((( Laughing )) .... I hate it when anyone asks "what's your pbh ?" It's 
like asking "what's your sign ?" As if it means what ... ? 
Going by crotch height alone totally ignores/assumes what frame reach 
someone may want/need. If you're a everyday cyclist it's very helpful to 
teach yourself about these things. Posting the frame stack and reach is 
very helpful, but the guys @Riv don't make it easily known. Bike fitters 
and formulas are all geared certain "outputs" that go along with their 
biased "inputs".  If you don't like their answers, it's better to do it 
yourself as no one knows you better. You can get creative and think outside 
the boxes of cycling "conventions"(like crank length for example), which 
largely go unchallenged by most. 

Now, if I didn't know exactly the dimensions of a frame I need I may have 
bought other stock Rivs and been sadly disappointed and sold them due to a 
too short of frame reach. I don't dig the high bar/upright "driving Miss 
Daisy" thing at all either. I tried it and found I liked much more forward 
leaning positions and bars no higher than the saddle, even with Albatross 
bars. I'm as flexible on the bike as I ever was and will put on some drop 
bars over the winter as that's a good time to mess with such things. I can 
still ride in a comfortable race-like position and have a "heads up" view. 
Having a strong core is most helpful. I'm thoroughly enjoying 
riding fast with the pedal to the metal this year. Just hammer and stop 
thinking ! Ahahahahahaaaa !  Hammer hammer hammer and when you're done 
hammering ..... hammer some more ! It's not about time or distance, it's 
about F U N ! Just let go of "I am so and so thus limited to so and so" , 
and BE the fun ! Life is inherently FUN !, lest there be LIFE at all .  I 
can drive like Miss Daisy in my pickup truck but I don't want to ride my 
bike like that !    Hammer time, yipeee ! 

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