Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question

[Jon Langeler]

Was there a special adapter required for the 820c on the trango antenna?

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Mar 6, 2020, at 12:19 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> 
> We put 11 GHz 820C w/XPIC on existing Trango 3 ft dishes replacing single pol 
> ApexPlus ODUs and everything went as expected.  I’d have to look up the 
> details but I think it worked because Trango used Remec circular even with 
> single pol except for 6 GHz.  We should have adjusted for best XPIC 
> cancellation but instead we just made sure the ODUs were plumb.  But I think 
> what we did was roughly the same as what you’re doing, so it should work.
>  
> We got a couple bad 820S radios last year, failed the RF loopback test, but 
> it sounds like you have pretty thoroughly verified it’s not bad radios.
>  
> Were the Dragonwaves single or dual pol?
>  
>  
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh
> Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 9:37 AM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question
>  
>  
> We have installed a lot of Cambium 820C radios without much trouble.  Yes, 
> the configuration takes some getting used to but we probably have 46 links 
> working and installed, so it’s not like it’s our first rodeo configuring 
> these things.
>  
> And then we tried something new - reusing a 4’  Andrew Dragonwave antenna in 
> a XPIC configuration.   We purchased the Cambium adapter plate that clips 
> onto the antenna radio mount and presents the 820C mount for the OMT.   Take 
> off the dual Horizon radio OMT, add the 820C and the RF signal is shit - in 
> the -80’s from the mid 40’s.   Reverse the process and put the Horizon’s back 
> on and the signal is fine.
>  
> So we thought we had a bad 820C.   It’s happened before.  So we take two 
> different sets of 820C’s and test them one at a time swapping them in for 
> known good installed radios on working links.   The 820C’s are fine.   
>  
> Okay… we forgot to test the OMT's when we did that.   So we try the OMT’s in 
> the shop - and they work fine.
>  
> At this point the only thing left is the antennas themselves and the adapter 
> plate.   The adapter plate is nothing more than a hole in a aluminum bushing 
> with a couple of small steps to match diameter between the OMT and the 
> antenna waveguide.   Pretty hard to screw up.
>  
> We have a pair of Dragonwave antenna’s in the shop that we can mount all of 
> this to and try here - and we can’t get a decent signal even 20’ apart.   I’m 
> at a loss at this point.   The only part that doesn’t appear to work is the 
> adapter plate - and there is nothing interesting about it.
>  
> How the heck can this not work:
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> I can’t buy that the alignment of the antenna would need to be adjusted.   
> That makes no sense in my head.   Am I wrong in that assumption?
>  
> Mark
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Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question

[Ken Hohhof]

Yes, I believe the P/N is N110082L126A (for 11 GHz).

 

In the case of a Radiowaves or Commscope/Andrew antenna it might be possible to 
get a conversion kit to replace the adapter plate and feedtube, but this was an 
actual Trango brand antenna.  Plus the adapter just goes between the ODU/OMT 
and the dish, similar to Mark’s photos.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jon Langeler
Sent: Saturday, March 7, 2020 7:38 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question

 

Was there a special adapter required for the 820c on the trango antenna?

Jon Langeler

Michwave Technologies, Inc.

 





On Mar 6, 2020, at 12:19 PM, Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:



We put 11 GHz 820C w/XPIC on existing Trango 3 ft dishes replacing single pol 
ApexPlus ODUs and everything went as expected.  I’d have to look up the details 
but I think it worked because Trango used Remec circular even with single pol 
except for 6 GHz.  We should have adjusted for best XPIC cancellation but 
instead we just made sure the ODUs were plumb.  But I think what we did was 
roughly the same as what you’re doing, so it should work.

 

We got a couple bad 820S radios last year, failed the RF loopback test, but it 
sounds like you have pretty thoroughly verified it’s not bad radios.

 

Were the Dragonwaves single or dual pol?

 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Mark Radabaugh
Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 9:37 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question

 

 

We have installed a lot of Cambium 820C radios without much trouble.  Yes, the 
configuration takes some getting used to but we probably have 46 links working 
and installed, so it’s not like it’s our first rodeo configuring these things.

 

And then we tried something new - reusing a 4’  Andrew Dragonwave antenna in a 
XPIC configuration.   We purchased the Cambium adapter plate that clips onto 
the antenna radio mount and presents the 820C mount for the OMT.   Take off the 
dual Horizon radio OMT, add the 820C and the RF signal is shit - in the -80’s 
from the mid 40’s.   Reverse the process and put the Horizon’s back on and the 
signal is fine.

 

So we thought we had a bad 820C.   It’s happened before.  So we take two 
different sets of 820C’s and test them one at a time swapping them in for known 
good installed radios on working links.   The 820C’s are fine.   

 

Okay… we forgot to test the OMT's when we did that.   So we try the OMT’s in 
the shop - and they work fine.

 

At this point the only thing left is the antennas themselves and the adapter 
plate.   The adapter plate is nothing more than a hole in a aluminum bushing 
with a couple of small steps to match diameter between the OMT and the antenna 
waveguide.   Pretty hard to screw up.

 

We have a pair of Dragonwave antenna’s in the shop that we can mount all of 
this to and try here - and we can’t get a decent signal even 20’ apart.   I’m 
at a loss at this point.   The only part that doesn’t appear to work is the 
adapter plate - and there is nothing interesting about it.

 

How the heck can this not work:

 



 



 

I can’t buy that the alignment of the antenna would need to be adjusted.   That 
makes no sense in my head.   Am I wrong in that assumption?

 

Mark

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[AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Nate Burke]

This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. They 
were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like handing 
out DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into them via 
Winbox or MACNeighbor.


One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing 
NAT, whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these 
locations have multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked up.  
Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot.  These were both 
routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I can 
attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has any one 
else noticed anything?


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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Bill Prince]

Our home router is on 6.46.2, and is doing NAT. It is an RB493 however. 
No lockups or anything unusual.



bp


On 3/7/2020 9:23 AM, Nate Burke wrote:
This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. 
They were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like 
handing out DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into 
them via Winbox or MACNeighbor.


One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing 
NAT, whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these 
locations have multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked 
up.  Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot. These were 
both routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I 
can attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has 
any one else noticed anything?




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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Colin Stanners]

I think that this is only about the RB4011 hardware.

There were reports in the MikroTik forum about some users experiencing
lockups on RB4011 - more than I have seen with other models. I had opened a
support ticket with MikroTik asking if there was some kind of hardware
lockup issue with the RB4011 (as we need to deploy one in a hard-to-access
location and the RB4011 is the only small-size, high-port-count router that
they have with good performance). MikroTik replied that they haven't seen a
notable lockup issue with that model.

I suspect that there's a very rare issue that they haven't found yet so for
my purposes I'm looking at using a RB450Gx4 and switch.



On Sat, Mar 7, 2020, 11:37 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Our home router is on 6.46.2, and is doing NAT. It is an RB493 however.
> No lockups or anything unusual.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 3/7/2020 9:23 AM, Nate Burke wrote:
> > This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle.
> > They were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like
> > handing out DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into
> > them via Winbox or MACNeighbor.
> >
> > One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing
> > NAT, whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these
> > locations have multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked
> > up.  Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot. These were
> > both routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I
> > can attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has
> > any one else noticed anything?
> >
>
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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Ken Hohhof]

I don't have very many RB4011's.  One RB4011iGS+ at a tower site in an
outdoor NEMA box running 6.43.16 and no problems.  One RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD
running 6.45.5 at a customer site with 84 days uptime.  That one used to
reboot occasionally with a log message about having to reboot due to some
kernel problem.  It seems to have stopped that since the FW upgrade but hard
to tell since it happened maybe once every 2 weeks.

I have some RB1100AHx4's which is a very similar architecture and I've seen
occasional unexplained reboots on 2 of them.  No lockups though.  The ones
that have rebooted are still on 6.40.8, a more recent one is on 6.43.16 and
AFAIK has not rebooted but it did stop once responding to Winbox and had to
be manually rebooted.  Everything else seemed to be running fine including
PPPoE server, RADIUS, and Mikrotik API.


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Saturday, March 7, 2020 11:24 AM
To: Animal Farm 
Subject: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. They
were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like handing out
DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into them via Winbox or
MACNeighbor.

One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing NAT,
whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these locations have
multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked up.  
Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot.  These were both
routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I can
attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has any one else
noticed anything?

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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Nate Burke]

It's just strange that these have been deployed for Months, but 2 locked 
up in the same week.  And 5 days apart, with different firmware, both in 
temperature controlled indoor racks.  I don't think it was triggered by 
some rogue WAN Packets.  If that was the case, I'd expect they both 
would have locked up at the same time. MRTG showed no change in RAM 
usage, or CPU prior to the lockup.


On 3/7/2020 12:04 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

I don't have very many RB4011's.  One RB4011iGS+ at a tower site in an
outdoor NEMA box running 6.43.16 and no problems.  One RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD
running 6.45.5 at a customer site with 84 days uptime.  That one used to
reboot occasionally with a log message about having to reboot due to some
kernel problem.  It seems to have stopped that since the FW upgrade but hard
to tell since it happened maybe once every 2 weeks.

I have some RB1100AHx4's which is a very similar architecture and I've seen
occasional unexplained reboots on 2 of them.  No lockups though.  The ones
that have rebooted are still on 6.40.8, a more recent one is on 6.43.16 and
AFAIK has not rebooted but it did stop once responding to Winbox and had to
be manually rebooted.  Everything else seemed to be running fine including
PPPoE server, RADIUS, and Mikrotik API.


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Saturday, March 7, 2020 11:24 AM
To: Animal Farm 
Subject: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. They
were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like handing out
DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into them via Winbox or
MACNeighbor.

One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing NAT,
whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these locations have
multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked up.
Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot.  These were both
routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I can
attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has any one else
noticed anything?

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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Bill Prince]

Unless they are on the same L2 segment, rogue packets or break-in 
attempts would happen at different times.



bp


On 3/7/2020 10:32 AM, Nate Burke wrote:
It's just strange that these have been deployed for Months, but 2 
locked up in the same week.  And 5 days apart, with different 
firmware, both in temperature controlled indoor racks.  I don't think 
it was triggered by some rogue WAN Packets.  If that was the case, I'd 
expect they both would have locked up at the same time. MRTG showed no 
change in RAM usage, or CPU prior to the lockup.


On 3/7/2020 12:04 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

I don't have very many RB4011's.  One RB4011iGS+ at a tower site in an
outdoor NEMA box running 6.43.16 and no problems.  One 
RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD

running 6.45.5 at a customer site with 84 days uptime.  That one used to
reboot occasionally with a log message about having to reboot due to 
some
kernel problem.  It seems to have stopped that since the FW upgrade 
but hard

to tell since it happened maybe once every 2 weeks.

I have some RB1100AHx4's which is a very similar architecture and 
I've seen
occasional unexplained reboots on 2 of them.  No lockups though.  The 
ones
that have rebooted are still on 6.40.8, a more recent one is on 
6.43.16 and
AFAIK has not rebooted but it did stop once responding to Winbox and 
had to
be manually rebooted.  Everything else seemed to be running fine 
including

PPPoE server, RADIUS, and Mikrotik API.


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Saturday, March 7, 2020 11:24 AM
To: Animal Farm 
Subject: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. They
were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like 
handing out
DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into them via 
Winbox or

MACNeighbor.

One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing 
NAT,
whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these 
locations have

multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked up.
Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot.  These were both
routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I can
attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has any 
one else

noticed anything?

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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Colin Stanners]

Are they on the same customer data "path"? I saw a note that an occasional
CCR freeze with recent firmware was possibly due to the h232 NAT translator.

On Sat, Mar 7, 2020, 12:33 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> It's just strange that these have been deployed for Months, but 2 locked
> up in the same week.  And 5 days apart, with different firmware, both in
> temperature controlled indoor racks.  I don't think it was triggered by
> some rogue WAN Packets.  If that was the case, I'd expect they both
> would have locked up at the same time. MRTG showed no change in RAM
> usage, or CPU prior to the lockup.
>
> On 3/7/2020 12:04 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
> > I don't have very many RB4011's.  One RB4011iGS+ at a tower site in an
> > outdoor NEMA box running 6.43.16 and no problems.  One
> RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD
> > running 6.45.5 at a customer site with 84 days uptime.  That one used to
> > reboot occasionally with a log message about having to reboot due to some
> > kernel problem.  It seems to have stopped that since the FW upgrade but
> hard
> > to tell since it happened maybe once every 2 weeks.
> >
> > I have some RB1100AHx4's which is a very similar architecture and I've
> seen
> > occasional unexplained reboots on 2 of them.  No lockups though.  The
> ones
> > that have rebooted are still on 6.40.8, a more recent one is on 6.43.16
> and
> > AFAIK has not rebooted but it did stop once responding to Winbox and had
> to
> > be manually rebooted.  Everything else seemed to be running fine
> including
> > PPPoE server, RADIUS, and Mikrotik API.
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> > Sent: Saturday, March 7, 2020 11:24 AM
> > To: Animal Farm 
> > Subject: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups
> >
> > This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. They
> > were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like handing
> out
> > DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into them via Winbox
> or
> > MACNeighbor.
> >
> > One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing NAT,
> > whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these locations
> have
> > multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked up.
> > Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot.  These were both
> > routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I can
> > attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has any one
> else
> > noticed anything?
> >
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> >
> >
> >
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups

[Steve Jones]

If you have a baicells enb plugged into one, they will sometimes cause a
broadcast storm, like a single port loop, if that makes sense, this causes
a kernel panic and reboot. Things are really weird until you do a clean
reboot. Mikrotik support can verify if this is the issue from the supout
file.

On Sat, Mar 7, 2020, 1:46 PM Colin Stanners  wrote:

> Are they on the same customer data "path"? I saw a note that an occasional
> CCR freeze with recent firmware was possibly due to the h232 NAT translator.
>
> On Sat, Mar 7, 2020, 12:33 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
>> It's just strange that these have been deployed for Months, but 2 locked
>> up in the same week.  And 5 days apart, with different firmware, both in
>> temperature controlled indoor racks.  I don't think it was triggered by
>> some rogue WAN Packets.  If that was the case, I'd expect they both
>> would have locked up at the same time. MRTG showed no change in RAM
>> usage, or CPU prior to the lockup.
>>
>> On 3/7/2020 12:04 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> > I don't have very many RB4011's.  One RB4011iGS+ at a tower site in an
>> > outdoor NEMA box running 6.43.16 and no problems.  One
>> RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD
>> > running 6.45.5 at a customer site with 84 days uptime.  That one used to
>> > reboot occasionally with a log message about having to reboot due to
>> some
>> > kernel problem.  It seems to have stopped that since the FW upgrade but
>> hard
>> > to tell since it happened maybe once every 2 weeks.
>> >
>> > I have some RB1100AHx4's which is a very similar architecture and I've
>> seen
>> > occasional unexplained reboots on 2 of them.  No lockups though.  The
>> ones
>> > that have rebooted are still on 6.40.8, a more recent one is on 6.43.16
>> and
>> > AFAIK has not rebooted but it did stop once responding to Winbox and
>> had to
>> > be manually rebooted.  Everything else seemed to be running fine
>> including
>> > PPPoE server, RADIUS, and Mikrotik API.
>> >
>> >
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
>> > Sent: Saturday, March 7, 2020 11:24 AM
>> > To: Animal Farm 
>> > Subject: [AFMUG] RB4011 Lockups
>> >
>> > This week I've had 2 RB4011 Routers lockup requiring a power cycle. They
>> > were still passing some traffic, but stopped doing things like handing
>> out
>> > DHCP, or responding to SNMP.  And you couldn't log into them via Winbox
>> or
>> > MACNeighbor.
>> >
>> > One was on ROS6.44.3, the other on ROS6.45.  Both of them were doing
>> NAT,
>> > whereas most of my Mikrotiks are only routing.  Both of these locations
>> have
>> > multiple RB4011s, and only the one doing NAT locked up.
>> > Nothing is recorded in the log other than the reboot.  These were both
>> > routers that have been installed for months.  One router lockup I can
>> > attribute to a fluke, but 2 in the same week is worrysome.  Has any one
>> else
>> > noticed anything?
>> >
>> > --
>> > AF mailing list
>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
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