Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Paul Anderson]

Sorry Rod, I'll try to shoot you pricing/availability later this week.

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 12:49 AM, Rod Smallwood <
rodsmallwoo...@btinternet.com> wrote:

> Hi Guys
>
> I'm just about done sending first batch front panels
> Needless to say I have had some feed back on reqirements.
> As  well  as  the variations of 8/e panels, 8/f 8/i 8/L and 8/m have been
> mentioned.
> ;
> Of these the 8/f seemed like a good place to start. I have the white
> border and DEC logo in place.
> When it came to the address an interesting issue arose.
> DEC used their own font,  It can be identified like this
> The letter a is formed by a circle with a vertical bar on the right hand
> side.
> This font is used for titles and the like in handbooks of this period.
>
> I'm going to have go at building this font as a nornal windows font and
> adding it those available on windows.
> If anybody has  aready done this I'd like to hear from them.
>
> I'm on holiday from 25-JUN-2015  to 2-JUL-2015.
> We go to the big Ham Radio meeting in Friedrichshafen every year.
> I should be able to do email but not much else
>
> Finally I am in need of the following cards for my 8/e
>
> -- M8330 - KK8E Timing board (system clock)
> -- M8340 \_ optional KE8E EAE board 1
> -- M8341 /  optional KE8E EAE board 2
> xx M8310 \_ KK8E CPU control (/I already have this/)
> -- M8300 /  KK8E CPU registers
> -- M837  - KM8E or MC8E extended Memory & Time Share control
>
>
> Can I get a basic system up without the 8340/41 and the M837?
> If yes then I just need the M8330 AND M8300
>
> _Can you help bring my 8/e back to life?_
>
>
> Rod Smallwood
>
>

Re: RK06 alignment pack

[Johnny Billquist]

On 2015-06-18 08:16, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:

What is the difference between an RK06 and 07 ?

Is it capacity?


Yes. The RK07 is double the capacity.


Could this pack be used to align an RK07 ?


I don't think so. The RK06 and RK07 used the same design for the packs, 
but the RK07 packs twice the capacity. I believe it is just doubling the 
number of tracks. But of course, that means that RK06 packs do not match 
what RK07 drive expects from track width and number of tracks.



I ask because we have an RK07 at the Update Computer Club.


I didn't know. When did we get one, and from where? We had one many 
years ago that I dumped. We might still have the packs from that one around.


Johnny



/P

On Wed, Jun 17, 2015 at 08:53:22PM +0100, Jarratt RMA wrote:

I don't have an RK06 and I am not expecting to get one any time soon, but I
don't mind putting in an offer just to be sure it gets saved, but I
wouldn't pay the full asking price. Does anyone intend to buy it or make an
offer? If so then I won't.

Regards

Rob

On 17 June 2015 at 16:39, Noel Chiappa  wrote:


Anyone need an RK06 alignment pack:


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-Equipment-RK06-Aglinment-pack-/221803433215

Seems like something that should definitely get saved!

 Noel




--
Johnny Billquist  || "I'm on a bus
  ||  on a psychedelic trip
email: b...@softjar.se ||  Reading murder books
pdp is alive! ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Pete Turnbull]

On 17/06/2015 12:16, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:

Off topic for a moment but, do you know perchance what's going to
happen to XH558 at the end of this year? I've never had a chance to
see a flying Vulcan, and it's too bad I won't ever get to see one (nor
did I get to see the awesome display of both of he flight worthy
Lancasters flying together last year...).


I'd have directed you to http://www.vulcantothesky.org/ if Rob hadn't 
already.  Sometimes, though, it flies near places not on the official 
list - for example, I've seen it fly almost over our house (we live near 
Elvington) on two different Fridays in the last month or so.  Presumably 
in transit to some other show.


Sadly, on the first occasion it flew circuits for a quarter of an hour, 
but I didn't hear it (or realise it was the Vulcan) until my wife said 
something like "Oh, that triangular aircraft has been flying around a 
bit for a while." (We often get noise from Elvington and sometimes I 
tune it out.)  I watched it fly a couple of circuits before I thought to 
fetch the camera - by which time it was almost out of sight.  On the 
second occasion it was so cloudy I couldn't get a decent shot.  Sigh.


--
Pete

Pete Turnbull

Re: RK06 alignment pack

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 11:39:19AM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
> On 2015-06-18 08:16, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
> >I ask because we have an RK07 at the Update Computer Club.
> 
> I didn't know. When did we get one, and from where? We had one many
> years ago that I dumped. We might still have the packs from that one
> around.
> 

Do you remember the pair of 11/44 that Göran brought us from Gothenburg, 
they came with one RK07 and a bunch of packs. The machines ended up 
elsewhere but we though the RK07 could have a place at Update.

Not sure how useful it is though.. 

/P

Front Panels Personal Update

[Christian Gauger-Cosgrove]

On 18 June 2015 at 01:49, Rod Smallwood > wrote:
> DEC used their own font,  It can be identified like this
> The letter a is formed by a circle with a vertical bar on the right hand
> side.
> This font is used for titles and the like in handbooks of this period.
>
> I'm going to have go at building this font as a nornal windows font and
> adding it those available on windows.
> If anybody has  aready done this I'd like to hear from them.
>
The Chalet font family is very similar to "the DEC font". <
http://www.houseind.com/fonts/collections/chalet> There are a few
differences, and I don't remember which specific one is the closest to the
DEC font. I think the "London 1970" weight/style is the one.

I haven't looked at the price, but I think it's pretty expensive.

Regards,
Christian



PS. One might find said fonts in a certain torrent...
--
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.


-- 
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Jonathan Katz]

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 1:39 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove
 wrote:
> The Chalet font family is very similar to "the DEC font". <
>
> PS. One might find said fonts in a certain torrent...

There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo
in blocks. That may be a start.

http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Christian Gauger-Cosgrove]

On Thursday, 18 June 2015, Jonathan Katz  wrote:
>
> There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo
> in blocks. That may be a start.
>
> http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html
>

If I recall, isn't the logo "just" Helvetica? I think,  not completely sure.


Also "typing" on a phone sucks.


Cheers,
Christian


-- 
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 07:50:02AM -0400, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
> On Thursday, 18 June 2015, Jonathan Katz  wrote:
> >
> > There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo
> > in blocks. That may be a start.
> >
> > http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html
> >
> 
> If I recall, isn't the logo "just" Helvetica? I think,  not completely sure.
> 

The article pointed to by URL above specifically state that it isn't.

/P

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Pete Turnbull]

On 18/06/2015 12:50, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:

On Thursday, 18 June 2015, Jonathan Katz  wrote:


There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo
in blocks. That may be a start.

http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html



If I recall, isn't the logo "just" Helvetica? I think,  not completely sure.


No, it isn't.  About 15 years ago I set out to recreate the necessary 
letters and digits from the font for one of the PDP-11 sites.  With some 
small experience of font design I quickly realised it's quite different 
from Helevetica in a number of aspects, and it took me a while to get it 
right.  In fact I'm not sure I got it exactly, but Ned Batchelder did, 
so I never went back to it.  My early attempts at PDP-11 logos are at 
http://www.dunnington.info/public/PDP-11/ if you want a laugh.


--
Pete

Pete Turnbull

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Christian Gauger-Cosgrove]

On Thursday, 18 June 2015, Pontus Pihlgren  wrote:
>
> The article pointed to by URL above specifically state that it isn't.
>
> /P
>

Yeah, I realized that once my phone's *bleep* internet actually loaded the
page... about two minutes after I sent the mail.

That article is quite neat, I must say. I always thought that the logo was
only Helvetica, but it's interesting to see what it really is.


Cheers,
Christian


-- 
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.

XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Christian Gauger-Cosgrove]

On 18 June 2015 at 06:06, Pete Turnbull > wrote:
> I'd have directed you to http://www.vulcantothesky.org/ if Rob hadn't
> already.  Sometimes, though, it flies near places not on the official
list -
> for example, I've seen it fly almost over our house (we live near
Elvington)
> on two different Fridays in the last month or so.  Presumably in transit
to
> some other show.
>
Very neat. It's too bad it's never flown to Canada before. Then again, why
would it? I feel kind of miffed that I've not really gotten the chance to
see any really "cool planes" flying. (I'd have loved to see the SR-71 in
flight, or to see an SR-71 up close at all; the latter is still possible
but I don't quite have the money for it...)


> Sadly, on the first occasion it flew circuits for a quarter of an hour,
but
> I didn't hear it (or realise it was the Vulcan) until my wife said
something
> like "Oh, that triangular aircraft has been flying around a bit for a
> while." (We often get noise from Elvington and sometimes I tune it out.)
I
> watched it fly a couple of circuits before I thought to fetch the camera -
> by which time it was almost out of sight.  On the second occasion it was
so
> cloudy I couldn't get a decent shot.  Sigh.
>
I've had the fortune of seeing the former RCAF FM213 (now registered as
C-GVRA) flying a few times. I honestly can't really tell if it is the
Lancaster by looking at it (my eyes are shit), but the sound is
sufficiently different from any5thing else there's little doubt. Though I
may have mistook the B-25 or C-47 for it.

Did you get a chance to see both of the flightworthy Lancasters together
last year? I didn't since I'm not in the UK and the time that FM213 was
over in the UK intersected with my university terms.


Regards,
Christian
--
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.


-- 
Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
STCKON08DS0
Contact information available upon request.

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Jonathan Katz]

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 3:54 PM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove
 wrote:
> That article is quite neat, I must say. I always thought that the logo was
> only Helvetica, but it's interesting to see what it really is.

The only reason I know about the article was due to Google, but that
was because I used to work for ArcSight and we were taken over by HP.
I wanted to make a faux ArcSight logo in the image of the old DEC logo
for a co-worker who retired early from HP. I made my faux-logo did
using Helvetica. His story was interesting. He worked for Tandem. Was
bought by Digital. Was bought by Compaq. Was bought my HP. Took early
retirement. Found job at ArcSight. Worked there for a few years and
then was assimilated by HP (again.) It was amusing for him to see
everything come full-circle.

DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Chris Osborn]

On Jun 18, 2015, at 4:42 AM, Jonathan Katz  wrote:

> There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo
> in blocks. That may be a start.
> 
> http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html

"The logo up to then had been the letters DEC in blocks the shape of
the plug-in cards that DEC had been producing."

Does anyone have a picture of that? My Google-fu is failing me. I love cutting 
vinyl stickers of old logos and I think an original DEC logo would make a great 
prize in the contests I run on RetroBattlestations.

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 07:20:51AM -0700, Chris Osborn wrote:
> 
> On Jun 18, 2015, at 4:42 AM, Jonathan Katz  wrote:
> 
> > There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo
> > in blocks. That may be a start.
> > 
> > http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html
> 
>   "The logo up to then had been the letters DEC in blocks the shape of
>   the plug-in cards that DEC had been producing."
> 
> Does anyone have a picture of that? My Google-fu is failing me. I love 
> cutting vinyl stickers of old logos and I think an original DEC logo would 
> make a great prize in the contests I run on RetroBattlestations.

I suppose it's this one:

http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/still-image/dec/pdp-1_online/dec.flip_flop_201.102633142.lg.jpg

I recall seing a better version of the logo in some manual on bitsavers or 
similar. Can't find it now.

/P

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Chris Osborn]

On Jun 18, 2015, at 7:25 AM, Pontus Pihlgren  wrote:

> I suppose it's this one:
> 
> http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/still-image/dec/pdp-1_online/dec.flip_flop_201.102633142.lg.jpg

I found that one a couple of times but it just looked like a rectangle to me, 
not “plug-in cards”, so I didn’t think that was it. I guess I was expecting too 
much. :-)

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Cory Smelosky]

On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:



I suppose it's this one:

http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/still-image/dec/pdp-1_online/dec.flip_flop_201.102633142.lg.jpg

I recall seing a better version of the logo in some manual on bitsavers or 
similar. Can't find it now.



I have a copy laying around as PostScript.


/P



--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects

Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[Chris Osborn]

It’s Droste Week on RetroBattlestations! Inspired by a couple of different 
posts, I thought it would be fun to do a challenge where people don’t just post 
a picture of their computer, but they display the picture of their computer 
*on* their computer and post that! It’s going quite well and I really enjoy 
reading about the hoops people are having to jump through to get pictures 
converted and transferred and displayed.

There have been photos of monochrome computers with high resolution, low 
resolution block graphics, ASCII art on CP/M computers, and even a mechanical 
typewriter! What can you come up with?

http://retrobattlestations.com

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

RE: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Electronics Plus]

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Chris
Osborn
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2015 9:21 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)


On Jun 18, 2015, at 4:42 AM, Jonathan Katz  wrote:

> There is a Postscript doc out there with the DEC "D I G I T A L" logo 
> in blocks. That may be a start.
> 
> http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.
> html

"The logo up to then had been the letters DEC in blocks the shape of
the plug-in cards that DEC had been producing."

Does anyone have a picture of that? My Google-fu is failing me. I love
cutting vinyl stickers of old logos and I think an original DEC logo would
make a great prize in the contests I run on RetroBattlestations.

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Have you seen the pics of old DEC machines at the bottom of this page?
http://www.commodorecomputerclub.com/road-trip-living-computer-museum-june-2
5-2011/



-
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2014.0.4800 / Virus Database: 4365/10045 - Release Date: 06/18/15

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Chris Osborn]

On Jun 18, 2015, at 7:30 AM, Cory Smelosky  wrote:

> On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
> 
>> I suppose it's this one:
>> 
>> http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/still-image/dec/pdp-1_online/dec.flip_flop_201.102633142.lg.jpg
> 
> I have a copy laying around as PostScript.

I’d love to get a copy!

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: DEC Logo

[Rod Smallwood]

Yup thats it  There were a couple of them in a glass case in the 
entrance to Parker Street  (DEC HQ after they moved out of the Mill)
There was a story (There was always a story at DEC)  that one engineer 
had put a lump of lead in two of them and used them for bookends.


My favorite story was one I know to be true. The story was that Ken 
Olsen drove a Pinto (cheap amercian car) and parked with everyone else.
Sure enough there was this tatty Pinto parked in the main car park. To a 
depth of two cars the parking spaces around it were empty!!


The other one was his saying that the door to his office was always 
open. His office didn't have a door.!!  He had it removed when he came 
over from the mill..


Rod Smallwood

On 18/06/2015 15:33, Chris Osborn wrote:

On Jun 18, 2015, at 7:30 AM, Cory Smelosky  wrote:


On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:


I suppose it's this one:

http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/still-image/dec/pdp-1_online/dec.flip_flop_201.102633142.lg.jpg

I have a copy laying around as PostScript.

I’d love to get a copy!

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Pete Turnbull]

On 18/06/2015 14:58, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:


Did you get a chance to see both of the flightworthy Lancasters together
last year? I didn't since I'm not in the UK and the time that FM213 was
over in the UK intersected with my university terms.


Sadly not, I've only ever seen one at a time.  But on a few occasions, 
since Elvington airfield is little over a mile from our house and that's 
one of the places they do demo flights.  Except when the residents 
complain (who are these nutters that buy a house next to a working 
airfield and then complain about noise?).


--
Pete

Pete Turnbull

Re: DEC Logo

[Paul Koning]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 10:55 AM, Rod Smallwood  
> wrote:
> 
> ...
> My favorite story was one I know to be true. The story was that Ken Olsen 
> drove a Pinto (cheap amercian car) and parked with everyone else.
> Sure enough there was this tatty Pinto parked in the main car park. To a 
> depth of two cars the parking spaces around it were empty!!

Not only that, but he he had a clear policy forbidding reserved parking spaces 
(other than handicapped spaces).  His answer was that if you wanted a space 
near the door, all you had to do was come to work early.

paul

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Cory Smelosky]

On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Chris Osborn wrote:





I have a copy laying around as PostScript.


I?d love to get a copy!


Let me find it.



--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com




--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Cory Smelosky]

On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Chris Osborn wrote:


I have a copy laying around as PostScript.


I?d love to get a copy!



http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html


--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com




--
Cory Smelosky
http://gewt.net Personal stuff
http://gimme-sympathy.org Projects

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Mike Stein]

- Original Message - 
From: "Christian Gauger-Cosgrove" 

To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic 
Posts" 

Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2015 9:58 AM
Subject: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc


On 18 June 2015 at 06:06, Pete Turnbull 

> wrote:
I'd have directed you to 
http://www.vulcantothesky.org/ if Rob hadn't
already.  Sometimes, though, it flies near 
places not on the official

list -
for example, I've seen it fly almost over our 
house (we live near

Elvington)
on two different Fridays in the last month or 
so.  Presumably in transit

to

some other show.

Very neat. It's too bad it's never flown to 
Canada before. Then again, why
would it? I feel kind of miffed that I've not 
really gotten the chance to
see any really "cool planes" flying. (I'd have 
loved to see the SR-71 in
flight, or to see an SR-71 up close at all; the 
latter is still possible

but I don't quite have the money for it...)


- Reply -

As a matter of fact, both the Vulcan and the 
Blackbird have appeared at the Canadian 
International Air Show here in Toronto in past 
years:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_International_Air_Show

Saw them both; Awesome!

m

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Chris Osborn]

On Jun 18, 2015, at 8:46 AM, Cory Smelosky  wrote:

> On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Chris Osborn wrote:
> 
>> I?d love to get a copy!
> 
> http://nedbatchelder.com/blog/200712/ancient_history_the_digital_logo.html 
> 
That’s the modern Digital logo, not the DEC logo that looks like the plug-in 
cards. I thought you had a ps of the original pre-1957 DEC logo.

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Guy Sotomayor]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 8:54 AM, Mike Stein  wrote:
> 
> - Original Message - From: "Christian Gauger-Cosgrove" 
> 
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" 
> Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2015 9:58 AM
> Subject: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc
> 
> 
>> On 18 June 2015 at 06:06, Pete Turnbull > > wrote:
>>> I'd have directed you to http://www.vulcantothesky.org/ if Rob hadn't
>>> already.  Sometimes, though, it flies near places not on the official
>> list -
>>> for example, I've seen it fly almost over our house (we live near
>> Elvington)
>>> on two different Fridays in the last month or so.  Presumably in transit
>> to
>>> some other show.
>>> 
>> Very neat. It's too bad it's never flown to Canada before. Then again, why
>> would it? I feel kind of miffed that I've not really gotten the chance to
>> see any really "cool planes" flying. (I'd have loved to see the SR-71 in
>> flight, or to see an SR-71 up close at all; the latter is still possible
>> but I don't quite have the money for it...)
> 
> - Reply -
> 
> As a matter of fact, both the Vulcan and the Blackbird have appeared at the 
> Canadian International Air Show here in Toronto in past years:
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_International_Air_Show
> 
> Saw them both; Awesome!

My son is stationed at Beale AFB (where the SR-71s were originally based) and 
7963 is on static display there.  I've been up to it (you can actually *touch* 
it!)  They are wicked cool looking and *big*.   They also have a static display 
of the drone which could be launched from the back of an SR-71.  After some 
initial testing (can't remember if they lost an aircraft in the process), they 
decided it wasn't a particularly good idea.  The clearance between the drone 
and the vertical stabilizers/rudders is not large.

TTFN - Guy

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Peter Cetinski]

>> 
> My son is stationed at Beale AFB (where the SR-71s were originally based) and 
> 7963 is on static display there.  I've been up to it (you can actually 
> *touch* it!)  They are wicked cool looking and *big*.   They also have a 
> static display of the drone which could be launched from the back of an 
> SR-71.  After some initial testing (can't remember if they lost an aircraft 
> in the process), they decided it wasn't a particularly good idea.  The 
> clearance between the drone and the vertical stabilizers/rudders is not large.
> 
> TTFN - Guy


I worked on the cameras on the SR-71 at Beale in the late 1980s.  Still gives 
me goosebumps thinking about it.  The drone was the D-21 which flew on the back 
of the M-21 (which was modified A-12 (which itself was the SR-71s 
predecessor)).  You can see a video of that fateful test here.

https://youtu.be/GMyC2urCl_4

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Guy Sotomayor]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:18 AM, Peter Cetinski  wrote:
> 
>>> 
>> My son is stationed at Beale AFB (where the SR-71s were originally based) 
>> and 7963 is on static display there.  I've been up to it (you can actually 
>> *touch* it!)  They are wicked cool looking and *big*.   They also have a 
>> static display of the drone which could be launched from the back of an 
>> SR-71.  After some initial testing (can't remember if they lost an aircraft 
>> in the process), they decided it wasn't a particularly good idea.  The 
>> clearance between the drone and the vertical stabilizers/rudders is not 
>> large.
>> 
>> TTFN - Guy
> 
> 
> I worked on the cameras on the SR-71 at Beale in the late 1980s.  Still gives 
> me goosebumps thinking about it.  The drone was the D-21 which flew on the 
> back of the M-21 (which was modified A-12 (which itself was the SR-71s 
> predecessor)).  You can see a video of that fateful test here.
> 
> https://youtu.be/GMyC2urCl_4

Thanks.  I hadn't seen that film before.

I'm sort of sad about the SR-71.  Our house is on a hill that can (almost) 
overlook Beale.  It would have been *amazing* to have seen/heard SR-71s taking 
off.

BTW, we see U-2s occasionally from our house.

TTFN - Guy

Re: Front Panels - First shipments arrive in US

[Bob Rosenbloom]

On 6/15/2015 10:21 PM, Rod Smallwood wrote:


Good Morning  All Panel Fans!!

According to the shippers the first consignments of PDP-8/e front 
panels were delivered in the US yesterday,

Confirmations and comments to me please.

Rod Smallwood






Got mine in great shape. Looks like it will be a perfect fit. It's quite 
a bit brighter than the old panel. Almost a "glossy" vs "mat" type of 
difference. Looks great though.
Some comparisons to my DEC PDP8/m and a re-branded (Computer Controls) 
8/m panel can be seen here: http://www.dvq.com/DEC-panels/


The C/C computer's panel is a little faded, not to mention the paint 
flaking off. The DEC 8/m is not faded, but is a mat finish.
The DEC 8/m is actually mounted on an 8/e switch panel (and chassis) as 
it uses incandescent lamps.


The new panel is going on a chassis that has no panel. I still need to 
fabricate a switch board for it. I have played with 3D printing switch
handles with OK results. Just have to find the actual slide switches 
with the handle brackets, or make some.


Looking forward to an 8/f panel, and hopefully some bezels from Rod.

Bob

--
Vintage computers and electronics
www.dvq.com
www.tekmuseum.com
www.decmuseum.org

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Peter Cetinski]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 12:26 PM, Guy Sotomayor  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:18 AM, Peter Cetinski  wrote:
>> 
 
>>> My son is stationed at Beale AFB (where the SR-71s were originally based) 
>>> and 7963 is on static display there.  I've been up to it (you can actually 
>>> *touch* it!)  They are wicked cool looking and *big*.   They also have a 
>>> static display of the drone which could be launched from the back of an 
>>> SR-71.  After some initial testing (can't remember if they lost an aircraft 
>>> in the process), they decided it wasn't a particularly good idea.  The 
>>> clearance between the drone and the vertical stabilizers/rudders is not 
>>> large.
>>> 
>>> TTFN - Guy
>> 
>> 
>> I worked on the cameras on the SR-71 at Beale in the late 1980s.  Still 
>> gives me goosebumps thinking about it.  The drone was the D-21 which flew on 
>> the back of the M-21 (which was modified A-12 (which itself was the SR-71s 
>> predecessor)).  You can see a video of that fateful test here.
>> 
>> https://youtu.be/GMyC2urCl_4
> 
> Thanks.  I hadn't seen that film before.
> 
> I'm sort of sad about the SR-71.  Our house is on a hill that can (almost) 
> overlook Beale.  It would have been *amazing* to have seen/heard SR-71s 
> taking off.
> 
> BTW, we see U-2s occasionally from our house.
> 
> TTFN - Guy
> 
> 

Yes, you never got tired of seeing a “sled” (our nickname for the blackbird) 
take off.  Even more impressive were the engine tests of the J-58 where they 
used to invite us to come watch at night.  You were able to stand within 50 
feet or so of the engine which was locked down into a test harness as they ran 
it at full afterburner.  The ground would shake and your teeth would rattle as 
your ear protectors tried to bounce off your head.  I’m sure the tinnitus I 
have today was caused by those experiences.  

Re: Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[geneb]

On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Chris Osborn wrote:


It’s Droste Week on RetroBattlestations! Inspired by a couple of different 
posts, I thought it would be fun to do a challenge where people don’t just post 
a picture of their computer, but they display the picture of their computer 
*on* their computer and post that! It’s going quite well and I really enjoy 
reading about the hoops people are having to jump through to get pictures 
converted and transferred and displayed.

There have been photos of monochrome computers with high resolution, low 
resolution block graphics, ASCII art on CP/M computers, and even a mechanical 
typewriter! What can you come up with?

The best one by far (so far) is the VT240 that's displaying the picture by 
using a redefined character set.


g.

--
Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007
http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind.
http://www.diy-cockpits.org/coll - Go Collimated or Go Home.
Some people collect things for a hobby.  Geeks collect hobbies.

ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment
A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes.
http://scarlet.deltasoft.com - Get it _today_!

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Guy Sotomayor]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:32 AM, Peter Cetinski  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Jun 18, 2015, at 12:26 PM, Guy Sotomayor  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:18 AM, Peter Cetinski  wrote:
>>> 
> 
 My son is stationed at Beale AFB (where the SR-71s were originally based) 
 and 7963 is on static display there.  I've been up to it (you can actually 
 *touch* it!)  They are wicked cool looking and *big*.   They also have a 
 static display of the drone which could be launched from the back of an 
 SR-71.  After some initial testing (can't remember if they lost an 
 aircraft in the process), they decided it wasn't a particularly good idea. 
  The clearance between the drone and the vertical stabilizers/rudders is 
 not large.
 
 TTFN - Guy
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I worked on the cameras on the SR-71 at Beale in the late 1980s.  Still 
>>> gives me goosebumps thinking about it.  The drone was the D-21 which flew 
>>> on the back of the M-21 (which was modified A-12 (which itself was the 
>>> SR-71s predecessor)).  You can see a video of that fateful test here.
>>> 
>>> https://youtu.be/GMyC2urCl_4
>> 
>> Thanks.  I hadn't seen that film before.
>> 
>> I'm sort of sad about the SR-71.  Our house is on a hill that can (almost) 
>> overlook Beale.  It would have been *amazing* to have seen/heard SR-71s 
>> taking off.
>> 
>> BTW, we see U-2s occasionally from our house.
>> 
>> TTFN - Guy
>> 
>> 
> 
> Yes, you never got tired of seeing a “sled” (our nickname for the blackbird) 
> take off.  Even more impressive were the engine tests of the J-58 where they 
> used to invite us to come watch at night.  You were able to stand within 50 
> feet or so of the engine which was locked down into a test harness as they 
> ran it at full afterburner.  The ground would shake and your teeth would 
> rattle as your ear protectors tried to bounce off your head.  I’m sure the 
> tinnitus I have today was caused by those experiences.  

Yes, I'm familiar with the nickname.  The pilots were called "sled drivers".  
;-)

The start cart was amazing as well.  2 Buick V8 engines made *one* start cart 
and were required to start the J-58.  I can imagine the racket while starting 
it up.

I also found it interesting that while taking on fuel during in flight 
refueling the SR-71 became thrust limited and required lighting one of the 
afterburners (at minimum) to be able to maintain flight while attached to the 
tanker...the asymmetric thrust made for interesting times.

Great stories.

TTFN - Guy

Re: Documation card readers for sale

[John Ball]

Oh butts I sent that before I proofread.
I'm in the Pacific Northwest, about three or four hours east of Vancouver
BC. I have access to freight services should you take that route but for
your wallet I'd strongly recommend some sort of local or negotiated pickup.
;0

>>Are the readers in question these ones in Canada?
>>http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/showthread.php?45888-FS-Documation
-M1000-Card-Readers
Yes, that's me and those are the readers.

>>>I'm also working on getting a cable made to hook up to the M843 CR8-E
>>>punched card reader interface for the PDP-8/E, but that's a project for
>>>another day (year?).

That bloody EDAC connector is not cheap. I ended up sourcing one for like
$60. On the other hand you can hunt around for scrap 50 conductor telco
cable and you're all set for cabling. You can usually get it for its weight
in copper from a scrapyard.

-John

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Chris Elmquist]

On Thursday (06/18/2015 at 07:50AM -0400), Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote:
> 
> Also "typing" on a phone sucks.

Phoning on a "phone" sucks too.

-- 
Chris Elmquist

RE: Components Data Books

[tony duell]

> Yes! I am totally with you; just being able to flip through the books and
> peruse a broad swath of the vendor's product line, has the potential to

Precisely... I haven't a clue what is available now, other than the really 
common
parts the local suppliers stock. You just can't go to a website and hope to find
what is really available.

[...]

> text editor or whatnot to fire up Acrobat Reader ... It _is_ nice to have
> the ability to Google a random part number and get an ID back 99% of the
> time but when I am actually working with the part, yeah, it's so nice to

Oh, don't get me wrong. It is useful to be able to find data on the web. When
I have an obscure part it is a lot easier than trying to work out which data 
book
to buy and where to get it from

Mind you, I don't find google very useful. 99%+ of the hits are companies that
claim to be able to supply the device. Considering the one time I contacted such
a company about an obscure custom IC they asked me what package and how
many pins (for a device that had only ever existed as a 22 pin DIL),  I got
very suspicious as to what they would actually be supplying...

I find http://www.datasheetarchive.com/ to be a good first place to look.

But IMHO on-line data sheets should be in adition to paper data books, not
a replacement for them.

I have never found a computer which can display the pages of a .pdf as 
fast as I can flip through a book. And no, I don't just mean classic computers 
;-)

> have paper... When I'm doing a project, most of my schematics start out on
> scraps of paper, too :O

That's all I ever use (well, maybe not scraps...). I call it a 'Paper Aided 
Design' system,
aka a 'PAD'. 

-tony

RE: RK06 alignment pack

[tony duell]

> 
> What is the difference between an RK06 and 07 ?
> 
> Is it capacity?

Yes, in particular number of cylinders. Both have 3 heads and IIRC same number 
of sectors.

The RK07 has narrower heads than the RK06. AFAIK the RK07 will not even read
an RK06 pack (I am not sure the servo will manage to lock).

> 
> Could this pack be used to align an RK07 ?

AFAIK, no. If it could, I would have bought it (given I have a pair of RK07s)

> 
> I ask because we have an RK07 at the Update Computer Club.

I also seem to remember that this pack is used with a special alignement 
meter, not a 'scope. And that there are special tools for moving the heads
I found a sort-of user manual for this on bitsavers, but no schematics of the
meter, so no easy way to replicate it.

-tony

RE: Documation card readers for sale

[tony duell]

> 
> That bloody EDAC connector is not cheap. I ended up sourcing one for like
> $60. On the other hand you can hunt around for scrap 50 conductor telco

No, but it is still available (easily) and it is very well made. Or at least 
the ones I
have used are. The back shells are designed so you can fit them round the 
cable after wiring, thus avoiding the fruity language normally produced when 
you wire up nearly 100 wires and realise you have forgotten to thread the cable
through the back shell.

-tony

RE: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Rich Alderson]

From: Chris Osborn
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2015 9:03 AM

> That’s the modern Digital logo, not the DEC logo that looks like the plug-in
> cards. I thought you had a ps of the original pre-1957 DEC logo.

Pre-1957???  That would be a good trick...

Rich

Rich Alderson
Vintage Computing Sr. Systems Engineer
Living Computer Museum
2245 1st Avenue S
Seattle, WA 98134

mailto:ri...@livingcomputermuseum.org

http://www.LivingComputerMuseum.org/

Re: DEC Logo (was: Front Panels Personal Update)

[Chris Osborn]

On Jun 18, 2015, at 11:15 AM, Rich Alderson  
wrote:
> 
>> That’s the modern Digital logo, not the DEC logo that looks like the plug-in
>> cards. I thought you had a ps of the original pre-1957 DEC logo.
> 
> Pre-1957???  That would be a good trick…

I’m just going along with what that web site said that they had a different 
logo and then in 1957 they got their current logo.

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[Johnny Billquist]

On 2015-06-18 18:41, geneb wrote:

On Thu, 18 Jun 2015, Chris Osborn wrote:


It’s Droste Week on RetroBattlestations! Inspired by a couple of
different posts, I thought it would be fun to do a challenge where
people don’t just post a picture of their computer, but they display
the picture of their computer *on* their computer and post that! It’s
going quite well and I really enjoy reading about the hoops people are
having to jump through to get pictures converted and transferred and
displayed.

There have been photos of monochrome computers with high resolution,
low resolution block graphics, ASCII art on CP/M computers, and even a
mechanical typewriter! What can you come up with?


The best one by far (so far) is the VT240 that's displaying the picture
by using a redefined character set.


That seems silly. If it is a VT240, it can do graphics...
The character set trick is what you would have to go to if you have a 
VT220 though.


Johnny

--
Johnny Billquist  || "I'm on a bus
  ||  on a psychedelic trip
email: b...@softjar.se ||  Reading murder books
pdp is alive! ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

Re: Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[Chuck Guzis]

I went to the website, but still can't figure out what this has to do 
with chocolate...


--Chuck

Re: Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[Paul Koning]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 2:32 PM, Chuck Guzis  wrote:
> 
> I went to the website, but still can't figure out what this has to do with 
> chocolate…

Here’s the answer: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Droste_effect 

It’s a bit obscure unless you are Dutch and over 45 or so years old.

paul

Re: XH558 - was Re: using new technology etc

[Sean Caron]

Hi Christian,

I'm guessing by the CLLI code in your sig, you're maybe close to St.
Catharines, ON, CA?

If that's true, I just wanted to let you know that - IIRC - there is a
SR-71 on static display within a car trip of your location in Kalamazoo, MI
at the Kalamazoo Air Zoo. It's actually a B-model ... trainer ... I saw it
a few years ago when I was in town visiting my parents and it was pretty
cool ... I think it's still there:

http://www.airzoo.org/page.php?page_id=192

It doesn't do flying demos but it is a complete aircraft in "mint"
condition and you can get right up there and touch it.

Best,

Sean


On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 9:58 AM, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove <
captainkirk...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 18 June 2015 at 06:06, Pete Turnbull  > wrote:
> > I'd have directed you to http://www.vulcantothesky.org/ if Rob hadn't
> > already.  Sometimes, though, it flies near places not on the official
> list -
> > for example, I've seen it fly almost over our house (we live near
> Elvington)
> > on two different Fridays in the last month or so.  Presumably in transit
> to
> > some other show.
> >
> Very neat. It's too bad it's never flown to Canada before. Then again, why
> would it? I feel kind of miffed that I've not really gotten the chance to
> see any really "cool planes" flying. (I'd have loved to see the SR-71 in
> flight, or to see an SR-71 up close at all; the latter is still possible
> but I don't quite have the money for it...)
>
>
> > Sadly, on the first occasion it flew circuits for a quarter of an hour,
> but
> > I didn't hear it (or realise it was the Vulcan) until my wife said
> something
> > like "Oh, that triangular aircraft has been flying around a bit for a
> > while." (We often get noise from Elvington and sometimes I tune it out.)
> I
> > watched it fly a couple of circuits before I thought to fetch the camera
> -
> > by which time it was almost out of sight.  On the second occasion it was
> so
> > cloudy I couldn't get a decent shot.  Sigh.
> >
> I've had the fortune of seeing the former RCAF FM213 (now registered as
> C-GVRA) flying a few times. I honestly can't really tell if it is the
> Lancaster by looking at it (my eyes are shit), but the sound is
> sufficiently different from any5thing else there's little doubt. Though I
> may have mistook the B-25 or C-47 for it.
>
> Did you get a chance to see both of the flightworthy Lancasters together
> last year? I didn't since I'm not in the UK and the time that FM213 was
> over in the UK intersected with my university terms.
>
>
> Regards,
> Christian
> --
> Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
> STCKON08DS0
> Contact information available upon request.
>
>
> --
> Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove
> STCKON08DS0
> Contact information available upon request.
>

Altos ACS 8000 8500 board Schematic

[william degnan]

Altos ACS 8000 8500 board schematics/chapter from the 8000 hardware
supplement posted here:
http://vintagecomputer.net/altos/8000/
b

Re: Altos ACS 8000 8500 board Schematic

[Chris Osborn]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 10:31 AM, william degnan  wrote:
> 
> Altos ACS 8000 8500 board schematics/chapter from the 8000 hardware
> supplement posted here:
> http://vintagecomputer.net/altos/8000/

There’s a diagram there but no schematics. If you want the schematics for the 
8500 board they are here:

http://chiclassiccomp.org/docs/content/computing/Altos/Manuals/

--
Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com

Re: Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[Chuck Guzis]

On 06/18/2015 11:39 AM, Paul Koning wrote:


It’s a bit obscure unless you are Dutch and over 45 or so years old.


Ah, that explains it, thanks.  I like Droste chocolate, but don't recall 
seeing the recursive label.  Land o' Lakes butter, however, I'm familiar 
with.


--Chuck

Re: Front Panels Personal Update

[Fred Cisin]

Also "typing" on a phone sucks.

Phoning on a "phone" sucks too.


"I have always wished for my computer to be as easy to use as my 
telephone; my wish has come true because I can no longer figure

out how to use my telephone." -   Bjarne Stroustrup

Re: Have you seen Droste Week on RetroBattlestations?

[Jecel Assumpcao Jr.]

Chris Osborn wrote:

>[...] I thought it would be fun to do a challenge where people don't just
> post a picture of their computer, but they display the picture of their
> computer *on* their computer and post that!

Not quite within these rules, but here are two cases of old computers
showing drawings of themselves back when they were new:

Alan Kay's PhD thesis was about the FLEX Machine he developed with Ed
Cheadle. These "screen captures" include a drawing of the the machine
itself from around 1968 or 1969:

http://gagne.homedns.org/~tgagne/wp-content/uploads/6.jpg

Here is my own Merlin 2, a 68000 based Smalltalk computer, with a
drawing of itself in 1987:

http://smalltalk.org.br/fotos/inova11.jpg

Drawing with a keyboard was awkward enough that I didn't bother making
the chip layout very accurate, not the drawn keyboard either. The colors
are wrong because I was playing the the color pallet after the drawing
was finished (http://smalltalk.org.br/fotos/inova12.jpg shows a
different setting) and I don't have a picture of the setting where the
boards are green and the keyboard white, unfortunately. The drawing also
shows the original Ethernet based configuration instead of the one with
the adapted PC bus on which the drawing is being shown.

-- Jecel

Re: Documation card readers for sale

[John Ball]

Just a heads up that both units are now pending a sale. If one or either
completely fall through I'll bump this back up here on the list. Thanks to
all who inquired.

-John

Re: Documation card readers for sale

[Mark J. Blair]

> On Jun 18, 2015, at 17:02 , John Ball  wrote:
> 
> Just a heads up that both units are now pending a sale. If one or either
> completely fall through I'll bump this back up here on the list. Thanks to
> all who inquired.

Yay!


-- 
Mark J. Blair, NF6X 
http://www.nf6x.net/

Re: RK06 alignment pack

[Jon Elson]

On 06/18/2015 01:02 PM, tony duell wrote:


I also seem to remember that this pack is used with a special alignement
meter, not a 'scope. And that there are special tools for moving the heads
I found a sort-of user manual for this on bitsavers, but no schematics of the
meter, so no easy way to replicate it.


Yes, some drives were aligned with meters that were calibrated in +/- 
micro-inches (or um, later).
The general procedure was you commanded the drive to seek to a 
particular cylinder where the alignment pattern was recorded, and 
slipped safety pins into the positioner to prevent sudden movements.  
Then you loosened a couple socket head screws, there was a rod with an 
eccentric tip that was slipped into a slot in the head mount, and 
twisted, which crept the head in and out a tiny amount. When you liked 
the meter reading, you then tightened the screws and moved to the next 
head.


I watched this being done a number of times.

Jon

Re: Altos ACS 8000 8500 board Schematic

[william degnan]

Sorry, you're right, the chapter has only a board layout.

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 2:03 PM, Chris Osborn  wrote:

>
> > On Jun 18, 2015, at 10:31 AM, william degnan 
> wrote:
> >
> > Altos ACS 8000 8500 board schematics/chapter from the 8000 hardware
> > supplement posted here:
> > http://vintagecomputer.net/altos/8000/
>
> There’s a diagram there but no schematics. If you want the schematics for
> the 8500 board they are here:
>
> http://chiclassiccomp.org/docs/content/computing/Altos/Manuals/
>
> --
> Follow me on twitter: @FozzTexx
> Check out my blog: http://insentricity.com
>
>

Re: OT: Steam Shovels [Was: Re: using new technology on old machines. Was: PDP-12 Restoration at the RICM]

[Alexander Schreiber]

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 08:25:46AM +0200, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 17, 2015 at 09:26:38PM +0200, Alexander Schreiber wrote:
> > 
> > That has been done before for production purposes. I kid you not.
> 
> I believe you. I found this on youtube, looks like the have some sort of 
> generator or boiler external to the shovel. Perhaps it's compressed air?
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KM2lmAjwVWs

It looks suspiciously like a compressed air hookup. The fact that there
is no visible steam "escaping" just reinforces that impression.

Kind regards,
  Alex.
-- 
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and
 looks like work."  -- Thomas A. Edison

Wanted to buy Atari Vidcom one or two. $$

[COURYHOUSE]

Wanted to buy Atari Vidcom  model one  or two. $$
see _www.smecc.org/atati-tty/atari_3.gif_ 
(http://www.smecc.org/atati-tty/atari_3.gif)  
also looking   for any ad material, posters or manuals   actual or  scanned
drop me a line offlist   thanks Ed Sharpe Archvist for  SMECC