[cctalk] Source for NEW (unused) punch tape
For various reasons (including, but not limited to, insanity and obsessiveness*) I am building a diode laser based tape punch. It's not specifically for a classic comp, but I'd like to stick with standard format so that it'd be useful for making custom tapes for members in the future. I will probably need to make dozens of tapes so using actual, vintage rolls is out of the question. Does anyone know if 1" tape is used for anything else and where I might find some new? Otherwise I may have to add paper-slitter to my project list and make my own. *I've had the idea of a lost-media ARG stuck in my head for years.
[cctalk] Re: Source for NEW (unused) punch tape
This is an awesome idea, please make it. How great would it be to load a receipt-paper roll (made of heavier stock of course), lase the holes and pass the paper over a vacuum slot to suck the chads. I was trying to come up with a mostly 3d-printable, cam-driven punch myself but of course it will never get done. Happy to provide any hardware/embedded help if wanted! -- Anders Nelson On Mon, Jun 5, 2023 at 2:19 PM Robotguy via cctalk wrote: > For various reasons (including, but not limited to, insanity and > obsessiveness*) I am building a diode laser based tape punch. It's not > specifically for a classic comp, but I'd like to stick with standard format > so that it'd be useful for making custom tapes for members in the future. I > will probably need to make dozens of tapes so using actual, vintage rolls > is out of the question. Does anyone know if 1" tape is used for anything > else and where I might find some new? Otherwise I may have to add > paper-slitter to my project list and make my own. > > > > > *I've had the idea of a lost-media ARG stuck in my head for years. >
[cctalk] Re: Source for NEW (unused) punch tape
There is this for ideas… https://www.instructables.com/DIY-Paper-TapePunch-Card-Maker-and-Reader/ Sent from my iPhone On Jun 5, 2023, at 12:29, Anders Nelson via cctalk wrote: This is an awesome idea, please make it. How great would it be to load a receipt-paper roll (made of heavier stock of course), lase the holes and pass the paper over a vacuum slot to suck the chads. I was trying to come up with a mostly 3d-printable, cam-driven punch myself but of course it will never get done. Happy to provide any hardware/embedded help if wanted! -- Anders Nelson On Mon, Jun 5, 2023 at 2:19 PM Robotguy via cctalk wrote: For various reasons (including, but not limited to, insanity and obsessiveness*) I am building a diode laser based tape punch. It's not specifically for a classic comp, but I'd like to stick with standard format so that it'd be useful for making custom tapes for members in the future. I will probably need to make dozens of tapes so using actual, vintage rolls is out of the question. Does anyone know if 1" tape is used for anything else and where I might find some new? Otherwise I may have to add paper-slitter to my project list and make my own. *I've had the idea of a lost-media ARG stuck in my head for years.
[cctalk] Re: Source for NEW (unused) punch tape
The perforations might be a problem but could this work ? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/324481731229 On Mon, Jun 5, 2023 at 8:58 PM Wayne S via cctalk wrote: > There is this for ideas… > > https://www.instructables.com/DIY-Paper-TapePunch-Card-Maker-and-Reader/ > > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jun 5, 2023, at 12:29, Anders Nelson via cctalk > wrote: > > This is an awesome idea, please make it. How great would it be to load a > receipt-paper roll (made of heavier stock of course), lase the holes and > pass the paper over a vacuum slot to suck the chads. > > I was trying to come up with a mostly 3d-printable, cam-driven punch myself > but of course it will never get done. > > Happy to provide any hardware/embedded help if wanted! > > -- > Anders Nelson > > > On Mon, Jun 5, 2023 at 2:19 PM Robotguy via cctalk > wrote: > > For various reasons (including, but not limited to, insanity and > obsessiveness*) I am building a diode laser based tape punch. It's not > specifically for a classic comp, but I'd like to stick with standard format > so that it'd be useful for making custom tapes for members in the future. I > will probably need to make dozens of tapes so using actual, vintage rolls > is out of the question. Does anyone know if 1" tape is used for anything > else and where I might find some new? Otherwise I may have to add > paper-slitter to my project list and make my own. > > > > > *I've had the idea of a lost-media ARG stuck in my head for years. > >
[cctalk] Re: Source for NEW (unused) punch tape
Thanks to the estate of a "silent key" I have more paper tape than I will ever use. If you are interested, let me know and I will sell you a couple of rolls. I have both beige and black. Bill Sudbrink -Original Message- From: Robotguy via cctalk [mailto:cctalk@classiccmp.org] Sent: Monday, June 05, 2023 2:19 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Cc: robot...@gmail.com Subject: [cctalk] Source for NEW (unused) punch tape For various reasons (including, but not limited to, insanity and obsessiveness*) I am building a diode laser based tape punch. It's not specifically for a classic comp, but I'd like to stick with standard format so that it'd be useful for making custom tapes for members in the future. I will probably need to make dozens of tapes so using actual, vintage rolls is out of the question. Does anyone know if 1" tape is used for anything else and where I might find some new? Otherwise I may have to add paper-slitter to my project list and make my own. *I've had the idea of a lost-media ARG stuck in my head for years. -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com
[cctalk] Re: Getting floppy images to/from real floppy disks.
>Message: 21 >Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2023 04:35:28 +0100 >From: Tony Duell >Subject: [cctalk] Re: Getting floppy images to/from real floppy disks. > >On Sun, Jun 4, 2023 at 10:57 PM Fred Cisin via cctalk > wrote: >> >> On Sun, 4 Jun 2023, Rick Bensene via cctalk wrote: <> > an example of early "mobile computing". (Tongue firmly in cheek). >> >> The original Osborne 1 had a 12V power input! > >Actually it's +12.6V and +5.6V and you have to supply both voltages. >It's one diode drop to the +5V (logic supply) and +12V (DRAM, disk >motors, monitor supply), the -5V for the DRAM is produced on the logic >board. > >I am told it was never used and that the Osborne battery pack came >with an inverter to provide 110V AC. > >-tony It (the Osborne Powr-Pac (tm) ) has a what the manual says is a DC-DC inverter that plugged into a Gould lead-acid battery (or the cigarette-lighter socket in a car) at one end and the AC input of the Osborne 1 at the other. I have read on this list that Lee denies that OCC ever sold them, but I have one that I bought for $50 at Compumat in Chicago on October 10, 1983 -- I still have the unit, receipt, and User Registration card. It came with a glossy-printed grey-and-blue manual, like other contemporary OCC products. If anyone wants a copy, I can email you a PDF scan of the user manual. Bob
[cctalk] Re: Getting floppy images to/from real floppy disks.
On Monday, June 5th, 2023 at 1:43 PM, Robert Feldman via cctalk wrote: > > > >Message: 21 > > > Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2023 04:35:28 +0100 > > From: Tony Duell ard.p850...@gmail.com > > Subject: [cctalk] Re: Getting floppy images to/from real floppy disks. > > > > On Sun, Jun 4, 2023 at 10:57 PM Fred Cisin via cctalk > > cctalk@classiccmp.org wrote: > > > > > On Sun, 4 Jun 2023, Rick Bensene via cctalk wrote: > > <> > an example of early "mobile computing". (Tongue firmly in cheek). > > > > The original Osborne 1 had a 12V power input! > > > > Actually it's +12.6V and +5.6V and you have to supply both voltages. > > It's one diode drop to the +5V (logic supply) and +12V (DRAM, disk > > motors, monitor supply), the -5V for the DRAM is produced on the logic > > board. > > > > I am told it was never used and that the Osborne battery pack came > > with an inverter to provide 110V AC. > > > > -tony > > > It (the Osborne Powr-Pac (tm) ) has a what the manual says is a DC-DC > inverter that plugged into a Gould lead-acid battery (or the > cigarette-lighter socket in a car) at one end and the AC input of the Osborne > 1 at the other. I have read on this list that Lee denies that OCC ever sold > them, but I have one that I bought for $50 at Compumat in Chicago on October > 10, 1983 -- I still have the unit, receipt, and User Registration card. It > came with a glossy-printed grey-and-blue manual, like other contemporary OCC > products. > > If anyone wants a copy, I can email you a PDF scan of the user manual. > > Bob It's funny that luggable power packs come up here as I'm trying to revive my Otrona Attache... The power supply does nothing on AC input, even after a recapping, so I thought I'd investigate the "DC Power Option" described in the manual. Unfortunately I can't find any record that Otrona ever actually *sold* a "DC Power Option", which would plug into an unpopulated 6-pin Molex connector on the back of the device. Interestingly, the header inside the power supply labeled "DC Option" is a 7-pin header, so I'm not sure which pin was "optional" for the external connector! I'd just replace the power supply wholesale with a little ATX supply or something, but the machine needs 5V, 12V, -12V, and 15V; the latter is used to power the CRT and represents a real challenge! I've yet to find anything that outputs all 4 levels at a reasonable price. john
[cctalk] Re: Getting floppy images to/from real floppy disks.
On Tue, Jun 6, 2023 at 3:42 AM John Floren via cctalk wrote: > It's funny that luggable power packs come up here as I'm trying to revive my > Otrona Attache... The power supply does nothing on AC input, even after a > recapping, so I thought I'd investigate the "DC Power Option" described in > the manual. Unfortunately I can't find any record that Otrona ever actually > *sold* a "DC Power Option", which would plug into an unpopulated 6-pin Molex > connector on the back of the device. Interestingly, the header inside the > power supply labeled "DC Option" is a 7-pin header, so I'm not sure which pin > was "optional" for the external connector! > > I'd just replace the power supply wholesale with a little ATX supply or > something, but the machine needs 5V, 12V, -12V, and 15V; the latter is used > to power the CRT and represents a real challenge! I've yet to find anything > that outputs all 4 levels at a reasonable price. I consider the PSU to be as much a part of the original design as any other part of the machine and like to keep them original. The schematic for the power supply is in the technical manual. It appears there's a startup supply using the mains-frequency transformer T1 as well as the SMPSU part. If that's missing then I'd suspect something around the mains input side. I assume the fuse is good! The power switch is a little odd in that it uses the triac Q1 to switch the mains, controlled by the user switch. Maybe check round that area. -tony
[cctalk] First non-IBM PC-DOS Compatible PC
Hi: Doing some research for historical purposed – no litigation at all – trying to identify the first “legal” PC-DOS compatible PC, “legal” in the sense that it’s BIOS was not a copy of an IBM BIOS. Eagle gets the honor of being first MS-DOS compatible and getting sued for copying IBM’s BIOS 😊 The Compaq Portable which shipped in November 1982 is generally credited with the first legal MS-DOS compatible PC. AFAIK it could not run PC-DOS and those applications which depended upon certain IBM BIOS commands would fail. The first “legal” BIOS is generally considered to be from Phoenix which was announced in May 1984 and so far I have been unable to determine its first system deployments. FWIW Wikipedia points to HP, Tandy and AT&T as some time adopters of a Phoenix BIOS but my research so far is that Tandy’s T1000 family announced in October and November of 1984 was the first system to be PC-DOS compatible and it did not use a Phoenix BIOS! Such PC-DOS compatible HP and AT&T systems were much later and the Tandy BIOS was written by programmers of Tandon Corporation, the OEM supplier of the first Tandy T1000s. Can anyone identify a PC-DOS compatible PC announced earlier than October 1984? Citations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Tom
[cctalk] Re: First non-IBM PC-DOS Compatible PC
On 6/5/23 22:28, Tom Gardner via cctalk wrote: > Can anyone identify a PC-DOS compatible PC announced earlier than October > 1984? Citations would be greatly appreciated. That's a tricky one,I think. For example, if a single programmer read the IBM PC BIOS listing (or even disassembled it) and then wrote a new one from scratch, that derivative BIOS in the view of the IBM legal beagles would not have been legal. If, on the other hand, the same programmer never saw any of the code, but read the API description and wrote a BIOS, that would be legal. Both ERSO and Phoenix resorted to a "clean room" method where one team read the PC BIOS and wrote a description, which served as a specification for a derivative BIOS. I think that the descriptions were cleaned up a bit and published as the Phoenix BIOS books. But I think the first "clean room BIOS" was in the Columbia MPC-1600, June 1982. --Chuck
