At least from an armchair engineer perspective, and I recognize the 
limitations and dangers of doing so, I agree.  I've felt for a lot of years 
that Grant's designs have matured along with himself. I have a 1992 XO-1 as 
well which is clearly a very, very different bike than you'd see Grant make 
today. Is that because he's a lot more experienced now, or because his 
priorities have shifted as he's gotten older?  I tend to think it's as much 
the latter as it is the former. As someone in their late 30's, I tend to 
prefer his designs from when he was around that age (but no 700c for me, 
because 650b is so abundant now) 



On Saturday, 16 November 2019 13:55:44 UTC-8, John Phillips wrote:
>
>     The current Riv line up just isn't my thing. The older Riv line up was 
> perfect for me and 6 years ago I would have been completely happy with any 
> of them. I bought a 54cm Hunqapillar first, because I thought it was the 
> most adaptable, and I think it's perfect running on any tire between 38mm 
> to 55mm. I love that bike.
>
>    For me, the current ones don't have the same magic. But that's just me.
>
>    I think anyone should ride the new Riv lineup and/or find an older 
> model if they wish to see what suits them best.
>
>    Everyone is different!
>
> John
>
>
> On Saturday, November 16, 2019 at 1:23:31 PM UTC-8, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> " but I'd never trade my older Rivs for one"
>>
>> TRADE!?!?!?  Hell no!  Always buy more bikes.  Keep what you've got, and 
>> keep buying more.  More bikes!  
>>
>> :)
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Saturday, November 16, 2019 at 1:04:34 PM UTC-8, John Phillips wrote:
>>>
>>>   From an 85cm PBH viewpoint, I think you would really need to ride both 
>>> the old and new Homers to see what you like.
>>>
>>>   I have an older 57cm Homer and a 54cm Hunqapillar ,and I've ridden one 
>>> of the new longer wheel base Rivs. It was a nice riding bike, but I'd never 
>>> trade my older Rivs for one. The geometry of the older models is perfect 
>>> for me, but I can only speak for myself.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>

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