Re: Storage for 1/2" open reel tape

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On 4/8/19 9:06 PM, Jeff Woolsey via cctech wrote:
>> I've noted earlier that the vinyl "hanger strips" for 1/2" magnetic tape
>> have been degrading, becoming brittle and simply breaking away,
>> sometimes in small particles.
> 
> I have about a hundred tapes from various contributors, and have noticed
> no age-related [1] deterioration of the seals, probably because mine
> don't get handled very much.  About 1/3 of mine have the vinyl hanger
> strips, another third the autoload seals, and the remainder are in the
> bulky canisters (with several different closures).  I also have a couple
> of tape racks (think "dish rack") that hold maybe thirty tapes, but the
> canisters are too thick to fit in.

That's great--but these are customer tapes, not mine and many are from
the 1960s and 70s.  (About 2/3s of the current batch are 7-track)
Perhaps 50 years of storage takes its toll.  I don't know.

The other minor annoyance is that 40-50 years tends to dry out the
adhesive on labels and less often, leader splices.

As far as racks go, you can sometimes find the 16mm film racks at
auction--they rarely attract bids.  They're mostly Neumade products.

--Chuck

Re: Storage for 1/2" open reel tape

[Grant Taylor via cctalk]

On 4/8/19 9:26 PM, Adrian Stoness via cctech wrote:

whats with the weird tag on this thread?


It looks like the spaces got encoded as %20 for some reason.



--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

Re: %20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[Adrian Stoness via cctalk]

whats with the weird tag on this thread?

On Mon, Apr 8, 2019 at 10:25 PM Fred Cisin via cctech 
wrote:

> >>> /My small 16mm collection is stored on an open reel tape cart. /
> >> I wonder how tape rings would do on 16mm reels?
> > You mean the write rings?  They're fixed at the hub size
>
> No, I meant the circumferential hangers.
>
> Since I occasionally processed my own movie film, I usually had plenty of
> the light-tight cans that the blank film was shipped in.  But, usually
> only 100 foot reels, so too small for tape.
>
> Large reels didn't cost MUCH, but it added up.
> Some people would scrap old films for the reels, cans, and shipping boxes.
> (such as old Doctor Who episodes that probably wouldn't be aired again)
>
>

Re:%20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

/My small 16mm collection is stored on an open reel tape cart. /

I wonder how tape rings would do on 16mm reels?

You mean the write rings?  They're fixed at the hub size


No, I meant the circumferential hangers.

Since I occasionally processed my own movie film, I usually had plenty of 
the light-tight cans that the blank film was shipped in.  But, usually 
only 100 foot reels, so too small for tape.


Large reels didn't cost MUCH, but it added up.
Some people would scrap old films for the reels, cans, and shipping boxes.
(such as old Doctor Who episodes that probably wouldn't be aired again)

Re:%20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[Jeff Woolsey via cctalk]

> >>/I hit on the idea of using 16mm move film plastic "cans". Much to my 
> >>/>>/surprise, I found that there is still an active market for these 
> >>things. /
> On Mon, 8 Apr 2019, Kevin Monceaux via cctalk wrote:
> >/My small 16mm collection is stored on an open reel tape cart. /
> I wonder how tape rings would do on 16mm reels?
You mean the write rings?  They're fixed at the hub size

As for write rings, most sites had more than they actually need, many
times over.  You really only need as many as you have tape drives...

I've always wanted to make an Olympics logo out of write wrings, but
never could find all the right colors.

I have a couple black ones around the gearshift in my car (like horseshoes).

-- 
Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
"Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire

Re: Storage for 1/2" open reel tape

[Jeff Woolsey via cctalk]

> I've noted earlier that the vinyl "hanger strips" for 1/2" magnetic tape
> have been degrading, becoming brittle and simply breaking away,
> sometimes in small particles.

I have about a hundred tapes from various contributors, and have noticed
no age-related [1] deterioration of the seals, probably because mine
don't get handled very much.  About 1/3 of mine have the vinyl hanger
strips, another third the autoload seals, and the remainder are in the
bulky canisters (with several different closures).  I also have a couple
of tape racks (think "dish rack") that hold maybe thirty tapes, but the
canisters are too thick to fit in.

The tapes hang pretty well from the front lip of the wall-mounted wire
shelves (that you can get at most big-box-home-stores) I installed not
for that purpose.

The thing is, I've read and photographed most of them, so I don't need
[2] them anymore.  Their owners, like me, only wanted the data online,
not the media back. Most museums have more than they want or can use, as
well.  Some tapes have common-sense restrictions on redistribution
(Personally Identifiable Information, I think they call it nowadays).
I've even got some new, never-written ones.  But it pains me to trash
them, so I'm open to suggestions.

=

[1] I have dropped and broken a couple of them, but that was due to
insufficient age of the handler...  Some did not survive the reading
process due to oxide-binder aging, but the seals are fine.

[2] In many cases, usually by repurposing extra copies of software
distribution tapes, the most recent data is shorter than the original,
so the tails of older things past the EOF1 label and double tapemark can
be read without much difficulty.  The thing is, I didn't figure this out
until I'd been reading tapes a while, so the earlier ones may yield to
re-examining.

-- 
Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
"Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire

Re: %20 nonsense

[Jeff Woolsey via cctalk]

> whats with the weird tag on this thread?

Oops, sorry.

Clicking on an address in the mailing list viewed as a web page via
http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2019-April tries to fire up
MacOS X Mail, which I don't want because I use Thunderbird.  So I "Copy
Email Address" and paste it into a Thunderbird compose window To: field,
and it has
cct...@classiccmp.org?Subject=Re:%20'd_subject_line_mess&otherjunk.  I
copied that into the Subject: line, and thought something would do the
right thing with them upon receipt.  Oh well, there I go overestimating
the intelligence of software again.

-- 
Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
"Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire

Re: %20 nonsense

[Jim Manley via cctalk]

To those of us who develop AI in the real world, it stands for "Artificial
Incompetence".  We're not talking about just the software, but the
practitioners.who should know better than to allow anyone (especially
themselves) to overpromise and shamelessly promote AI being able to do
things that are simply ridiculous ...



On Mon, Apr 8, 2019 at 10:16 PM Adrian Stoness via cctech <
cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> u mean the inteligence of bloated software
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 8, 2019 at 11:13 PM Jeff Woolsey via cctech <
> cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> > > whats with the weird tag on this thread?
> >
> > Oops, sorry.
> >
> > Clicking on an address in the mailing list viewed as a web page via
> > http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2019-April tries to fire up
> > MacOS X Mail, which I don't want because I use Thunderbird.  So I "Copy
> > Email Address" and paste it into a Thunderbird compose window To: field,
> > and it has
> > cct...@classiccmp.org?Subject=Re:%20'd_subject_line_mess&otherjunk.  I
> > copied that into the Subject: line, and thought something would do the
> > right thing with them upon receipt.  Oh well, there I go overestimating
> > the intelligence of software again.
> >
> > --
> > Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
> > Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
> > "Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
> > Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire
> >
> >
>

Re: %20 nonsense

[Adrian Stoness via cctalk]

u mean the inteligence of bloated software


On Mon, Apr 8, 2019 at 11:13 PM Jeff Woolsey via cctech <
cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> > whats with the weird tag on this thread?
>
> Oops, sorry.
>
> Clicking on an address in the mailing list viewed as a web page via
> http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2019-April tries to fire up
> MacOS X Mail, which I don't want because I use Thunderbird.  So I "Copy
> Email Address" and paste it into a Thunderbird compose window To: field,
> and it has
> cct...@classiccmp.org?Subject=Re:%20'd_subject_line_mess&otherjunk.  I
> copied that into the Subject: line, and thought something would do the
> right thing with them upon receipt.  Oh well, there I go overestimating
> the intelligence of software again.
>
> --
> Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
> Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
> "Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
> Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire
>
>

Re: Pleas ID this IBM system....

[Paul Koning via cctalk]

> On Apr 8, 2019, at 9:40 PM, Jon Elson via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> On 04/08/2019 06:10 PM, Tom Gardner via cctalk wrote:
>> FWIW the tape drive is an IBM 2315 announced April 16, 1965 
>>   for 
>> use on low end S/360s.  Here is a brochure 
>>   as well as manuals at 
>> http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/2415/
>> 
>> 
> So, is that a capstan and pinch roller drive?  I'd kind of guess so, if 
> announced in 1965.

I don't think other companies followed that strange design approach even back 
then, though.  Never mind the pinch roller part; I could never understand why 
IBM would build vacuum columns with the oxide facing out, sliding against the 
vacuum column side walls.

> (for future readers, 2315 is apparently a typo, 2415 would fit in with 24xx 
> models being tape drives, 23xx was for disks.)

Yes, 2315 is the RK05 lookalike found in the 360 model 44.

paul

RE: Tektronix Keyboard

[Electronics Plus via cctalk]

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Al Kossow via 
cctalk
Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2019 11:43 AM
To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Tektronix Keyboard



On 4/3/19 8:53 AM, Douglas Taylor via cctalk wrote:

> What I didn't understand was a fascination with the black mechanical Cherry 
> switches the keyboard used.  These turn out
> to be extremely popular with the 'gaming' community.

This 'community' is referred to here as "keyboard collecting scum"

Hey now, be nice :-)
I supply these people, and to be fair, I also try to find suppliers for you 
guys.
The keyboard community has taught me a LOT about keyboards that I never would 
have imagined.
A number of people here were quite happy to scrounge the warehouse before it 
closed a couple of years ago.

Cindy


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Re: %20 nonsense

[Nemo via cctalk]

On 09/04/2019, Jeff Woolsey via cctech  wrote:
>> whats with the weird tag on this thread?
>
> Oops, sorry.
>
> Clicking on an address in the mailing list viewed as a web page via
> http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctech/2019-April tries to fire up
> MacOS X Mail, which I don't want because I use Thunderbird.

That can be changed.

N.

Re: %20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[Jon Elson via cctalk]

On 04/08/2019 10:26 PM, Adrian Stoness via cctalk wrote:

whats with the weird tag on this thread?


%20 is an escaped form of the space character.  Some mail 
programs escape all control characters, or even anything 
like {} ~.


Jon

Re: Tape Storage Rack WAS: RE: 1/2" tape storage.

[Jon Elson via cctalk]

On 04/08/2019 11:34 PM, Ali via cctalk wrote:

While on the subject of tape storage anyone know if it is still possible to get 
desktop/table top wire bins to hold tapes in canisters and/or reels? Not that I 
have that many tapes or anything like that. This would be more for display 
purposes than anything else.


Yikes, I doubt anybody has manufactured these in the last 30 
years. I have one, but don't want to get rid of it until I 
scrap all my old tapes.


Jon

Re: Tape Storage Rack WAS: RE: 1/2" tape storage.

[William Donzelli via cctalk]

> Yikes, I doubt anybody has manufactured these in the last 30
> years. I have one, but don't want to get rid of it until I
> scrap all my old tapes.

They are not 100 percent authentic, but there are desktop wire file
organizing racks that can hold tapes.

--
Will

Re: Pleas ID this IBM system....

[Noel Chiappa via cctalk]

> From: Adrian Stoness

> someones bid on them eh hopefully not a scraper

Well, a scrapper would want to pay as little as possible, so anyone
who wanted to actually save the system should be able to get it.
There are a couple of bids on it, but the amounts are derisory.

I hope Christian's museum can get it!

Noel

Re: %20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[Peter Coghlan via cctalk]

Jon Elson wrote:
> On 04/08/2019 10:26 PM, Adrian Stoness via cctalk wrote:
> > whats with the weird tag on this thread?
> >
> >
> %20 is an escaped form of the space character.  Some mail 
> programs escape all control characters, or even anything 
> like {} ~.
>

Yes but "%20" is the form of escape intended for use with http, not for email.
For email, it should be "=20" and if such escaped characters are included in a
subject line, this is supposed to be indicated by the subject field starting
with a sequence like "=?charset?Q?" to flag the use of what is called quoted
printable encoding.

Regards,
Peter Coghlan.

RE: Tape Storage Rack WAS: RE: 1/2" tape storage.

[Jay West via cctalk]

I have two of the authentic tape racks, the ones that held tapes by the snap 
closure on the flexible plastic ring. Both are about 65 to 70 inches tall. One 
is about 2 feet wide and I will be keeping that. The other is about 5 or 6 feet 
wide and should go to a good home. Both are in good condition. St. Louis, MO.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of William 
Donzelli via cctalk
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2019 10:39 AM
To: Jon Elson ; General Discussion: On-Topic and 
Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: Tape Storage Rack WAS: RE: 1/2" tape storage.

> Yikes, I doubt anybody has manufactured these in the last 30 years. I 
> have one, but don't want to get rid of it until I scrap all my old 
> tapes.

They are not 100 percent authentic, but there are desktop wire file organizing 
racks that can hold tapes.

--
Will

RE: Tape Storage Rack WAS: RE: 1/2" tape storage.

[Ali via cctalk]

> I have two of the authentic tape racks, the ones that held tapes by the
> snap closure on the flexible plastic ring. Both are about 65 to 70
> inches tall. One is about 2 feet wide and I will be keeping that. The
> other is about 5 or 6 feet wide and should go to a good home. Both are
> in good condition. St. Louis, MO.


Jay,

For curiosity's sake can you post pictures of your racks? Both are way too big 
for me but I would like to see some pictures of authentic ones. I was thinking 
about getting the wire file holders (as others have suggested) but I have not 
found ones wide enough/sturdy enough to hold and support the weight of the 
tapes. Thanks.

-Ali

Re: %20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

whats with the weird tag on this thread?

%20 is an escaped form of the space character.  Some mail
programs escape all control characters, or even anything
like {} ~.


On Tue, 9 Apr 2019, Peter Coghlan via cctalk wrote:

Yes but "%20" is the form of escape intended for use with http, not for email.
For email, it should be "=20" and if such escaped characters are included in a
subject line, this is supposed to be indicated by the subject field starting
with a sequence like "=?charset?Q?" to flag the use of what is called quoted
printable encoding.


It's due to the use of "standardized" character encoding.
ASCII, UTF-8, Unicode, . . . 
"Standards are wonderful; everybody can have a unique one of their own."
I asked one of my classes to look up what "standard" means - 
one student came up with a definitive answer: apparently it is a flag on 
a tall pole.   Any definitions having to do with conformation between 
systems are now deprecated.



You mix that with an HTML browser program attempting to be an email 
client, . . .


This particular sort of mess often occurs when somebody uses a character 
that isn't part of the basic set.
The subject line mentioned half inch.  SOME program "did a favor" for its 
user, and changed "1 / 2" to a single character for one half.
And/or took the symmetrical character abreviation for inch, and changed 
that, since "OBVIOUSLY, left, right, and center double quote characters 
are not the same".

Re: %20Storage%20for%201/2"%20open%20reel%20tape

[ben via cctalk]

On 4/9/2019 4:40 PM, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote:

This particular sort of mess often occurs when somebody uses a character 
that isn't part of the basic set.
The subject line mentioned half inch.  SOME program "did a favor" for 
its user, and changed "1 / 2" to a single character for one half.
And/or took the symmetrical character abreviation for inch, and changed 
that, since "OBVIOUSLY, left, right, and center double quote characters 
are not the same".



Just like the *smart* fpga development program I am using.
A gizillon stupid warnings and smart ass stuff like: "You using a D 
flop/flop with preset  converting to inverted D flip/flop with clear." 
Yet at the same time don't even warn you if IT THINKS it can remove 
whole blocks of logic or warn about .CLK input to a D flip flop is missing.
Testing a CPU with a small program ROM input, and it figured it could 
"remove"stuff. IR[3..2] is stuck at 0 and removing. ARG!

Ben.
PS: now the latest thing in HTML, spacing spaces to format your page
to FIT our screen (not yours).

RE: Not DEC related but still hoping for some help: Problems w/ LJ 4+ Printer

[Ali via cctalk]

> 
> It sounds like the caps have not (yet) completely failed.
> 
> I'd bet $10 on the HV supply being your problem.


And you would be $10 richer now :D

I just replaced the caps on the HV board ($5 worth of parts $7.99 for S&H 
:facepalm:) and it fired right up and started printing. None of the caps looked 
"bad". I don't have an ESR meter but when I tested the caps w/ my multimeter 
(outside of the circuit of course) only one seemed bad to my very rudimentary 
understanding. It was the big 25V 470uF cap. It never reached a resistance of 
infinity (which I believe a good cap will do).  Not sure if this is a true 
indication of a bad cap or that my MM just couldn't charge the cap 
sufficiently. In either case it is now replaced w/ a 25V 470uF 125C Panasonic 
part. 

Thanks to everyone for the help.

-Ali

Re: Not DEC related but still hoping for some help: Problems w/ LJ 4+ Printer

[Grant Taylor via cctalk]

On 4/9/19 9:23 PM, Ali via cctalk wrote:

And you would be $10 richer now :D

I just replaced the caps on the HV board ($5 worth of parts $7.99 for S&H 
:facepalm:) and it fired right up and started printing. None of the caps 
looked "bad". I don't have an ESR meter but when I tested the caps w/ 
my multimeter (outside of the circuit of course) only one seemed bad to 
my very rudimentary understanding. It was the big 25V 470uF cap. It never 
reached a resistance of infinity (which I believe a good cap will do). 
Not sure if this is a true indication of a bad cap or that my MM just 
couldn't charge the cap sufficiently. In either case it is now replaced w/ 
a 25V 470uF 125C Panasonic part.


Thanks to everyone for the help.


Cool!

I'm glad that you got it working.  :-)



--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

Re: Tape Storage Rack WAS: RE: 1/2" tape storage

[Jeff Woolsey via cctalk]

> While on the subject of tape storage anyone know if it is still possible to 
> get desktop/table top wire bins to hold tapes in canisters and/or reels? Not 
> that I have that many tapes or anything like that. This would be more for 
> display purposes than anything else.
>
> Something akin to this: ibm51xx.classiccmp.org/CCTalkPics/taperack.png
>
> Do they still make things like this or do I have to find it at university 
> junk sale?
>
>
Those are exactly the "dish rack" things I have two of.  Of course, I
can't remember where I got them.

FWIW, I also have a small rack that holds, uh, 2x4x25 8mm data tapes in
their cases.  Said "dish rack" won't fit on top, though.

-- 
Jeff Woolsey {{woolsey,jlw}@jlw,first.last@{gmail,jlw}}.com
Nature abhors straight antennas, clean lenses, and empty storage.
"Delete! Delete! OK!" -Dr. Bronner on disk space management
Card-sorting, Joel.  -Crow on solitaire