My point exactly. But it is interesting to see. FWIW I wouldn't ever use GP's bike for any reference as they, each and every one, are more or less "test-mules" for trying things out. Hence my giving him a pass on using zip-ties-he wants a quick connect and go kind of set-up. Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message----- From: JimD <rasterd...@comcast.net> Sender: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 08:37:00 To: <rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> Reply-To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [RBW] What Makes the Rivendell I like looking at the 'staff bikes' on the Riv site. Grant's bikes have a fair number of 'things' on em. Mark Abele's bikes tend to be spare. There's no one way. We do and ride what we like and what works. -JimD On Jan 8, 2011, at 1:06 PM Jan 8, 2011, robert zeidler wrote: > I agree with it all, what a great bike to make into what you want. > The one thing I find quite amazing-this is an observation, not a > critique-is, especially on Cyclofiend, the amazing amounts of stuff > that people hang on their bikes. It's like farkle city! > > On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 3:54 PM, JimD <rasterd...@comcast.net> wrote: >> Well said Jim. >> I wish I could find the thing I read from Douglas Brooks where he >> talks >> about 'resolved' and 'resourcefull' bikes. >> A Hampsten Tournesol Rando bike is an example of a resolved bike. >> Everything is optimized for the function of long distance/unsupported >> riding. >> A Rivendell (pick any one) is a premier example of a 'resourceful' >> bike. >> Grant designs great riding bikes that are flexibly configurable. >> They may be >> aimed at different >> primary riding domains (Roadeo vs Bombadil) but can be setup across >> a wide >> range within the >> design target domain. >> Underlying this approach to the hardware is a sensibility for >> bicycling and >> bicyclers that is wide >> ranging - everything but racing. >> For me this sensibility has enriched the experience of bicycling >> beyond the >> bounds of my perspective during >> my first 20 years of riding. I was riding '10 speed racing bikes' >> and >> should go fast, train, be like Eddy. >> As I 'matured' I found the challenge of going fast and faster was >> getting >> hard and harder. >> I had to succumb to the dreaded triple to climb the hills around >> here. >> Once I realized I wasn't racing. I started thinking about other >> approaches. >> Having discovered Rivendell I'm riding more and having more fun >> than ever >> before. >> -JimD >> >> >> On Jan 8, 2011, at 11:09 AM Jan 8, 2011, CycloFiend wrote: >> >> on 1/7/11 12:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper at tkslee...@gmail.com wrote: >> (great questions which ended with...) >> >> What makes the Rivendell Different.. how does one explain that >> difference to >> >> those that just see a steel antique looking bke? >> >> I think there have been a couple of handling or "discussion of trail" >> threads where this has popped up before. These are a couple points >> I've >> probably made before... >> >> Rivendells (and I include all of the designs, not simply custom >> models) have >> a similar quality of ride. While a Roadeo is different from a >> Bombadil, >> there's an underlying set of design tenets which seems pretty >> consistent. >> For me, in my riding conditions, they are superlative. They are >> stable, >> predictable, solid handling bikes that generally keep me out of >> trouble, and >> then react appropriately when I'm silly enough to get my self into >> it. If >> they didn't handle well, nothing else would matter. >> >> The handling and ride is a sum of a all parts. It isn't _JUST_ >> trail, head >> angle, bb height, chainstay length, angles, and length. It's all >> of those >> things. You cannot just change one aspect and have the same bike. >> The >> bicycles are a product of those variables, plus the things which >> Grant has >> learned in the XX number of years of plotting out frames, testing >> them and >> thinking pretty deeply about the results. >> >> The bicycle designs have grown to be incredibly versatile. Ten >> years ago, >> the longer reach brakes weren't availalble. The clearances which we >> now >> enjoy were only possible with canti brakes. Finding a 28mm 700C >> tire was >> difficult, let alone a higher quality 30mm+ tire. The limiting >> factors have >> been the components, and Grant has always been pushing the envelope >> in this >> particular corner of the bicycle world. Add to that his commitment >> to high >> quality bags and racks and you end up with a useful and continually >> variable >> design. As I've repeated too many times, both my Quickbeam and >> Hilsen have >> been errand bikes, road bikes, mountain bikes, race bikes and >> brevet bikes >> in the time I've had them. Over the past couple years, I've grown >> to feel >> that if a bicycle can't be fendered or adapted, it really is not a >> "bicycle" >> in the true sense. In other words, when people ask what my "road >> bike" is, >> I kind of stare at them blankly. >> >> All of this could be done roughly, or quickly, or with a more >> industrial >> design tenet, but the fact that Rivendell connects the tubes with >> lugs, has >> small, undernoticed details and pays attention to decal fonts, >> paint colors, >> and bicycle packaging (just to pick out a quick few) to the extent >> that they >> do just locks them in for me. It distinguishes them as >> practitioners of a >> craft. It's important to me to support that. The "finish" work is >> part of >> the craft...part of the art of what they practice. >> >> I suppose it's easy to equate the outside, finishing layer with the >> whole. >> The first thing someone notices is the paint layer, the contrasting >> colors, >> the lugs. While that's part of the equation, the strength lies >> underneath. >> >> - Jim >> >> -- >> Jim Edgar >> cyclofi...@earthlink.net >> >> Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com >> Current Classics - Cross Bikes >> Singlespeed - Working Bikes >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups >> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com >> . >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups >> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com >> . >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners- > bu...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. 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