On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 3:02:17 PM UTC, John Cremona wrote: > > On 11 October 2016 at 15:34, William Stein <wst...@gmail.com <javascript:>> > wrote: > > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 7:24 AM, Dima Pasechnik <dim...@gmail.com > <javascript:>> wrote: > >> > >> > >> On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 8:14:02 AM UTC, John Cremona wrote: > >>> > >>> On 11 October 2016 at 01:03, Victor Shoup <sh...@cs.nyu.edu> wrote: > >>> > First, you are definitely wrong about punch cards. I started > programming > >>> > with Fortran on punch cards in the 70s. > >>> > >>> Punch cards? They were a great advance on paper tape which is what > >>> *I* started on. To correct a typo in your program you had to read > >>> the whole tape in, make the correction, and punch out a whole new > >>> tape! Cards were so much easier as you could just replace one card. > >> > >> > >> sure, I had this at some point (1981?) too; the OS was booted from a > big > >> roll of plastic tape, and files and stuff > >> were on paper tape... I don't recall whether it was Basic or Fortran > one had > >> to program it with... > > > > You guys were so lucky to have an actual computer! > > I only had access to it on Sunday afternoons, in winter. Most of the > year it was lifted (by crane) onto a ship because it belonged to > Cambridge U's department of geodesy and geophysics, and they used it > to map the ocean floor. And the rest of the week when it was in > Cambridge the academics had it. > > > > > I spent my first year or two programming in the 70s by using a book > > I found in the garbage combined with a computer-looking > > thing I built out of cardboard, and simulating everything > > on paper or in my head. > > in 1979, final year of high school, we programmed Turing machines, on paper. I probably was way more clever that time, as I had hard time recalling how this work when I had to mention this to a student few years ago :-)
> The rest of the week / year we worked on paper too! (But I didn't > bother making a fake computer out of cardboard). > > > > > Uphill both ways, in the snow. > > > >> > >>> > >>> That was 1970 I think.... > >>> > >>> > > >>> > Second, a complete transition to auto tools still feels like > overkill at > >>> > this point. > >>> > But I agree that it could come one day. > >>> > >>> With a lot of help (from people on this thread and for the same > >>> reasons) I went through that agony with eclib. I don't regret it but > >>> I would not want to do it again! > >> > >> > >> I've done this for a couple of Sage packages (admittedly, smaller and > >> simpler than NTL)... > >> > >>> > >>> > >>> John > >>> > >>> > In any case, I am almost done with all the requested changes. > >>> > I will follow up with a couple of quick questions, though. > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 5:09:48 PM UTC-4, Dima Pasechnik > wrote: > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 9:09:38 PM UTC+1, François wrote: > >>> >>> > >>> >>> On 11/10/16 01:58, Victor Shoup wrote: > >>> >>> > Another issue. I'm not sure if $(MAKE) is specific to gnu make > or if > >>> >>> > it > >>> >>> > is universal. > >>> >>> > In general, I don't want to assume gnu. But I can certainly make > >>> >>> > this > >>> >>> > the default, > >>> >>> > and provide a config variable to override. > >>> >>> > >>> >>> I'll have another go at this when you use > >>> >>> $(MAKE) inside a makefile you are making sure > >>> >>> that the make command used is the same one that > >>> >>> you called on the initial makefile. > >>> >>> > >>> >>> As other people mentioned it enable parallel make > >>> >>> to proceed nicely, and in the case where there is > >>> >>> several make command installed on the system > >>> >>> you avoid funny things happening. I have AIX > >>> >>> system which comes with its own posix make > >>> >>> command. Something like ntl probably require > >>> >>> gmake (GNU make), calling AIX make in the > >>> >>> middle is not a good idea. > >>> >>> > >>> >> > >>> >> Perhaps the most natural solution would be to change NTL build > system > >>> >> so > >>> >> that > >>> >> it uses the standard autotools chain (autoconf/automake etc), not > only > >>> >> libtool. > >>> >> Given that it uses very few external libraries, it ought to be an > easy > >>> >> task. > >>> >> > >>> >> Given that I am perhaps the only person in this thread who learned > to > >>> >> program using punch cards, > >>> >> I am a dinosaur from an earlier period, yet, I look into the future > :-) > >>> >> > >>> >> Dima > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >>> Francois > >>> > > >>> > -- > >>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >>> > Groups > >>> > "sage-devel" group. > >>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > send > >>> > an > >>> > email to sage-devel+...@googlegroups.com. > >>> > To post to this group, send email to sage-...@googlegroups.com. > >>> > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel. > >>> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > >> "sage-devel" group. > >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an > >> email to sage-devel+...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > >> To post to this group, send email to sage-...@googlegroups.com > <javascript:>. > >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel. > >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > > > > > > -- > > William (http://wstein.org) > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "sage-devel" group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an email to sage-devel+...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > > To post to this group, send email to sage-...@googlegroups.com > <javascript:>. > > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel. > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "sage-devel" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to sage-devel+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/sage-devel. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
