Stus-List Folding Prop

[Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List]

My boat (1990 34 + AKA 34/36) came with a Martec Folder in bad need of a
re-build (1/2 inch of play at the blade tips) . It was not mounted and the
boat had a fixed pitch 3 blades.  I sent it for a rebuild and Martec
recommended that we should change the specs from 16D X 12P to 16D X 14P  so
I went with it and ended-up with a like new refurbished hub and new blades.

After being in the yard since late Feb I finally splashed back in this past
Tuesday (Yeah!  More on that later)  and tested it.

It does take a bit of revs to get some action in reverse but I think it's
not bad at all.   My observation compared to the fixed 3 blades is that the
acceleration from a dead stop is somewhat sluggish BOTH forwards and
reverse, to tell you the truth I don't think either is better than the
other,   I think that there might be a perception that reverse is worse (Or
much worse) because it's typically used as a brake and is needed right now.
Once that is understood, with a modicum of care and planning I don't see
how that will impede the boat's maneuverability in any significant way, at
least for what I'm doing.

As for Martec's advice on pitch, it appears spot-on.  The max revs are
right between 3400 and 3500 which is the same as what I had on the 3 bladed
prop and as I was told, correct for my engine (3GM30F) .  I don't know
about the SOG yet as I'm not quite done with the new instruments install.

The only fly in the ointment  is more vibrations.  It does not feel like
the drivetrain is shaking apart but there is a noticeable increase in the
vibration level at all RPM's.  I called Martec and was told to start by
looking for the usual suspects:  Engine mounts, Cutlass bearing (Mine is
like new), and engine  / shaft alignment.  The 3 bladed prop did vibrate at
2900 rpm and up so the Martec guy says the "More flywheel like" folder is
amplifying the issue.  We'll see.

I have seen the thread on the guy whom had a folder vibration problem on
his 34/36 where the blades were too close to the hull..  My vibration is
not near as bad as what he described (At least I don't think so) and the
Martec folder was a factory option on my boat so on this I assume that we
should be OK on the blade distance to the hull.

The engine mounts look fine but the alignment probably has not been done in
over 10-15 years if ever so It's probably a good thing to check it out.

Yet.. Another project to add to the 45 items list I have so far for
2014.  :-(

I'll report back on how she sails later.  I'm hoping to be sailing on
Sunday and Monday,

-Francois
1990 34+  Take Five
Lake Lanier, Georgia
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Stus-List Reattaching compass to Edson pedestal

[Eric Frank via CnC-List]

In putting the pedestal back together after replacing the cables, I've run into 
a problem in securing my Ritche compass to the top of the pedestal.  It is 
normally held there with two small machine screws that screw into knurled 
"nuts" that were fastened to the underside of the lip at the top of the 
pedestal.  These "nuts" have become disconnected from the pedestal (I managed 
to catch them) so I don't know how to refasten them to the pedestal.  Are there 
supposed to be inserts on these "nuts" that press into the top of the pedestal 
to hold them in place?  Or is there another way to provide the screws with 
something to screw into?  Thanks.

Eric
Cat's Paw
C&C 35 Mk II
Mattapoisett, MA

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Re: Stus-List Yanmar 3QM30 thermostat for converted system

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

The soot builds up partly because the engine is running too cool.

Operating temp should be at least 165 to 180 F.

Rick Brass

Sent from my iPad

> On May 21, 2014, at 23:43, Josh Muckley via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Why change?  Just let the engine run cooler.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> 1989 C&C 37+
> S/V Sea Hawk
> Solomons, MD
> 
>> On May 21, 2014 2:07 PM, "PME via CnC-List"  wrote:
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I am converting Yanmar 3QM30 raw water cooling system into a fresh water 
>> cooling system with a Sen-Dure heat exchanger.  The current thermostat is 
>> Yanmar part number 105582-49200.The fresh water thermostat listed for 
>> the 3QM30F looks like a completely different size thermostat.Does anyone 
>> know the Yanmar part number for a fresh water (i.e. higher temperature) 
>> thermostat which will fit a raw water 3QM30 system?
>> 
>> Thanks for any help.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> Paul E.
>> 1981 C&C Landfall 38
>> S/V Johanna Rose
>> Carrabelle, FL
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: Stus-List Reattaching compass to Edson pedestal

[Wally Bryant via CnC-List]

I'd clean it up the surfaces with a solvent, then use a little dab of 
Marine-Tex to glue the nuts into place.  Dip the screws in oil of just 
about any type (I often use vegetable cooking oil because it's there) 
and screw them in and let it set up.


Wal

you wrote:

Or is there another way to provide the screws with something to screw into?  
Thanks.



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Re: Stus-List Folding Prop

[Pierre Tremblay via CnC-List]

I also have a 2 blade folding Martec on my 38-3. I dont remember the size of 
it, I'll have to dig that from my pictures. It is original (26 years old) and 
has been rebuilt only once by the PO.

I have some vibration only at specific RPM. It take a bit more RPM to bite in 
reverse, but I'm getting used to it.

I never tried full forward RPM yet, but it push the boat at 6.7 kts at 2400 RPM.


Pierre Tremblay 
Avalanche #54988 
C&C38-3 WK, hull #76___
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Re: Stus-List Folding prop

[jtsails via CnC-List]

Andy,
Is your engine a direct drive or does it have the reduction gear? Lots of 
discussion about props for direct drive engines on the Moyer Marine forum, but 
most people seem to favor the Indigo 3 blade fixed. 
James Taylor
Delaney
1976 C&C 38
Oriental, NC
  - Original Message - 
  From: Charles Nelson via CnC-List 
  To: Jerome Tauber ; cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
  Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2014 8:43 PM
  Subject: Re: Stus-List Folding prop


  I sprung for a Gori Racing folder about 3 years ago after some internet 
research on prop drag. The Gori's drag was so low as to be almost immeasurable 
compared to almost all others on the market in the Yachting article.


  It or any other prop must be matched to the engine/transmission/boat 
displacement and room to spin without interference from the hull which can lead 
to cavitation or other problems.


  It takes some time for it to get the boat moving in reverse but likely not 
more than other 2 blade folders.


  At yearly haul outs, it is barnacle free and after the teeth are cleaned up 
and greased, it works like new. Of course, my boat bottom and prop are cleaned 
no less than monthly and it stays in the water year round.


  Charlie Nelson
  Water Phantom
  C&C 36 XL/kcb





  Sent from my iPad

  On May 22, 2014, at 8:26 PM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List 
 wrote:


Every time this discussion comes up I mention the Kiwi prop which is less 
expensive and more advanced than the others but to no avail.  A friend put one 
on his Sweden 38 and claims he gained a knot of speed under sail and under 
power.   They are lighter and non-metalic so do not corrode.  Made in New 
Zeland.  Check their web site. kiwiprops.com.  Jerry - C&C 27-5.  






-Original Message-
From: Dennis C. via CnC-List 
To: andrew rothweiler ; CnClist 
Sent: Thu, May 22, 2014 6:42 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List Folding prop


Gee, Andy,


I'm really surprised nobody replied yet.  There's usually a decent 
discussion on folders.  Most fall into two camps, the Martec detractors and the 
Flex-O-Fold supporters.  I swing a Martec 2 blade folder on Touche'.  As a 
racer I like it but many do not because of its perceived lack of reverse power.


Call each supplier and get recommendations and pricing.



Dennis C.

Touche' 35-1 #83

Mandeville, LA








On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:04 AM, andrew rothweiler via CnC-List 
 wrote:

  Hello, can someone  give advice on selecting a folding prop that would be 
matched with an Atomic 4 in a 35-2?
  Thanks in advance.
  Andy R

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Stus-List Rebedding toe rail

[Glen Eddie via CnC-List]

Has anyone rebed the toe rail on a 35 Mk I.  Thanks in advance.
Sent from my BlackBerry® PlayBook™
www.blackberry.com


From: "jtsails via CnC-List" 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Sent: 23 May, 2014 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Folding prop

Andy,
Is your engine a direct drive or does it have the reduction gear? Lots of 
discussion about props for direct drive engines on the Moyer Marine forum, but 
most people seem to favor the Indigo 3 blade fixed.
James Taylor
Delaney
1976 C&C 38
Oriental, NC


Glen Eddie
Tel: 416-777-5357
Fax: 1-888-812-2557
ged...@torkinmanes.com
VCard

Torkin Manes LLP
Barristers & Solicitors

151 Yonge Street, Suite 1500
Toronto ON M5C 2W7
torkinmanes.com
Member of the International Alliance of Law Firms

This email message, and any attachments, is intended only for the named 
recipient(s) above and may contain content that is privileged, confidential 
and/or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this 
message in error, please notify the sender and delete this email message. Thank 
you.

- Original Message -
From: Charles Nelson via CnC-List
To: Jerome Tauber ; 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2014 8:43 PM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Folding prop

I sprung for a Gori Racing folder about 3 years ago after some internet 
research on prop drag. The Gori's drag was so low as to be almost immeasurable 
compared to almost all others on the market in the Yachting article.

It or any other prop must be matched to the engine/transmission/boat 
displacement and room to spin without interference from the hull which can lead 
to cavitation or other problems.

It takes some time for it to get the boat moving in reverse but likely not more 
than other 2 blade folders.

At yearly haul outs, it is barnacle free and after the teeth are cleaned up and 
greased, it works like new. Of course, my boat bottom and prop are cleaned no 
less than monthly and it stays in the water year round.

Charlie Nelson
Water Phantom
C&C 36 XL/kcb



Sent from my iPad

On May 22, 2014, at 8:26 PM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Every time this discussion comes up I mention the Kiwi prop which is less 
expensive and more advanced than the others but to no avail.  A friend put one 
on his Sweden 38 and claims he gained a knot of speed under sail and under 
power.   They are lighter and non-metalic so do not corrode.  Made in New 
Zeland.  Check their web site. kiwiprops.com.  Jerry - 
C&C 27-5.



-Original Message-
From: Dennis C. via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
To: andrew rothweiler mailto:andy...@att.net>>; CnClist 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Sent: Thu, May 22, 2014 6:42 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List Folding prop

Gee, Andy,

I'm really surprised nobody replied yet.  There's usually a decent discussion 
on folders.  Most fall into two camps, the Martec detractors and the 
Flex-O-Fold supporters.  I swing a Martec 2 blade folder on Touche'.  As a 
racer I like it but many do not because of its perceived lack of reverse power.

Call each supplier and get recommendations and pricing.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA




On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:04 AM, andrew rothweiler via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
Hello, can someone  give advice on selecting a folding prop that would be 
matched with an Atomic 4 in a 35-2?
Thanks in advance.
Andy R

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__

Re: Stus-List Folding prop

[David Jacobs via CnC-List]

Andy,

 

I have a Martec and it’s the first folding prop I’ve ever had. I had been 
nervous about it but besides sometimes having one  sometimes fold when going 
really slow in the harbor and having to hit reverse to spin it open, it’s been 
great. In reverse it’s more than adequate stopping the boat pulling into a slip 
which is to only time I need it and that’s rare since I’m normally on a mooring.

 

Dave J

Saltaire

C&C 35 MKIII

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2014 6:42 PM
To: andrew rothweiler; CnClist
Subject: Re: Stus-List Folding prop

 

Gee, Andy,

I'm really surprised nobody replied yet.  There's usually a decent discussion 
on folders.  Most fall into two camps, the Martec detractors and the 
Flex-O-Fold supporters.  I swing a Martec 2 blade folder on Touche'.  As a 
racer I like it but many do not because of its perceived lack of reverse power.

Call each supplier and get recommendations and pricing.

 

Dennis C.

Touche' 35-1 #83

Mandeville, LA

 

 

 

On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:04 AM, andrew rothweiler via CnC-List 
 wrote:

Hello, can someone  give advice on selecting a folding prop that would be 
matched with an Atomic 4 in a 35-2?

Thanks in advance.

Andy R


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Re: Stus-List Rebedding toe rail

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Hi Glen,

I've done the port side toe-rail. Starboard not leaking yet :)

No big deal except a few nuts are difficult to get at.
- remove toe rail, two parts
- clean up corrosion and repair with Devcon or other epoxy/metal 
repair compound

- sand repair areas and paint (I used flat black spray paint)
- apply butyl tape & reinstall (do not tighten hard, just a wee bit 
o' squeeze on butyl)

- rinse & go for a sail

Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1



At 05:11 AM 23/05/2014, you wrote:



Has anyone rebed the toe rail on a 35 Mk I.  Thanks in advance.

Tel: 416-777-5357
Fax: 1-888-812-2557
ged...@torkinmanes.com
VCard
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Re: Stus-List Reattaching compass to Edson pedestal

[Wally Bryant via CnC-List]

Stop.  I meant an 'itsy bitsy little teeny weeny' bit of Marine-Tex.

Sheesh.  One would think that no one ever read the story about 
Goldilocks and the Three Bears.


I wrote:

then use a little dab of Marine-Tex to glue the nuts into place.




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Stus-List What is it for? ???

[Eric Cahn via CnC-List]

I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole
seat and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the
bilge pump outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now
pumping out near gunwhale.

What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this
  currently annoying thing?

Eric Cahn
S/V Lattitudes
C&C 26
Washington, NC
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Re: Stus-List What is it for? ???

[Gary Nylander via CnC-List]

Could it be a propane box (for the tank)? Shouldn't drain into bilge, should be 
out of boat. But, maybe they built them all with the box and then diverted the 
drain if propane was installed??

Gary 
30-1


  - Original Message - 
  From: Eric Cahn via CnC-List 
  To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
  Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 3:32 PM
  Subject: Stus-List What is it for? ???


  I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole seat 
and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge pump 
outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out near 
gunwhale.

  What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   
currently annoying thing?

  Eric Cahn
  S/V Lattitudes
  C&C 26
  Washington, NC



--


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Re: Stus-List What is it for? ???

[David Donnelly via CnC-List]

On my boat which has the Vire 7 there is spot for the gas tank under the 
starboard hatch cover. It does have a drain that on my boat comes out just 
above the boot stripe on the starboard aft quarter. 

David
C&C 26 Mistress


Sent from Samsung Mobile

 Original message From: Eric Cahn via CnC-List 
 Date:05-23-2014  1:32 PM  (GMT-07:00) 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List What is it 
for? ??? 
I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole 
seat and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge 
pump outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out 
near gunwhale.

What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   
currently annoying thing?

Eric Cahn
S/V Lattitudes
C&C 26
Washington, NC___
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Re: Stus-List What is it for? ???

[Evan Morgan via CnC-List]

Eric,
We cut ours out last week. It gives us better access to that "locker" (really 
just open access to the engine compartment). It was easy. Trace around the 
inside of the wood frame with a sharpie, remove the frame, cut the panel out 
with a grinder, replace the frame.
Original intent, as far as we could tell, was for storage of things you don't 
mind getting wet. In other words, no purpose. :D

Evan
Wind Affair
C&C 26 Encounter 
Indianapolis

-Original Message-
From: "Eric Cahn via CnC-List" 
Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2014 3:33 PM
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Stus-List What is it for? ???

I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole seat 
and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge pump 
outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out near 
gunwhale.
What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   
currently annoying thing?
Eric Cahn
S/V Lattitudes
C&C 26
Washington, NC___
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Re: Stus-List What is it for? ???

[Evan Morgan via CnC-List]

Just re-read your original post...different setup than my 26. Wish I could 
help...

-Original Message-
From: "Eric Cahn via CnC-List" 
Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2014 3:33 PM
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Stus-List What is it for? ???

I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole seat 
and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge pump 
outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out near 
gunwhale.
What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   
currently annoying thing?
Eric Cahn
S/V Lattitudes
C&C 26
Washington, NC___
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Re: Stus-List [Bulk] Re: What is it for? ???

[David Drake via CnC-List]

I use mine as a ice box but it'd rains overboard ,not into the bilge

DDrake 
73 JH 
C&C 26

> On May 23, 2014, at 6:45 PM, Evan Morgan via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Just re-read your original post...different setup than my 26. Wish I could 
> help...
> From: Eric Cahn via CnC-List
> Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2014 3:33 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Stus-List What is it for? ???
> 
> I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole seat 
> and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge pump 
> outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out near 
> gunwhale.
> 
> What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   
> currently annoying thing?
> 
> Eric Cahn
> S/V Lattitudes
> C&C 26
> Washington, NC
> 
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Stus-List folding prop

[andrew rothweiler via CnC-List]

Thank you to all who have offered advice and suggestions about the folding prop 
questions, I now have the information needed to make a good decision.
Andy R___
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Stus-List Fw: What is it for? ???

[via CnC-List]

  sam :-) From: sam.c.sal...@gmail.comSent: Friday, May 23, 2014 6:58 PMTo: ec.turtl...@gmail.comSubject: Re: Stus-List What is it for? ???My 26 has this area draining outside the boat, just above the waterline through a ball valve. I haven't done anything with mine as I just daysail.Might be a good place to store propane if you overnight on the boat.   sam :-)C&C 26 Liquorice Ghost Lake Alberta  From: Eric Cahn via CnC-ListSent: Friday, May 23, 2014 1:33 PMTo: cnc-list@cnc-list.comReply To: Eric CahnSubject: Stus-List What is it for? ???I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole seat and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge pump outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out near gunwhale.

What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   currently annoying thing?
Eric Cahn
S/V Lattitudes
C&C 26
Washington, NC
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Re: Stus-List Fw: What is it for? ???

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

I used to have a Newport of similar vintage to the 26. It was a C&C design and 
also had a small locker on the aft end of the starboard cockpit seat, sand 
drained into the bilge. On the Newport this was intended as a cooler for 
beverages and snacks in the cockpit. The drain into the bilge was probably 
intended to keep ice, etc. from getting contaminated with seawater when sailing.

Rick Brass

Sent from my iPad

> On May 23, 2014, at 21:00, via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> sam :-)
> From: sam.c.sal...@gmail.com
> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 6:58 PM
> To: ec.turtl...@gmail.com
> Subject: Re: Stus-List What is it for? ???
> 
> My 26 has this area draining outside the boat, just above the waterline 
> through a ball valve. 
> I haven't done anything with mine as I just daysail.
> Might be a good place to store propane if you overnight on the boat.
> 
> sam :-)
> C&C 26 Liquorice 
> Ghost Lake Alberta 
> 
> From: Eric Cahn via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 1:33 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Reply To: Eric Cahn
> Subject: Stus-List What is it for? ???
> 
> I have a box under starboard cockpit bench that catches rain from whole seat 
> and has a drain open to bilge. I am changing its drain to out the bilge pump 
> outlet below it, as I have removed my bilge loop and am now pumping out near 
> gunwhale.
> 
> What was it designed to do? What have others done to best utilize this   
> currently annoying thing?
> 
> Eric Cahn
> S/V Lattitudes
> C&C 26
> Washington, NC
> 
> 
> 
> ___
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Re: Stus-List Yanmar 3QM30 thermostat for converted system

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Another consideration Rick,

as Sam pointed out,
Raw water cooled engines run cool in an attempt to limit the crap 
(salts etc.) coming out of solution and clogging up your cooling 
chambers in the block.


So, a raw water cooled engine (sea water service) should have a 
thermostat operating below 150 F to reduce said "crap".  And in this 
service we just have to accept the soot, thank you very much.


Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1
2QM 20 (seawater cooled)



At 04:14 AM 23/05/2014, you wrote:

The soot builds up partly because the engine is running too cool.

Operating temp should be at least 165 to 180 F.

Rick Brass

Sent from my iPad

On May 21, 2014, at 23:43, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
<cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:



Why change?  Just let the engine run cooler.

Josh Muckley
1989 C&C 37+
S/V Sea Hawk
Solomons, MD
On May 21, 2014 2:07 PM, "PME via CnC-List" 
<cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

Hi,

I am converting Yanmar 3QM30 raw water cooling system into a fresh 
water cooling system with a Sen-Dure heat exchanger.  The current 
thermostat is Yanmar part number 105582-49200.The fresh water 
thermostat listed for the 3QM30F looks like a completely different 
size thermostat.Does anyone know the Yanmar part number for a 
fresh water (i.e. higher temperature) thermostat which will fit a 
raw water 3QM30 system?


Thanks for any help.




-
Paul E.
1981 C&C Landfall 38
S/V Johanna Rose
Carrabelle, FL
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