Short, centered pads are also helpful, like Kool-stop City pad, for 
example. It's only 46mm long. I never thought making pads 73mm long and 
offset was of any actual benefit. more of a nuisance really as they prevent 
the arms from opening all the way as they're supposed to. A common argument 
assumes a longer pad is better in rain or mud, but that's nonsensical. That 
would render road and cross bikes that use standard(road) size pads 
inferior, and that's not the case. I keep my rims and pads clean with 
common window cleaner. 

https://koolstop.com/products/city-threaded

On Saturday, June 29, 2024 at 7:52:42 PM UTC-4 Hoch in ut wrote:

> The way I understand it, brake squeal happens when the pads grab the rim, 
> reach max coef of friction (after they slip forward microscopically in the 
> pad holder or due to brake arm play) then slip/spring back. The rapid, tiny 
> movements back and forth cause the noise. 
>
> I’m wondering if holder less pads would work better in this regard. 
>
> https://a.co/d/0fmE8IZP
> On Saturday, June 29, 2024 at 1:37:16 PM UTC-6 John Rinker wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your input Hoch. The pads are several months on the bike, and 
>> everything is solid as can be in the brake arms. The pads are very slightly 
>> loose in the pad holders though.
>>
>> Hey Brian, Thanks for your explanation. I've just put a nickle's worth of 
>> space in the pads and still quite a squeal. Perhaps I'll take Josh C's 
>> suggestion and put a $1.25 worth of space between pad and rim! ;)
>>
>> Cheers, John
>>
>> On Saturday, June 29, 2024 at 9:54:20 AM UTC-7 Josh C wrote:
>>
>>> A proper toe-in setup often solves this problem. Sometimes a more 
>>> aggressive angle than you might be used to for the first couple rides may 
>>> help. 
>>>
>>> On Saturday, June 29, 2024 at 9:45:09 AM UTC-4 Brian Turner wrote:
>>>
>>>> John, I probably should've used different wording. Dilligent instead of 
>>>> "meticulous" is probably more appropriate. Meaning, I check to make sure 
>>>> my 
>>>> brake pads are toed in quite often, even if they are silent. Sometimes 
>>>> they 
>>>> won't squeal, but you can feel a slight chatter or vibration feel in the 
>>>> brakes on a long descent, and I find it good to check the toe-in when that 
>>>> happens. My method is the standard use of a coin between the rear end of 
>>>> the pads and the braking surface to set the toe-in. However, I find with 
>>>> quality pads like Kool Stop salmons, especially when paired with strong 
>>>> brakes like Pauls, I give the pads a bit more toe-in angle, so I use a 
>>>> nickels instead of say, a dime. Another thing I like to use regularly with 
>>>> machined sidewalls is a Mavic rim cleaning stone.
>>>>
>>>> Brian
>>>> Lexington KY
>>>>
>>>

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