Steve, My experience mirrors yours, in that to avoid hand pain, I was going with extreme setback seatposts and pushing my saddles back on all except for my MTB. The hands felt fine, but the knees hurt and I couldn't really push hard. A Specialized video fit ended up pushing me forward by about the same amount as you, but shoulder, neck and hand pain prevented me from moving the handlebars forward. Carbon steerers prevented me from raising them higher than whatever high-angle stems I could find would allow, but the legs and knees felt much better.
That is when I decided to explore the Rivendell fit option, switched and sold a couple of my bikes. With both the Homer and the Bombadil, I am pretty much centered to slightly forward on the saddle rails with the Nitto 2-bolt seat post. When I fully center the saddle, I end up with pressure on my low back, which is how I started on both bikes. My leg is pretty much fully extended as well on the bottom of the pedal stroke. The upward tilt of the B-17 saddles also means that there is a very fine equilibrium point between slipping forward on the saddle when I pedal, staying back on the saddle but finding too much curvature/pressure on the low back and bending forward to go on the drops (on the Homer). I've ended up lowering my handlebars a bit from their initial position as that allows me to use the glute muscles better, but have also shortened the stem (Homer) from 9 to 8cm. There is still more fine tuning needed, as my hands tend to get sore... One of the best pieces on the compromises and issues you have to account for is available here: http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/fitting.htm Lennard Zinn also has a very good chapter on bike fit issues in his Cycling Primer book: http://www.amazon.com/Zinns-Cycling-Primer-Maintenance-Building/dp/1931382433/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1263507201&sr=8-4 René On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 8:13 AM, Frederick, Steve <frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu > wrote: > > My saddle ended up 4-5cm further forward, a couple of millimeters lower, > and with my bars a bit further forward and lowered a couple of cm's. He > showed me how my back now described an arc like a suspension bridge and that > the watt meter showed I was pedaling the same speed at a lower watt > output. He also said I'd find myself pedaling more with the big glute > muscles and to expect a sore butt "muscle sore, not saddle sore." That > was an accurate assessment! > >--
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