* on the Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 11:04:18PM +0200, li...@rhsoft.net wrote: >>> the problem is that a website script can't handle a temporary reject >> >> That's not true. > > it is true - period > > nobody right in his brain implements a mail queue in a scripting > language like PHP where the script just get terminated after the request
You just said that something can't be done "period", and then immediately described one way of doing it... I don't know how to debate with somebody who contradicts themselves so emphatically. Are you completely oblivious to the absurdity of what you just wrote? As a web developer my self, I would say that an application which sends emails that need to be delivered, and which doesn't handle failures, is broken. > >> and so you end in lose random mails if for whatever reason the app exceeds > >> the limits > > > > Web-apps that weren't written to handle retries, don't handle retries. I'll > > agree with that. > > see above See what above? The bit where you said it can't be done and than said it can be done? If you're writing code which doesn't handle failures, then you're writing bad and lazy code. > >> if you fear injected junk than install a content-filter or just remove > >> functionality on websites which allow to define destination address by > >> untrusted user input (recommedn page with a user-defined content part > >> and so on) > > > > I'm guessing you've never worked for a shared hosting company which > > provides a platform where tens of thousands of users can upload their > > own php scripts. Content filtering is useful, but ratelimiting is > > essential in these environemts. > > i guess i have a lot of expierience with webhosting, it's my daily job > rate limiting mail from webapps just burries the issue but don't solve > it and the only gain you have is that probably nobody is missing legit > mail from the damaged apps In the real world, php apps get abused to send spam. In the real world content filtering isn't perfect. If you don't rate limit mail from these platforms then you're being a "bad netizen" >> If a user attempts to send more email than they are allowed to and the mail >> server starts rejecting it and the users code doesn't handle this case, then >> from the shared hosting companies point of view, it is a problem at the >> users end > > blunt speaking outside of a ivory tower > > it's the companies problem because if it forces me as user to try > implement a mail queue in a php-application that's just incompetence and > the wrong hosting company - If you can't code your web app to notice when email attempts fail and to retry them later, then you're not qualified to write a web app and you're most likely a toxic customer. I suspect most shared hosting companies would be glad to see the back of such a customer. > if i have to do that i don't need the f*** MTA at all and can directly > deliver to the MX It would be an irresponsibly configured shared hosting platform which allowed users to make outgoing port 25 TCP connections. -- Mike Cardwell https://grepular.com https://emailprivacytester.com OpenPGP Key 35BC AF1D 3AA2 1F84 3DC3 B0CF 70A5 F512 0018 461F XMPP OTR Key 8924 B06A 7917 AAF3 DBB1 BF1B 295C 3C78 3EF1 46B4
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