Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
Am 13.08.17 um 20:34 schrieb Jerry Weiss: On Aug 13, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Ulrich Tagge wrote: Hi Jerry, I have tried with PDP11GUI, but the first message says "The image contains only 505856 bytes, but disk has 512512 bytes". I have written some disks, and have ignored this message, but none of them is readable under RT-11. .dir dy0: ?DIR-F-Error reading directory So I think the DSK format is different from the one PDP11GUI uses. In the documentation I have seen, that the format is the same as SimH uses. Image file format Every DEC disk or tape is logically represented as a linear list of “blocks”. The block size differs between 128 byte and 1024 bytes. Reading and writing is based on block numbers. The file format is that of SimH: a file image is just a stream of blocks. Kermit would be a possibility, and I will try it later on. Many Greetings Ulrich DEC OS’es typically do not do anything with track 0 on an RX02, and start with track 1. I can only guess that PDP11GUI is trying to use the entire disk. If there is an option to start at track 1 or skip the first 30 (?) blocks, that might work. Note that ?DIR–F–Error reading directory is a hardware error. Bad data would instead cause a ?DIR–F–Invalid directory. You are right, and it looks like, that in the process of image writing, and reading my DY0: died. Tested again with DY1: and the outcome is now ?DIR-F-Invalid directory I have send a Mail to Joerg yesterday evening, and have asked about PDP11GUI and the possibility to write DSK images, now waiting for the outcome. Many Greetings Ulrich Regards, Jerry
Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
Hi all, I have tried to find a specification about the DSK Image format, but have only found the the following: http://www.cpctech.org.uk/docs/dsk.html , which looks like the focus is more on CPC related Disks. Is there any detailed description somewhere in the www about the DSK format? Many Greetings Ulrich
Plotter + Tape drive
Giving away ancient computer equipment (Essex England): I have a HP 7550A plotter and a HP 88780 9-track tape drive (also several tapes "new" in packaging). Both were working when last powered-on but that was a couple of years ago. I was going to give them to the computing history museum in Cambridge but they have had to decline for lack of space. If nobody claims and can collect from SS6 before the bank holiday (and preferably sooner!) they will go to the recycling centre (aka tip!) Warning - the tape drive is around 40Kg. I will also be offering these on another list. Soonest to collect has priority! Andy Holt ps Tony if you want these but cannot transport mail me and we'll see if a solution is possible.
RE: Plotter + Tape drive
Andy, Is this a Pertec or SCSI interface. If its SCSI I would be very interested. Might be challenging to collect in your time scales as I am in Spain at present and helping with a Makefest soon. Dave > -Original Message- > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of ANDY > HOLT via cctalk > Sent: 14 August 2017 13:09 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > > Subject: Plotter + Tape drive > > > > Giving away ancient computer equipment (Essex England): > > > > > I have a HP 7550A plotter and a > > HP 88780 9-track tape drive (also several tapes "new" in packaging). > > Both were working when last powered-on but that was a couple of years > ago. > > > > > I was going to give them to the computing history museum in Cambridge but > they have had to decline for lack of space. > > If nobody claims and can collect from SS6 before the bank holiday (and > preferably sooner!) they will go to the recycling centre (aka tip!) > > Warning - the tape drive is around 40Kg. > > I will also be offering these on another list. > > Soonest to collect has priority! > > > > > Andy Holt > > > ps Tony if you want these but cannot transport mail me and we'll see if a > solution is possible. >
Re: VCF?
On 8/13/17 6:34 PM, Steve Malikoff via cctalk wrote: > Anyway I was wondering if it would be possible to get some accurate and > detailed scale measurements of the Alto chorded keyset? I have one that I am cleaning right now, so it is disassembled. I'll put some info up soon.
Re: Warren Stearns info.
On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 5:14 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > Was Warren Stearns connected with Stearns Computer Systems, maker of the > short-lived Stearns PC? > > --Chuck > No, he wasn't. -- Doug Ingraham PDP-8 SN 1175
Stearns Computer
On Monday (08/14/2017 at 08:16AM -0600), Doug Ingraham via cctalk wrote: > On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 5:14 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > > > Was Warren Stearns connected with Stearns Computer Systems, maker of the > > short-lived Stearns PC? > > > > --Chuck > > > > No, he wasn't. Stearns Computer was here in Minneapolis (Minnetonka actually) and was started by a bunch of former CPT guys. I'm not sure I ever heard any history of the name but it may have ties to Stearns County which is just to the NW of the Cities or it might have something to do with Stearns life jackets which all the fisherman around here wear. I believe I am the only non-Stearns Computer employee to hold a full certification for field repair of the Stearns PC. I got this training because at ETA Systems, we had over 200 of these PC-like machines and were Stearns Computer's largest customer. Some believe we were their only customer. I still have the certificate but no, I will not fix your Stearns now :-) Chris -- Chris Elmquist
Re: Stearns Computer
On 08/14/2017 10:40 AM, Chris Elmquist wrote: > Stearns Computer was here in Minneapolis (Minnetonka actually) and was > started by a bunch of former CPT guys. I'm not sure I ever heard any > history of the name but it may have ties to Stearns County which is > just to the NW of the Cities or it might have something to do with > Stearns life jackets which all the fisherman around here wear. > > I believe I am the only non-Stearns Computer employee to hold a full > certification for field repair of the Stearns PC. I got this training > because at ETA Systems, we had over 200 of these PC-like machines and > were Stearns Computer's largest customer. Some believe we were their > only customer. > > I still have the certificate but no, I will not fix your Stearns > now :-) Yes, I recall that Neil tried to sell us on Stearns, but we elected to go with the pack and use IBM. Good move that, in retrospect. Googling a bit for the name shows that there are a lot of "Warren Stearns" about. --Chuck
Re: Stearns Computer
On Monday (08/14/2017 at 01:16PM -0700), Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: > > Yes, I recall that Neil tried to sell us on Stearns, but we elected to > go with the pack and use IBM. Good move that, in retrospect. For sure. The Stearns was (deliberately) not a very good IBM PC clone-- using a true 8086, a Eurocard backplane connector and a custom BIOS that only allowed MSDOS (and not PC DOS) to run. The video was different... everything was different enough that all we did was hack just about every app that people wanted to run so that it would limp on the Stearns. Neil's goal at ETA (cc 1983) was to have a "paperless operation" and every engineer, every manager, every secretary (that's what we called them then) was to have a personal computer. Most of the people had never used a computer before and so we had to teach them what to do with them. However, it was amazing to watch and didn't take too long before they were all wanting REAL IBM PC stuff-- because they saw it on TV, in the magazines, everywhere-- and sadly, the Stearns really could not deliver. At the time CDC (and ETA by proxy) also had a group purchase deal with Zenith and so we began to see the Z100 (again not a PC but well supported software-wise) and finally the Z150 displace the Stearns as something you could really get work done with. As _the_ Stearns support guy, I had a Z100 :-) Chris -- Chris Elmquist
Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
On 8/14/2017 12:40 AM, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote: Hi all, I have tried to find a specification about the DSK Image format, but have only found the the following: http://www.cpctech.org.uk/docs/dsk.html , which looks like the focus is more on CPC related Disks. Is there any detailed description somewhere in the www about the DSK format? Many Greetings Ulrich I think you'll find many different '.DSK' formats on the web; there is not one universal definition. It depends on the program that wrote the .DSK files.
Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
On 8/13/2017 4:47 PM, Don North via cctalk wrote: On 8/13/2017 11:34 AM, Jerry Weiss via cctalk wrote: On Aug 13, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Ulrich Tagge wrote: Hi Jerry, I have tried with PDP11GUI, but the first message says "The image contains only 505856 bytes, but disk has 512512 bytes". I have written some disks, and have ignored this message, but none of them is readable under RT-11. .dir dy0: ?DIR-F-Error reading directory So I think the DSK format is different from the one PDP11GUI uses. In the documentation I have seen, that the format is the same as SimH uses. Image file format Every DEC disk or tape is logically represented as a linear list of “blocks”. The block size differs between 128 byte and 1024 bytes. Reading and writing is based on block numbers. The file format is that of SimH: a file image is just a stream of blocks. Kermit would be a possibility, and I will try it later on. Many Greetings Ulrich DEC OS’es typically do not do anything with track 0 on an RX02, and start with track 1. I can only guess that PDP11GUI is trying to use the entire disk. If there is an option to start at track 1 or skip the first 30 (?) blocks, that might work. Note that ?DIR–F–Error reading directory is a hardware error. Bad data would instead cause a ?DIR–F–Invalid directory. Regards, Jerry The RX01 physical format is 77. tracks of 26. sectors (2002. total sectors) of 128. bytes, or 256,256. bytes. For RX02 track and sector counts are the same, but there are 256. bytes per sector, for a total of 512,512. bytes. The .DSK images are (usually!) a pure physical image of the disk, in track/sector order, from track 0 sector 1 to track 76. sector 26. The images include track 0 which is not used by any DEC O/S. The boot block / filesystem starts at track 1 sector 1. Note that sectors are numbered 1. thru 26. There is no sector 0. All the DEC operating systems use interleaving of logical to physical sectors on the RX device images, so they are unique in the sense that the image file is not just a logical block 0. to block N-1. image of 512. byte blocks as most/all other image files are. If your RX02 image file is only 505,856. bytes then this is 6656. bytes (exactly 26. * 256.) too short, so it would appear track 0 is skipped. So when someone imaged the floppy they decided to skip over track 0 (how thoughtful of them). You might try using unix dd to prepend 6656. bytes of zero as a header, and then copy the rest of the data to form a 512,512. byte file. That may work on PDP11GUI (and should under SIMH as well) ***IF*** the person who imaged the disk just dropped track 0. If they ALSO decided to de-interleave the physical sectors to logical blocks then the process just got a lot more complicated. You will then need to undo the physical/logical conversion of the sectors to blocks to get back to a raw device image of the RX media. Another thought ... if the disk image was taken as a logical filesystem dump (of blocks 0. thru 987. for the 505,856. byte image) then that image should be mountable under SIMH as an MSCP disk device image. MSCP will support arbitrary sized disk images of logical blocks. So one could boot RT11 for example from an RK05 image, and then access the unknown image on an MSCP disk device to see if it has a valid RT11 filesystem on it (or using other bootable images like RSX, as necessary). If the filesystem is valid and has meaningful files on it that would indicate it is a logical disk device image, as opposed to a physical sector by sector image of all tracks (or skipping track 0.) as one would normally expect for RX01/2 media for the PDP-11.
Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
On Sun, Aug 13, 2017 at 9:00 AM, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote: > Hi all, > > maybe someone can help. > I would like to install TCP/IP on my RT-11 system. > After a short search I have found the following, which I would use: > http://www.classiccmp.org/PDP-11/RT-11/freeware/decus11/110939/rthtml/tcpget.htm > But the images are in DSK format, but I can't write them with PDP11GUI, > which is the only way I have at the moment. I would take a quick look at those .DSK images to see what I can make of them, but none of the download links on that page work for me. For example, I can't download this .DSK image. Do these links work for other people? ftp://shop-pdp.kent.edu/du3:/tcpip.pkg/tcpipm.dsk
ULTRIX 4.5 on DECstation won't boot into multi-user mode
Hi all, I picked up a DECstation 5000/200 over a year ago, which I haven't really played with until this weekend. I burnt an Ultrix 4.5 iso, as I have a RRD43 cdrom drive. The installation appeared to go fine, and I was very pleased to see that Emacs is available in the unsupported packages. When I try to boot, it prints out to the console ]] ]] preserving editor files ]] clearing /tmp ]] standard daemons: update cron accounting network snmpd printer. ]] start errlog daemon - elcsd ]] Thu Aug 14 18:30:23 GMT 1997 and then it seems to just stop. I can hear some repetitive disk activity, but nothing is happening on the console. I have a monitor hooked up to the PMAG-F card, but it just displays a black screen. If I boot into single user mode "boot 5/rz1/vmunix single", things seem to work fine, although I can't start X. From here, I took a look in /etc/rc and /etc/rc.local, and it seems to get to the end of them both fine. There is an "exit 0" on the line after the date command is executed. Is there a script called after this which I have missed? I'm a bit new to Ultrix. Does anyone have any ideas? Is it X related? Perhaps I should try a fresh install without DECwindows, if that is an option. Thanks, Aaron.
RE: DECstation 220. Another Impasse
> -Original Message- > From: Rob Jarratt [mailto:robert.jarr...@ntlworld.com] > Sent: 13 August 2017 20:31 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts (cctalk@classiccmp.org) > > Subject: DECstation 220. Another Impasse > > I have reached another impasse in my attempts to get my DECstation 220 to > work. I have posted the details on my blog here: https://robs-old- > computers.com/2017/08/13/decstation-220-update/ > > If anyone has any suggestions I would be interested to hear them. > I have looked at this problem a little more. I have two motherboards, neither of which work, but one at least produces a corrupted video pattern. The one that works best appears not to be writing to the video memory. When I look at the EMEM pin on the Paradise PVGA1A chip I can see a signal but the scope shows a trace that is very faint. When I look at the same pin on the other motherboard, I get a nice clear bright trace on the scope, using all the same settings on the scope. This pin is driven by a non-inverting buffer (74LS126). The input side of the buffer is tied to 0V, the enable signal comes from a custom gate array. Comparing the buffer's enable signal on the two boards I see the same dimming effect on the board with the corrupted video pattern, and no dimming on the other board. I have checked the other pins on both the buffer and the gate array and I don't see anything suspicious. I am thinking of speculatively replacing the 74LS126 because I can go and buy replacement parts for it, I can't replace the gate array (although I could conceivably swap the part on the two boards). Can anyone offer any suggestions as to the best course of action? Thanks Rob
Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
Hi All, After all the replays and discussions I was more and more the impression, that the images couldn't be in DSK, as this would mean some extra work, as this format can't be created on a PDP. To be more or less sure I have tried to open them with some DSK capable tool, which I had on an older 486 based PC. The outcome was a a message which told me, that the format is not supported. So I have tied to reach Alan via Mail, and have asked about the format, and that I had the hope to write the Images with PDP11GUI. After a very short delay, I had this replay with all needed details, and the OK, to post it here. So you were right about Track0... I will test it today's evening, and report back afterwards. Many Greetings Ulrich Am 14.08.17 um 20:29 schrieb Alan R. Baldwin: Ulrich, The RX02 DSK images were created using the following RT-11 command file script: create image.dsk/allocate:988 mount ld3: image.dsk init ld3: This results in a file of 988 blocks (505,856 bytes) in length. The program PDP11GUI wants a file of 512,512 bytes in length ... So this requires an explanation - An RX01 or RX02 floppy disk is based on the original IBM 8" disk format of 77 tracks with 26 sectors per track and for a Double Density RX02 has 2,002 sectors of 256 bytes each yielding 512,512 bytes (or 1,001 blocks each 512 bytes long.) However, DEC chose NOT to use the first track of the disk on any RX01 or RX02 disk. Thus 76 tracks with 26 sectors per track for the Double Density RX02 is 1,976 sectors of 256 bytes each yielding 505,856 bytes (or 988 blocks each 512 bytes long.) In RT-11 the following command copies a disk file created with the above command file directly and correctly to a real RX02 disk: copy image.dsk/file dy0:/dev as the image disk has the same size as the active part of the RX02 disk. To use the PDP11GUI program you will need to prepend a file of length 6,656 bytes to the TCP/IP files. The file content is inconsequential. Copy the image file you wish to fix up into a new location. 1) Open up a Command Prompt Window and move to the directory containing the image file. 2) Make the fix up file as follows: fsutil file createnew hdr.bin 6656 3) Concatenate the fix up file with the image.dsk file: copy /b hdr.bin /b + image.dsk /b newimage.dsk /b The newimage.dsk file will now load into the PDP11GUI program. Since normally the RX01/RX02 drivers don't access track 0 I don't know what the PDP11GUI program does with those extra 6,656 bytes. Good Luck, Alan
Re: RX02 *.DSK convert to PDP11GUI Image format
Hi Glen, a mirror is here: http://rtk.mirrors.pdp-11.ru/_pdp-11/shop-pdp.net/pub/tcpip/tcpip/ Please have a look onto my last reply, as the problem seams to be solved. Many Greetings Ulrich Am 15.08.17 um 06:49 schrieb Glen Slick: On Sun, Aug 13, 2017 at 9:00 AM, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote: Hi all, maybe someone can help. I would like to install TCP/IP on my RT-11 system. After a short search I have found the following, which I would use: http://www.classiccmp.org/PDP-11/RT-11/freeware/decus11/110939/rthtml/tcpget.htm But the images are in DSK format, but I can't write them with PDP11GUI, which is the only way I have at the moment. I would take a quick look at those .DSK images to see what I can make of them, but none of the download links on that page work for me. For example, I can't download this .DSK image. Do these links work for other people? ftp://shop-pdp.kent.edu/du3:/tcpip.pkg/tcpipm.dsk
Re: SOLVED: PDP-11/84 Bootstrap for TSV05 (Dilog DU142)
Hi All, It was possible to solve the issue with much help from Jerry and Paul. 1. Bootstrap Loader as printed in the Dilog Documentation is wrong and was fixed. Here is the fixed and running version: Device name = MS New = Beginning address = 001000 New = Last byte address = 001400 New = Start address = 001000 New = Highest Unit number = 1 New = Device Description = TSV05 New = Enter ROM ODT xx/ = open word location xx if address even, byte if odd RETURN = close location . or LF = close location and open next - = close location and open previous ROM ODT> 001000/012700 ROM ODT> 001002/172520 ROM ODT> 001004/012701 ROM ODT> 001006/172522 ROM ODT> 001010/005011 ROM ODT> 001012/105711 ROM ODT> 001014/100376 ROM ODT> 001016/012710 ROM ODT> 001020/001064 ROM ODT> 001022/105711 ROM ODT> 001024/100376 ROM ODT> 001026/012710 ROM ODT> 001030/001104 ROM ODT> 001032/105711 ROM ODT> 001034/100376 ROM ODT> 001036/012710 ROM ODT> 001040/001104 ROM ODT> 001042/105711 ROM ODT> 001044/100376 ROM ODT> 001046/005711 ROM ODT> 001050/100421 ROM ODT> 001052/012704 ROM ODT> 001054/001102 ROM ODT> 001056/005000 ROM ODT> 001060/005007 ROM ODT> 001062/046523 ROM ODT> 001064/140004 ROM ODT> 001066/001074 ROM ODT> 001070/00 ROM ODT> 001072/10 ROM ODT> 001074/001116 ROM ODT> 001076/00 ROM ODT> 001100/16 ROM ODT> 001102/00 ROM ODT> 001104/140001 ROM ODT> 001106/00 ROM ODT> 001110/00 ROM ODT> 001112/001000 ROM ODT> 001114/00 ROM ODT> 001116/00 Boot Process: Message 04 Entering Dialog mode Commands are Help, Boot, List, Setup, Map and Test. Type a command then press the RETURN key: B MS0 Trying MS0MSBOOT V05.04 ▒* 2. The issues I had after the Bootstrap was fixed where related to my cable, where I had overall three Pins with bad/no contact depending on the cable movement. Outcome: Type a command then press the RETURN key: B MS0 Trying MS0 001116 @ .dir ms0: ?DIR-F-Error reading directory COPY MS0: NL: ?PIP-F-Directory input error MS0: 2.1 Debugging via: Examine 1116 +7: @001116/100022 @001120/12 @001122/00 @001124/000310 @001126/01 @001130/10 @001132/00 @001134/00 Extended Status 0 at 001124 seams to be OK, as 000310 can be mapped to: motion, on-line, phase-encoded drive Extended Status 1 at 001126 seams to be not OK, as 1 means read data Parity error Related Pin's: Connector P1: 14 Connector P2: 8, 32 So I'm quite happy to have a running Pertec 1/2" drive. Again many thanks and Greetings Ulrich
