and dash never teminates, even
> though the child process has terminated already (SIGCHLD can be seen
> above).
Maybe Andreas knows about this issue. I have CC'ed him.
Adrian
--
.''`. John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
: :' : Debian Developer - glaub...@debian.org
`. `' Freie Universitaet Berlin - glaub...@physik.fu-berlin.de
`-GPG: 62FF 8A75 84E0 2956 9546 0006 7426 3B37 F5B5 F913
Re: libc6:m68k 2.28-1
Hi,
On 12/6/18 1:10 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
On Tue, 4 Dec 2018, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 12/3/18 8:13 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
The problem turns out to be dash. I got things working again by replacing
/bin/sh and /bin/dash with symlinks to bash and then running
'apt --fix-broken install' to finish the upgrade.
Thanks for the heads-up! I just ran into this problem with qemu-system but
not with qemu-user. I wonder whether it's related to [1].
It happens in aranym too. I tried strace,
execve("/root/dash", ["/root/dash", "-c", "/bin/echo"], ["PWD=/",
"HOME=/", "BOOT_IMAGE=vmlinux", "TERM=linux", "SHLVL=1",
"_=/usr/bin/strace"]) = 0
[...]
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
clone(child_stack=NULL,
flags=CLONE_CHILD_CLEARTID|CLONE_CHILD_SETTID|SIGCHLD, child_tidptr=NULL) = 415
wait4(-1,
0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
--- SIGCHLD {si_signo=SIGCHLD, si_code=CLD_EXITED, si_pid=415, si_uid=0,
si_status=0, si_utime=0, si_stime=2} ---
rt_sigreturn({mask=[]}) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
The last two lines loop indefinitely, and dash never teminates, even
though the child process has terminated already (SIGCHLD can be seen
above).
With Hatari (68000-68060 Atari) emulator, you should be able profile
what kernel is doing at CPU instruction level:
https://hg.tuxfamily.org/mercurialroot/hatari/hatari/raw-file/tip/doc/manual.html#Profiler
I don't think anybody's tried running full Linux with Hatari yet
(only no-MMU ones), but it shares CPU core with WinUAE, which has
been tested with NetBSD & Linux, so Linux "should" work fine e.g.
with Hatari's Atari TT emulation.
I can help with anything Hatari related (first thing, change crypto
from sha e.g. to md5, otherwise logging in takes ages, even if cycle-
exact emulation is disabled. Higher emulation accuracy and no JIT,
makes Hatari *much* slower than Aranym).
Note: for 030/040/060 MMU + prefetch + i/d-cache emulation, you should
build Mercurial version of Hatari:
hg clone http://hg.tuxfamily.org/mercurialroot/hatari/hatari
(Latest 2.1 Hatari release emulates either MMU or cache, not both at
the same time, is quite old and its MMU emulation had several bugs.
Aranym emulates only 040, and AFAIK doesn't have any cache emulation.)
- Eero
Re: libc6:m68k 2.28-1
On Thu, 6 Dec 2018, Eero Tamminen wrote:
> On 12/6/18 1:10 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
> > On Tue, 4 Dec 2018, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
> > > On 12/3/18 8:13 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
> > > > The problem turns out to be dash. I got things working again by
> > > > replacing /bin/sh and /bin/dash with symlinks to bash and then
> > > > running 'apt --fix-broken install' to finish the upgrade.
> > >
> > > Thanks for the heads-up! I just ran into this problem with
> > > qemu-system but not with qemu-user. I wonder whether it's related to
> > > [1].
> > >
> >
> > It happens in aranym too. I tried strace,
> >
> > execve("/root/dash", ["/root/dash", "-c", "/bin/echo"], ["PWD=/",
> > "HOME=/", "BOOT_IMAGE=vmlinux", "TERM=linux", "SHLVL=1",
> > "_=/usr/bin/strace"]) = 0
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > clone(child_stack=NULL,
> > flags=CLONE_CHILD_CLEARTID|CLONE_CHILD_SETTID|SIGCHLD, child_tidptr=NULL) =
> > 415
> > wait4(-1,
> > 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
> > --- SIGCHLD {si_signo=SIGCHLD, si_code=CLD_EXITED, si_pid=415, si_uid=0,
> > si_status=0, si_utime=0, si_stime=2} ---
> > rt_sigreturn({mask=[]}) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
> > get_thread_area() = 0xc0022490
> > wait4(-1, 0xefdaba3e, 0, NULL) = -1 ECHILD (No child processes)
> >
> > The last two lines loop indefinitely, and dash never teminates, even
> > though the child process has terminated already (SIGCHLD can be seen
> > above).
>
> With Hatari (68000-68060 Atari) emulator, you should be able profile
> what kernel is doing at CPU instruction level:
> https://hg.tuxfamily.org/mercurialroot/hatari/hatari/raw-file/tip/doc/manual.html#Profiler
>
I suspect qemu-user avoids the problem by intercepting syscalls (implying
a 68k kernel bug).
And if a kernel bug was somehow exposed by recent changes to dash, I'd
expect hatari would behave the same as aranym and qemu-system.
> I don't think anybody's tried running full Linux with Hatari yet (only
> no-MMU ones), but it shares CPU core with WinUAE, which has been tested
> with NetBSD & Linux, so Linux "should" work fine e.g. with Hatari's
> Atari TT emulation.
>
> I can help with anything Hatari related (first thing, change crypto from
> sha e.g. to md5, otherwise logging in takes ages, even if cycle- exact
> emulation is disabled. Higher emulation accuracy and no JIT, makes
> Hatari *much* slower than Aranym).
>
> Note: for 030/040/060 MMU + prefetch + i/d-cache emulation, you should
> build Mercurial version of Hatari:
> hg clone http://hg.tuxfamily.org/mercurialroot/hatari/hatari
>
> (Latest 2.1 Hatari release emulates either MMU or cache, not both at
> the same time, is quite old and its MMU emulation had several bugs.
> Aranym emulates only 040, and AFAIK doesn't have any cache emulation.)
>
Sounds very promising!
--
>
> - Eero
>
>
