Carl, In our shared region plumbing code requires vents be 12" above roof line. Electrical inspectors probably won't catch this, plumbing inspectors probably won't get on a roof, but still there is a code concern. You might exercise some caution.
Matt Matthew Partymiller Solar Energy Solutions LLC (877) 312-7456 m...@solar-energy-solutions.com On Wed, September 24, 2014 6:49 pm, Carl Adams wrote: > Bruce, > We routinely cut off DWV as suggested by earlier posts so that they are at > least 1 inch below the surface of the back of the module. > > To be clear these are sewage intake air vents and not exhaust vents for > heating appliances. > > We do place a quarter inch wire cloth over the cut off vent and apply a > four inch stainless steel hose clamp around the pipe just to prevent > foreign objects from entering the vent pipe. > > I have never had an inspector question this method. > > > With Regards > Carl Adams, President > SunRock Solar > 513.290.9072 (cell) > 513.766.6025 (office) > > > On Sep 24, 2014, at 1:37 PM, Ray Walters <r...@solarray.com> wrote: > > > I agree with Kurt: you need a licensed plumber in your area to > advise you, if you're trying to keep the AHJs happy . 2nd, I'm very sure > you don't want an exhaust/ combustion type vent under the array. I've > had several over the years, and seen some arrays installed over them. > They can get fairly hot and put quite a bit of steam out. I would not > trust the module backing material to a concentrated long term dose; which > module is going to have a problem first? R.Ray Walters > CTO, Solarray, Inc > Nabcep Certified PV Installer, > Licensed Master Electrician > Solar Design Engineer > 303 505-8760 > On 9/24/2014 11:16 AM, Kurt Johnsen wrote: > >> Should you decide to lower your plumbing vents I have found an inside >> pipe cutter to be an inexpensive and handy tool. Cut the vent and lead >> off an inch above your desired pipe height and use the inside cutter to >> cut the pvc pipe. Go slow and be careful to keep air space between the >> pvc and lead as the lead will cut very easily. >> >> >> >> Also I wouldn't rely on us well intentioned wrenches to make the call >> on the plumbing code in your jurisdiction. Though the state plumbing >> codes are usually based on the international code, there will be >> differences. If you can't pull up your state plumbing code online then >> ask your plumbing inspector. In Florida the minimum height above a roof >> surface is 6" (904.1). As for relocating 905.2 states that âall vent >> and branch vent pipes shall be so graded and connected as to drain back >> to the drainage pipe by gravityâ. Table 710.1(1) shows that for >> 1.5â pipe a slope of ¼â per foot is sufficient to handle 3 >> fixtures. I would take that to indicate ¼â / foot is plenty for a >> 1.5â vent. >> >> >> >>> On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 11:20 AM, Dave Click <davecl...@fsec.ucf.edu> >>> wrote: >>> Flipping through the '04 plumbing code I see a few slopes called out >>> (1/4" per 1' for fixture vents, 1" per 1' for circuit vents, 1/2" per >>> 1' for combination drain/vent...). Fixture vents have a maximum >>> distance of a few feet from fixture trap to vent, but I don't think >>> this prevents you from then running that vent horizontally. 916.2 >>> states that for vents other than stack vents or vent stacks if your >>> vent is >40' you need to upsize the whole vent pipe (tough to do for >>> an existing building, of course). Stack vents have a "maximum >>> developed length" of 100' for a 1.5" vent which should be enough >>> space to get away from under the PV. I don't see any slope >>> requirements specifically for stack vents but my non-plumber's eye >>> may be missing something. >>> >>> The stack vent sizing Table 916.1 appears (in part) here too and it >>> looks like the tables match up to a 2.5": >>> http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/drainage-vents-d_1110.html >>> >>> >>> DKC >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 2014/9/24 10:19, Jason Szumlanski wrote: >>> >>>> I am unable to find anything in the Florida code that precludes >>>> covering a plumbing vent. The code does require the vent to be 6" >>>> above the roof surface I believe. >>>> >>>> I was unable to determine if these vents need to be vertical with >>>> no bends in the attic. Obviously you wouldn't want to create a trap >>>> in the attic, but a couple of 45's to relocate a plumbing vent to >>>> accommodate more PV seems like a desirable thing to do sometimes. >>>> Does anyone know if these can be relocated, i.e. to an adjacent >>>> roof surface? >>>> >>>> On my own home I had a vent to deal with. I broke out my saws-all, >>>> split the lead like a banana and peeled it back, cut the pipe at an >>>> angle, and folded the lead back into the pipe after applying >>>> sealant between the lead and pipe. There is a 1" gap between the >>>> rim of the pipe and the back of the module. My theory on this >>>> working safely is that, a) there will be far less rainwater falling >>>> in and around this pipe with a module over it, and b) it is about >>>> 24" from the roof ridge and there is a module over it so there will >>>> be very little water sheeting down from >>>> above the vent. Code notwithstanding, I felt this was a solid >>>> method on my own home, and I have inspected it after 6 months of >>>> Florida downpours and found no issues. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Jason Szumlanski >>>> Fafco Solar >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Sep 24, 2014 at 6:38 AM, Bill Loesch >>>> <solar1onl...@charter.net> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Bruce, August, et al, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> This is but one more example of confusing terminology. A plumbing >>>>> vent is not an exhaust vent! >>>>> >>>>> A plumbing vent (what August calls a cold vent) is provided to >>>>> allow the sanitary drain traps (and perhaps more) to operate >>>>> properly. Without the properly functioning traps you would have >>>>> sewer gas smell and sewer gas from the plumbing fixtures. This >>>>> was commonplace when indoor plumbing was introduced to early >>>>> adopters. >>>>> >>>>> An exhaust vent is another animal entirely. An exhaust vent >>>>> carries the combustion products to a suitable exterior location >>>>> for dilution with ambient air. With the advent of power vented >>>>> combustion appliances, a direct vent (one that takes in >>>>> combustion air from the outside and naturally exhausts combustion >>>>> products to the outside) is IMHO the only responsible way to >>>>> install any power vented appliance in a freezing climate. (Power >>>>> vented appliances come in both condensing and non-condensing >>>>> flavors-they can penetrate the side wall or the roof). >>>>> Originally, two separate pipes (with two independent properly >>>>> separated penetrations) was used. That technique is still often >>>>> used today. More recently concentric vents have been introduced >>>>> both for condensing and non-condensing applications. A concentric >>>>> vent can simplify some installations by putting the exhaust pipe >>>>> inside a larger air intake pipe allowing for one, albeit larger, >>>>> penetration. As you might imagine if the exhaust flow is >>>>> hindered/diverted/redirected by an inappropriately located solar >>>>> module combustion gasses will be re-ingested into the intake air. >>>>> Not good for equipment performance. My understanding is the power >>>>> vented appliance manufacturer dictates what kind of >>>>> separation/clearances are needed with their product. My guess is >>>>> you find they want at least a foot of separation between the top >>>>> of the " inverted cone" and the module. Probably not what you had >>>>> in mind for an aesthetically pleasing installation. >>>>> >>>>> I hope this helps, >>>>> Bill Loesch >>>>> Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar >>>>> 314 631 1094 >>>>> On 23-Sep-14 6:54 PM, August >>>>> Goers wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Bruce and All, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Sorry, I hit send before I had a chance to complete my >>>>>> thoughts. What I meant to say was that I've found AHJs often >>>>>> allow us to cover cold plumbing vents but I've never tried or >>>>>> had any luck with covering hot vents including condensing boiler >>>>>> PVC vents. Once again, if in doubt you >>>>>> could see what the plan checker or inspector thinks. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> August >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: August Goers [mailto:aug...@luminalt.com] >>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2014 4:15 PM >>>>>> To: 'RE-wrenches' >>>>>> Subject: RE: [RE-wrenches] Modules over vents >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Bruce, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I'll send you the CA plumbing code vent section offlist >>>>>> (attachment too >>>>>> large for this list). The way I read the code is that you >>>>>> technically can't cover any type of plumbing or hot vent. >>>>>> However, and I've run into >>>>>> little resistance from AHJs in the Bay Area by covering these. >>>>>> You might >>>>>> want to check in with your plan checker. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> August >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Luminalt >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: RE-wrenches >>>>>> [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On >>>>>> Behalf Of Bruce Leininger >>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2014 3:49 PM >>>>>> To: RE-wrenches >>>>>> Subject: [RE-wrenches] Modules over vents >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi all. We're designing a system on a roof that is literally >>>>>> infested with plumbing, exhaust and combustion vents. The >>>>>> combustion vents are PVC and none of the vents are more than >>>>>> 1.5' above the roof. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> A racking company says that we can cover them with modules, >>>>>> since the modules will be at least 4' above the roof. They have >>>>>> not yet provided any building code references to say that this >>>>>> is ok. Do any of you know if the building code allows this? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Bruce >>>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>>> >>>> >>>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>>> >>>> >>>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>>> >>>> >>>> List-Archive: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maill >>>> ist.html >>>> >>>> List rules & etiquette: >>>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>>> >>>> Check out or update participant bios: >>>> www.members.re-wrenches.org >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>> >>> >>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >>> >>> >>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> >>> >>> List-Archive: >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillis >>> t.html >>> >>> List rules & etiquette: >>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>> >>> Check out or update participant bios: >>> www.members.re-wrenches.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >> >> >> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org >> >> >> Change listserver email address & settings: >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> >> >> List-Archive: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist. >> html >> >> List rules & etiquette: >> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >> >> Check out or update participant bios: >> www.members.re-wrenches.org >> > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.ht > ml > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > > List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org > > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.ht > ml > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > _______________________________________________ List sponsored by Redwood Alliance List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change listserver email address & settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/maillist.html List rules & etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out or update participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
