Re: [9fans] Help for home user discovering Plan 9
On Apr 14, 7:15�pm, szhil...@gmail.com (Sergey Zhilkin) wrote: > > My wireless card is not listed in Plan9.ini. Does that mean there's no > > way for me to connect with that card? > > > Hi ! > > What type of wireless card you have > > -- > ? ?? ??? > ?? ?? > With best regards > Zhilkin Sergey Sorry, I forgot to say! It's Atheros AR5001X+.
[9fans] Help for a home user discovering Plan 9
I only use computers at home, mostly for developing friendships on the Internet, and helping family members with their use of the Internet, multimedia and home office applications. I also use the home office and multimedia applications a little bit myself. We all use Windows, but I've been trying for years to switch to a free software system. A few days ago I learned about Plan 9 from someone in a Linux Questions forum, and now I'm learning how to use it. It's installed on on my Toshiba Satellite A45-S150 laptop, along with XP, Wubi Ubuntu, Debian and Slackware. I've learned to use Acme and edit files on a fat partition, created a new user with administrative privileges, and changed the display font. My only connection to the Internet is through a wireless connection to my family's router network, and I haven't learned yet how to connect from plan 9 with my Atheros wlan card. I'm using Slackware to post this now. I'd also like to learn how to change my display resolution, or how to change the font in Acme. If I ever get connected to the network I'll need to learn how to access files on a Vista laptop. I'll also need to either find a browser, some home office applications and a photo manager for Plan 9, or learn how to run those applications on the Vista laptop over the network from my Plan 9 laptop. Later, I'd like to experiment with distributing the system between my laptop and my wife's laptop. I found a link to a newbie guide on this list, which I'm planning to study, and I'm planning to study the man pages for all the commands that I find in /bin. It would be nice if someone could point me to some step-by-step instructions for Plan 9 dummies, for a wireless connection to a DHCP router network, changing the display resolution or the Acme font, browsing the Web, and accessing files and running applications on a Vista laptop. I'd also welcome any other ideas about learning to use Plan 9.
[9fans] Help for home user discovering Plan 9
We have three Windows laptops in our family. I've been using free software systems off and on for years. Last week I learned about Plan 9 from Bell Labs, from someone in a Linux Questions forum. Now I have it installed on a partition on my laptop, along with XP, Ubuntu-on-NTFS, Debian, and Slackware. I've learned to access a fat partition, change the font size, and use Acme. Now I need to learn how to set up a wireless connection to the family router network, access my files on my wife's Vista laptop, and browse the Internet. My wireless card is not listed in Plan9.ini. Does that mean there's no way for me to connect with that card? I'd like to learn how much I can use Plan 9 for home office, multimedia and Internet socializing, then I'd like to experiment with distributing the system between computers. I've learned about as much as I can for now from the documentation on the Plan 9 site, except for how to connect to the network. I'm waiting to find out if it's even possible. Now I'm listing /bin, reading man pages, and practicing commands. After that I might have some questions. Meanwhile, does anyone have any suggestions about learning to use Plan 9 for home office, multimedia and Internet socializing, and then to learn more about networking and distributed systems?
Re: [9fans] Help for home user discovering Plan 9
Thanks to everyone for all the information and ideas! At first I was going to try to make Plan 9 my all-purpose system on this laptop, but for now it looks like I'll just be using it to learn more about networking and distributed systems. I've tried using virtual machines in Windows before to run other operating systems, and I've always ended up installing them independently in their own partitions, but I may have to use Plan 9 on a virtual machine if that's the only way I can connect to our family network. First I just want to get comfortable and develop some skills in the Plan 9 environment, then experiment with distributing it between computers or virtual machines. Zhilkin, my wireless card is Atheros AR5001X+. Is there anything like a diswrapper in Plan 9? Pietro, thanks for the beginner's guide. I'm not sure I'll be able to connect to the Internet with Plan 9 on its own partition, the way I'm using it now. I might have to run it on a virtual machine, and it might take some time for me to decide which one to use, and learn how to do it. Meanwhile I'll have to learn to download and install applications manually. I'll download them to my shared fat partition in some other system, and install them into my Plan 9 system from there. My Internet socializing now is mostly: - email - calling people with Skype - reading and commenting in blogs - posting in my own blogs - reading and posting in the Linux Questions forums - reading and posting on this list - Facebook Devon, thanks for the links. I had started to read the network configuration doc earlier, but I got stuck at the part where my card is not supported. If I can't get around that, I might try using Plan 9 on a virtual machine in XP or Slackware or Debian. Pros and cons would be welcome. Andrés, thanks for the suggestion. I've tried to run systems on virtual machines before, but I didn't like all the complications involved and I always ended up installing them independently on their own partitions. Maybe I won't be able to avoid virtual machines this time. I might consider it an opportunity to enrich my knowledge and experience, along with learning to use Plan 9.
Re: [9fans] Help for home user discovering Plan 9
On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 3:43 AM, Sergey Zhilkin wrote: > Look at - http://9fans.net/archive/2008/10/304 > > Plan9 hardware support is limited to those that plan9 users have. Well, now there's a Plan 9 user with Atheros 5K. I suppose I could try to port ath5k myself. I had some experience many years ago programming and debugging in machine language, assembly language, Fortran, COBOL, dBase and VisualBasic. I've never even looked at a C source, or even compiled any. In all the time I've been using free software systems, I've only used gui installers and updaters. Does anyone have any guesses about how many hours it might take for me to learn to port ath5k to Plan 9? I might need to study and experiment with some ath5k Linux and BSD sources, and study some Plan 9 sources for wireless cards. If I got something working, I might write to the authors of the sources to get their ideas about the license issue.
Re: [9fans] Help for home user discovering Plan 9
On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 4:26 PM, Eris Discordia wrote: > Plan 9 is not intended for home or home office. Yes, I understood that from the responses to my questions. As soon as I read them, I gave up the idea of trying to switch to Plan 9. Now it's more about enriching my knowledge and experience. It might be good experience for me to see how far I can stretch Plan 9 for home computing. > learning about > computers is for me only a pleasant aside to actual use of computers It's more the other way around with me. Using them is only a pleasant aside to learning about them! Now I need to decide whether to install qemu or kvm, and whether to install it in Ubuntu or in Debian, and then reorganize my partitions accordingly.
Re: [9fans] Help for home user discovering Plan 9
Thanks to everyone again for all the information and ideas. I decided to try running Plan 9 with Qemu in Ubuntu. I can't use kvm because my processor doesn't support it. I resized my partitions to make room to install Ubuntu in its own partition. Before that it was running from a CD image on my XP partition. I've decided to also try 9vx. It looks like it might be a lot simpler, and it might be good enough for this stage of my learning. After I get one of those working enough to practice the commands, and try out some of the ideas that have been posted, I might have some more questions.
[9fans] Adventures of a home user
I haven't responded yet to all the info and ideas in my earlier thread, because I've been trying to get Plan 9 working in QEMU. First, I tried using 9vx. I found these instructions at http://swtch.com/9vx/ : 9vx-0.12.tar.bz2 is a binary distribution > containing a minimal plan 9 tree and binaries for > freebsd, linux, and os x. > > download, unpack, and then > > cd 9vx-0.12 > ./9vx.Linux -u glenda > > (or 9vx.FreeBSD or 9vx.OSX) > To my surprise, it really was as simple as that! At least, I get the same windows that I got when I had Plan 9 installed in its own partition. I haven't tried to actually do anything with it yet. I did learn that I have to press buttons 1 and 3 together, instead of shift-3, to simulate button 2. Before exploring Plan 9 in 9vx, I wanted to see if I could get it working in QEMU in my Ubuntu Intrepid Ibex system. That was another story. *Challenge 1*: Framebuffer r...@satellite:~# qemu -hda Plan9.qcow.img -cdrom plan9.iso -boot d > > ===| DirectFB 1.0.1 |=== > (c) 2001-2007 The DirectFB Organization (directfb.org) > (c) 2000-2004 Convergence (integrated media) GmbH > > > (*) DirectFB/Core: Single Application Core. (2008-09-12 19:59) > (!) Direct/Util: opening '/dev/fb0' and '/dev/fb/0' failed > --> No such file or directory > (!) DirectFB/FBDev: Error opening framebuffer device! > (!) DirectFB/FBDev: Use 'fbdev' option or set FRAMEBUFFER environment > variable. > (!) DirectFB/Core: Could not initialize 'system' core! > --> Initialization error! > Could not initialize SDL - exiting > Winning response: VGA kernel option in the Ubuntu boot menu *Challenge 2*: Scrambled keyboard Winning response: qemu -hda Plan9.qcow.img -cdrom plan9.iso -boot d -k en-us > *Challenge 3*: Plan 9 hanging up Winning response: I wait a few seconds before responding to each prompt when Plan 9 is starting up. *Challenge 4*: Display size My Ubuntu display is 1024x768. The default size of the Plan 9 display is much smaller, so it wasn't using all the available space on the Ubuntu display. Winning response: I re-installed Plan 9, changing the dimensions at the prompt. I haven't learned yet how to change them from within Plan 9. *Challenge 5*: How to exit from QEMU I haven't found anything in the man pages that works for me. I can go back to the console and do ctrl-c, but I don't like doing that. Current response: qemu -hda Plan9.qcow.img -cdrom plan9.iso -boot d -k en-us -no-reboot > Now, when I do "fshalt -r" in Plan 9, it exits from QEMU. *Challenge 6*: How to use kqemu. I see this message when I run qemu: Could not open '/dev/kqemu' - QEMU acceleration layer not activated: No such > file or directory > I've done some research, but I'm still confused about whether kqemu is included in Intrepid Ibex, and if so how to activate it. When I installed Plan 9, it took more than an hour to format 2GB.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
john, eric, and yy, thanks! 9vx isn't working out very well for me so far. I'm trying to practice everything in the documentation on the Plan 9 site, then I'll work on the ideas that have been posted for me here. I was going to practice first in 9vx, because it's easier to switch back and forth between that and my other windows, than between qemu and my other windows. Adding a new user: term% uname jim jim > uname: '/bin/uname' file does not exist > That doesn't encourage me to try to use 9vx for what I'm doing right now. I'll see if I can do any better in QEMU.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
Eric and Anthony, thank you. I'm stepping through the Plan 9 documentation at http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/documentation/index.html. As you noticed, Anthony, I missed a step in adding a new user: con -l /srv/fscons > That didn't work in 9vx either, I imagine for the reasons you explained. I'm still way over my head here. For now I'll use QEMU to step through the Plan 9 documentation, and later I might use 9vx for other learning purposes. Now that I've learned to change the display dimensions, and use ctrl-alt, it's easy to switch between QEMU and my other windows. I've already created a new user. I won't push my luck tonight. I'll wait until tomorrow to try network configuration.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
I'm working through the Plan 9 documentation at http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/documentation/index.html. I'm running Plan 9 in QEMU in Ubuntu Intrepid Ibex. qemu plan9jim.img -k en-us -no-reboot > I have to wait a few seconds before responding to each prompt, to avoid having it freeze and losing the keyboard and mouse. *Network Configuration* term% ip/ipconfig > "ether8390 dummyrr timeout; assuming nodummyrr" - whatever that means. term% ndb/dns -r > term% ip/ping 192.168.0.1 > sending 32 64 byte messages 1000 ms apart to icmp!192.168.0.1! > lost 0 > lost 1 > . . . > lost 31 > 32 out of 32 messages lost > Too bad. Some of the instructions in the documentation, and some of the ideas in the responses to my posts, depend on being connected to the network and the Internet.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
Thanks again to everyone for all the help! I did this (thanks Andrey): ndb/cs > ip/ipconfig > ndb/dns -r > Then I took a look at /net/ipselftab and /net/iproute. Then I pinged the gateway (thanks André) and got a response! Then I did (thanks Federico) hget http://google.com > and got some hieroglyphs. Then I did http://www.gamefaqs.com/portable/ds/file/924897/46369 > which is a fairly clean text file, to get something readable. It worked!
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
I've done as much as I can and want to do from the documentation for now. Now I'm working on some of the responses to my posts here. Pietro, I did 9fs sources > and installed fgb. I'm planning to look at that troff tutorial, the manpage for juke, and the files in /sys/doc. Here's what happened when I installed abaco and tried to use it: term% contrib/install fgb/abaco > a 386/bin/abaco 775 sys sys 1195651173 > a lib/font/bit lucidasans/passwd.6.font 664 sys sys 1138688455 > a sys/src/cmd/abaco 2000775 sys sys 1175566971 > ... > a sys/src/cmd/abaco/abaco.fonts 664 sys sys 1201369022 > term% man abaco > *man: no manual page* > term% abaco > *abaco: can't initialize webfs: '/mnt/web/ctl' does not exist* >
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
I'm also planning to look into Inferno and the /9/grid. Now, in Plan 9/QEMU/Ubuntu, I need to learn how to access my shared fat partition, and how to copy and paste between the QEMU window and my other Ubuntu windows.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Jim Habegger wrote: > I'm also planning to look into Inferno and the /9/grid. > > Now, in Plan 9/QEMU/Ubuntu, I need to learn how to access my shared fat > partition, and how to copy and paste between the QEMU window and my other > Ubuntu windows. > - and how to change to a different user without rebooting.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
Now I have a list of commands to type every time I boot. I need to learn how to run them automatically.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 2:31 PM, Anthony Sorace wrote: > fgb's a person, not a thing you install. > fgb is also the name of the directory containing his system, which is what I meant. I see now that what I installed was actually fgb/contrib.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
On Mon, Apr 20, 2009 at 6:42 PM, Balwinder S Dheeman wrote: > I don't who and why one referred you to try 9vx > Maybe because it's faster, and easy to install. It only took a few minutes to download it, unpack it, and start using it. It's an easy way to get acquainted with the Plan 9 environment, and to practice using it. Running Plan 9 in QEMU is awkward and slow, and my processor doesn't support an accelerator. I can see very well how 9vx might be useful for me, at some point.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
I tried webfs and got an error message, so I ran webcookies, and then I was able to run webfs without an error message. Then I was able to run abaco. Now I need to learn how to use it. I thought maybe I could just type in a URL and 2-click "Get," but nothing happened. I'll need to learn how to access host and network resources in QEMU before I'll be able to mount my fat partition. I decided not to add the network and web commands to my profile, because I'm not sure I'll be wanting to use them every time, while I'm learning to use QEMU and Plan 9. I put the network commands in a file. Now I need to learn how to write an executable script. For now I cat the file, then I select it and send it. For the Web, I'll just type webfs when I need it.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
I've been posting too much for this kind of list. Sorry.
[9fans] (offlist) Re: Adventures of a home user
It was nice to see this message. Thank you! On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 6:23 AM, wrote: > > I've been posting too much for this kind of list. Sorry. > > Not at all. As long as the questions are genuine and > you're learning from it, your questions are welcome > as far as I'm concerned. The real flamage comes when > a) someone tries to "teach their grandmother to suck > eggs" or b) a person seems to be ignorning what's > already been said. > > BLS > > >
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 8:29 AM, wrote: > Yeah, don't let my message from earlier scare you off... I was just > cranky at the prospect of a long day of classes ;) The point of a > mailing list isn't to see how few messages we can get in a month, > although of course it's not a blog either. Thank you. I think I overdid it. I was posting too often. Most of my posting has been in forums, and when I post in lists I forget that I might be flooding some people's mailboxes.
Re: [9fans] Adventures of a home user
My Plan 9 training is temporarily suspended while I learn to use QEMU. That's funny because I suspended my Slackware training to learn to use Plan 9. Now I might suspend my QEMU training to try out some other virtualizers. Also, I got a FreeDOS image to use for my QEMU training, so I may wander off into FreeDOS for a while.
[9fans] NEC building Raspberry Pi 3s into its displays
Interesting, I wonder if this could let someone use one as a plan 9 terminal: http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/nec-raspberry-pi-3/
Re: [9fans] Software preservation in the post-hg era
I don't know if he's on here, but Al Kossow (aek at bitsavers dot org), the Software Curator at the Computer History Museum in Mountain View, CA (SillyCon Valley, just down the road from the Googleplex) might be interested in this, if he isn't already aware of what's going on. He's an expert on The Good Fight Against Bit-Rot and has tools for preserving pretty much everything in Original Flavor media formats, as well as on-line. In addition to the software library collection, the museum also has a separate library dedicated to preservation of the all-important documentation which, if lost, often results in the loss of much of the ability to comprehend the functionality of, let alone maintain, executables and associated data. On Mon, Mar 30, 2020 at 7:12 PM Sean Hinchee wrote: > In the wake of Bitbucket removing hg (Mercurial) support [1], I feel > it's topical to bring up software preservation for the plan9 > community. > > A lot of community contributed software has been put up on Bitbucket > or other hg hosts over time (RIP Google Code), but no consolidated > effort, to my knowledge, seems to have been made to index, let alone > mirror, this software. > > For now, as a stop-gap, I've made a GitHub organization in which I've > consolidated most of what I had indexed from Bitbucket and a few other > places. > > Thanks to people like Ori Bernstein, we have a native git client for > plan9 [3]; without a native client, this kind of transition wouldn't > be nearly as simple, thank you. > > I'm more than happy to add anyone interested in the curation of this > archive to the GitHub organization. It would be nice to have spare > hands around to add README's, mkfiles, and attributions where they > have been missed or never existed. > > In the long term, it would be nice to have a federated or otherwise > decentralized solution to pooling community contributed software, > especially keeping in mind ease of mirroring and picking up old > projects as contributors come and go. > > The contrib/ directory on sources and 9front are fine and good, but > they are centralized. I don't have a proposed solution to this > problem, but it would be nice to have ideas or insight posted ☺. > > I recognize that GitHub is also centralized and doesn't solve the > centralization problem, but at least git is really straightforward to > mirror with multiple remotes, etc. and having an index/archive is > valuable at least to me. > > If anyone has further thoughts, anything they want added, or any lists > or indices of works they want archived/mirrored, I would love to see > these posted. > > If anyone wants to mirror the archive, that would be wonderful. I was > considering mirroring everything to a remote in sr.ht in the future, > but haven't gotten around to it. > > As a footnote, there's a decent git client written in Go that works > alright on plan9 [4], but it's slow and memory intensive at the > moment. > > Cheers, > Sean > > [1] https://twitter.com/traverser/status/1244398479591563265 > [2] https://github.com/Plan9-Archive > [3] https://github.com/oridb/git9 > [4] https://github.com/driusan/dgit -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T303744e1ec6d2108-Ma9aa770fc935c1c4c175566a Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] Transfer of Plan 9 to the Plan 9 Foundation
“Planston, Planquility Base: That’s one small step for a Plan, one giant leap for Plankind!” “Planquility Base, Planston: Congratulations! You’ve got a bunch of Plansters about to turn blue down here!” Jim KJ7JHE On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 6:08 AM wrote: > We are thrilled to announce that Nokia has transferred the copyright of > Plan 9 to the Plan 9 Foundation. > ... > -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf20bce89ef96d4b6-M4b468ef9a073f3aba373fecb Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] cpu temp in drawterm
thank you moody! 'bind -a '#P' /dev' did the trick! i appreciate the feedback. thanks to all for your time. On Tue, Feb 14, 2023 at 4:13 PM wrote: > > Resending this through the web interface because my email was dropped. > > Temperature stats are read from /dev/cputemp. How that file is served depends > on your system. > On my machine the file is just in arch(3), other machines use acpi(8) to > serve this. > You just need to ensure this file is in the namespace stats(1) is run within. > > > For getting the temperature of the machine you are connecting to, either: > % bind -a '#P' /dev # if your machine is like mine > % aux/acpi # if your machine uses acpi > > You will likely have more success in just cracking open the code and reading > it then you will with google. > > moody > > > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options Permalink -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tc8476d0fe749cf6c-Mc4d14e19a0d57e11c6b4888c Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] temp of remote machine with stats
ok no problem and thanks again! On Thu, Mar 23, 2023 at 1:11 AM Jacob Moody wrote: > > On 3/22/23 22:15, jimeric...@gmail.com wrote: > > i spoke to soon. it works perfectly on my amd64 machines but not on my > > raspberry pi 4. what could i be doing wrong? or is the pi missing something? > > A quick grep seems to indicate that devarch was never implemented for the > bcm64 kernel. > -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Td46dc64ab1f12bcf-M8f652fafe513814320f7a12a Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
