Hello
Peter Uhnak summarized this thread about what what to include of
Pillar in the base image on Aug 17, 2017 ([1] original question, [2]
summary).
The issue of having a "Mini pillar" in the image was brought up by
Stephan Ducasse and summarized by Cyril Ferlicot.
I will start a new thread with the subject 'Mini Pillar'.
Regards
Hannes
[1]
On 8/11/17, Peter Uhnak <i.uh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I would like to propose including Pillar in the Pharo image by default.
>
> My reasoning:
>
> Since we are moving to git, and most people will use github, gitlab, and the
> likes, it is expected to include a README.md file (or possibly more
> extensive documentation) alongside the code.
>
> Which means that people will (and are) writing the README mostly by hand,
> which of course is problematic, as e.g. code snippets can get deprecated,
> screenshots become outdated, etc.
>
> As Pillar tries to address these problems, it would make sense to me to
> include Pillar in the image by default, as anyone using git (which
> eventually should be everyone) will most likely benefit from writing their
> documentation in Pillar.
> Similarly using Pillar would open an avenue to provide the documentation
> in-image, e.g. one exporter for html/markdown, and another one for Pharo's
> Help system.
>
> I could, of course, install Pillar every time, but considering thats extra
> effort and in the extra time I can fix the issues by hand, I don't have such
> an incentive to use Pillar for this.
>
> Questions & Problems:
>
> I don't know by how much would pillar increase the image size. Perhaps there
> could be (a) "lightweight Pillar" (that would include just pillar & markdown
> exporter), or (b) we would have different images for different uses.
>
> By different images I mean something along the lines of
> a) developer image - meant to be directly used by developers to create their
> software
> b) production image - as a foundation for running systems / users
>
> Does this make sense?
>
> Peter
>
>
-------------------------------
[2]
Peter Uhnak
<i.uh...@gmail.com> Thu, Aug 17, 2017 at 10:26 AM
Reply-To: Pharo Development List <pharo-...@lists.pharo.org>
To: Pharo Development List <pharo-...@lists.pharo.org>
Even though I've initiated this discussion I kind of stopped reading
because everyone started discussing completely unrelated things...
The initial point was.... "we are using github/gitlab more and more,
lets leverage it more"
New, lets separate the concepts at play here...
"Pillar - document model" - the workhorse of pillar and (imho) the
most important part of it, and also the part I am interested in being
included. Because then I can generate the document directly without
using any syntax...
"Pillar - syntax" - we can have endless arguments whether the syntax
is good or bad, and imho that should be a separate discussion
unrelated to the Pillar inclusion
"Markdown for unrelated usecases" - whether you can or cannot write
your thesis in markdown is really irelevant here
"Markdown - export" - there will always be different variants and
extensions for Markdown, simply because the sites using markdown offer
different capabilities.
Therefore the first focus should be on the most impact/effort ratio,
which is CommonMark (basically the only meaningful Markdown
specification), and GFM (which is a CommonMark with added tables and
strikethrough).
Adding support for more extensive export support, whether code related
(e.g. GitLab), or code unrelated (writing a thesis) should be a future
discussion, it is not relevant or too effortful right now.
"Markdown - import" - I would love to be able to write markdown and
have it imported into the Pillar document model, however that is imho
moot point right now, as it can always be added later
To summarize:
* primary
* include pillar document model
* include pillar syntax (as an import format)
* add CommonMark+GFM export
* secondary
* discuss Pillar syntax if needed (in a _new_ thread)
* discuss Markdown parser / importing CommonMark into Pillar model
* any other discussion not pertinent here should go elsewhere
Peter
-------------------------------------------------------------------
[3]
Cyril Ferlicot D.
<cyril.ferli...@gmail.com> AttachmentFri, Aug 11, 2017 at 6:57 PM
Reply-To: Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>
To: pharo-users@lists.pharo.org
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- Show quoted text -
Hi,
I know that Stephane want to includes a light version of Pillar in the
image.
Currently he is working on a way to remove Magritte dependency from
Pillar.
Another step would be to get a minimal parser not relying on
PetitParser.
This parser would parse only a subset of the Pillar syntax
that can be used for writing class comments. If this subset is defined
(I we have the list of all Document Items we want to understand), I can
give a try to make this light parse.
--------------------
Let us rephrase it:
- I would like to have a mini pillar with a simplified model and visitor
to display class comments.
- then think about Pharo 70 as the core and birth of a new generation of imageS
I will restart to revisit Pillar once I'm done with the Lecture at Prague.
Stef
----------------------------
Stephane Ducasse
<stepharo.s...@gmail.com> Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 7:09 PM
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To: Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>
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Tx cyril
For class comment I image that we want
!
-
-
*url*
and bold
[[[
]]]
Did I miss something.
Stef
-----------------------------
Stephane Ducasse
<stepharo.s...@gmail.com> Sun, Aug 13, 2017 at 9:08 PM
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Hi tim
I personally do not care much about the syntax but I care about what I
can do with it
(ref, cite, ... )
I cannot write books in markdown because reference to figures!!!!!!
were missing.
And of course a parser because markdown is not really nice to parse
and I will not write a parser because I have something else to do. I
want to make pillar smaller, simpler, nicer.
Now if someone come up with a parser that parse for REAL a markdown
that can be extended with decent behavior (figure reference, section
reference, cite) and can be extended because there are many things
that can be nice to have (for example I want to be able to write the
example below) and emit a PillarModel (AST) we can talk to have
another syntax for Pillar but not before.
[[[test
2+3
>>> 5
]]]
and being able to verify that the doc is in sync.
Stef
