boB Gudgel wrote:
Mark Dickson wrote:
Hi Bob, From what I understand the "State 108" code means that the
grid frequency is out of whack.
Frequency and voltage windows are both related to anti-islanding
detection, so I don't doubt you would receive this message.
I would be surprised if the error was not a result of a high impedance
(weak) grid at the inverter. Lowering the voltage at
the inverter, like, tapping down a transformer if possible (industrial
installation?) may be one answer. I remember Daryl
Thayer had to do that on one of his grid tie (not AC coupled) installs
to fix this sort of problem.
boB
Ooops ! My mind went islanding there on that xformer tapping idea !
(Battery based, not grid tied)
However, if you are using an OB FX you can lower the AC output
voltage. That is another
option that may help. OR, try a larger inverter with a lower output
impedance. It will be harder
for the Fronius to "think" the grid frequency is being pushed out of the
limits.
Also, have you taken your multi-meter and looked to see what the AC
voltage is around the time
the relays trip and errors occur ? Curious to hear what it is. You
might try to look at the frequency
also, but it may not be out of Fronius' window limit long enough to get
an accurate reading.
boB
It was explained to me by Fronius techs that: the IG sends out
pulses that if the grid is in good shape it is absorbed into the
grid. If the frequency is off then it bounces back to the IG
triggering the State 108.
Your response does give me something to think about though. . .
Mark Dickson
Oasis Montana Inc.
877-627-4778 toll-free
406-777-4321 (0830 fax)
www.oasismontana.com
www.grid-tie.com
www.PVsolarpumps.com -----Original Message-----
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of boB
Gudgel
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2009 11:42 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Fronius IG4000 problem
Mark Dickson wrote:
>> the array output climbs above 3000 or so watts, we continually
get a “State 108” code and shut down cycles each time a relay trips
on a diversion load...
Sounds to me like your diversion load may be too small and/or the
grid is weak at the Fronius end. When the diversion loads suddenly go
away due to
their "relays tripping", the Fronius', having lots of power to sell,
raising the AC grid voltage right out of the UL1741 / IEEE Voltage
window limit (132V ?).
It hen has to shut down and disconnect in order to stop the apparent
islanding condition. That's probably what state 108 is trying to tell
you ?
Looks like your Fronius inverter is most likely working just fine ?
boB
Larry,
I am having a somewhat similar problem with a recently installed
IG5100. I have it installed in conjunction with an Outback battery
based system for AC coupling. We have it set up to divert its loads
to an electric ice melter and then to a large electric heater as the
battery voltages climb. A third relay cuts the array power between
the Fronius and the AC panel if the battery voltage continues to
climb to unsafe levels.
When we have heavy sunshine and low house loads (second home) and
the array output climbs above 3000 or so watts, we continually get a
“State 108” code and shut down cycles each time a relay trips on a
diversion load. I have worked with both Outback and Fronius (who
have been great!) but at this point we are all baffled. I think my
next step, especially after reading the above post is to replace the
Fronius. Then as a last resort swap the IG5100 out to a couple of
SMA 3000US’s (a 6000US does not configure well with the 28 evergreens).
Any input from you guys would be greatly appreciated!
Mark Dickson
Oasis Montana Inc.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of
*William Miller
*Sent:* Sunday, April 19, 2009 7:59 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches
*Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] Fronius IG4000 problem
Larry:
We've installed about 20 IG/LV series inverters. Some failures
required only replacement of GF cards, most required replacement
inverters. We've had several DOA when new, one was replaced by
Fronius with a rebuild even when we warned in writing that we would
not accept a rebuild (it had multiple KOs pulled in the chassis --
just not acceptable). As of right now, we have 7 in non-operational
status awaiting replacement. No kidding.
There maybe be one or two that have not failed, but this is offset
by those that have failed multiple times. The biggest failure rate
is of the 6 LV4550s on an exterior north wall 2 blocks from the
beach
(http://millersolar.com/Portfolio/Commercial/Voler/voler.html).
These have been replaced three or four times each and are coming out
as soon as we finalize the paperwork, with 3 10K Plus series
inverters going in. This will require extensive rework, but we are
being paid for our time. The Fronius staff has been very nice, but
pretty slow to respond.
I hate to report bad reviews to this forum, but it is what it is.
William Miller
At 02:51 PM 4/19/2009, you wrote:
William,
100% of what quantity? Are there any special conditions that may
have contributed? Were they minor problems?
Larry
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Home Power magazine
List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Options & settings:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List-Archive:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List rules & etiquette:
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
Check out participant bios:
www.members.re-wrenches.org
_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Home Power magazine
List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Options & settings:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List-Archive:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List rules & etiquette:
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
Check out participant bios:
www.members.re-wrenches.org
_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Home Power magazine
List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Options & settings:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List-Archive:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List rules & etiquette:
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
Check out participant bios:
www.members.re-wrenches.org
_______________________________________________
List sponsored by Home Power magazine
List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Options & settings:
http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
List rules & etiquette:
www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
Check out participant bios:
www.members.re-wrenches.org
