-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 some TPVs might be released under licenses that do assign responsibilities, legal liabilities etc to developers and/or distributers, the TPVP shouldn't attempt to override any license applied to any TPV
On 15/4/2010 09:13, Aleric Inglewood wrote: > I thought it would make more sense (I still have hope) to say this now, > and not wait till 30 April. > > Also I have decided that Linden Lab does not deserve the 40 hours > per week that I spend volunteering on the snowglobe sources. > Lately I have done less because my motivation was gone due to > the policy, and there has been a long break because I suffer from > something like carpel tunnel, but over all I DO spend that amount > of time on a project that I am devoted to. > > If the TPV policy is not going to address FULLY that any open source > developers remain completely free of liability as stated in the GPL > license > > [to recap: > > [...] THE ENTIRE RISK AS > TO THE QUALITY AND PERFORMANCE OF THE PROGRAM IS WITH YOU [the user]. > SHOULD THE PROGRAM PROVE DEFECTIVE, YOU ASSUME THE COST OF ALL > NECESSARY SERVICING, REPAIR OR CORRECTION. > > [...] IN NO EVENT UNLESS REQUIRED BY APPLICABLE LAW [...] > WILL ANY COPYRIGHT HOLDER, OR ANY OTHER PARTY WHO MAY MODIFY AND/OR > REDISTRIBUTE THE PROGRAM AS PERMITTED ABOVE, BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR DAMAGES, > INCLUDING ANY GENERAL, SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING > OUT OF THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE PROGRAM (INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED > TO LOSS OF DATA OR DATA BEING RENDERED INACCURATE OR LOSSES SUSTAINED BY > YOU OR THIRD PARTIES OR A FAILURE OF THE PROGRAM TO OPERATE WITH ANY OTHER > PROGRAMS), EVEN IF SUCH HOLDER OR OTHER PARTY HAS BEEN ADVISED OF THE > POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. > > ] > > Because of the parts in the [...] it may or may not be POSSIBLE to make > developers > liable through the TPV policy, I don't care. I don't want to run the > risk that the TPV > makes me liable, so it should not contain any words that could be > interpreted > as such. > > I am sorry to say that I doubt that this will come to a resolution, > because Joe already > has said that he can only take SMALL changes and is not looking for a > rewrite. He also > said that he can only take it to the lawyers, but he has no power to > actually enforce > anything, it is not up to him. > > I will probably start maintaining another TPV specifically for some > opengrid grid. > > The REASON I wanted to work on Snowglobe is because I believe that all open > source projects are equal. We are not competitors (some devs of certain > TPV(s) > might take that to heart). I wanted to work there where my bug fixes and > improvements would benefit all. But exactly for that reason I cannot standby > when other open source projects that derive from Snowglobe are bullied into > termination of their project and/or are forced to give up the freedom to > make > their own decisions, the only benefit of being an OS dev. > > Sad, > Aleric Inglewood > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 8:49 PM, Joe Linden <j...@lindenlab.com > <mailto:j...@lindenlab.com>> wrote: > > For those watching without the benefit of a transcript or the actual > words I said in the meeting yesterday, here was the rest of that > quote: "/ //we've had a lot of internal debate around cost/benefit > of OS //... and we're fully committed to redoubling our commitment > to make this a successful program/." Was it infuriating that we > have internal debates from time to time on how we staff our > projects, or infuriating because we are redoubling our efforts in > many ways to make this a more successful and meaningful project for > the OS community than it has been in the past? I was actually > making a comment that we've not done this very well to date (in > fact, we've sucked at it), and we're committed to many changes to > improve the situation. > > Either way, we're sorry to see you go. > > -- joe > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Rob Nelson > <nexisentertainm...@gmail.com <mailto:nexisentertainm...@gmail.com>> > wrote: > > And yet, it does restrict GPL distribution rights. We've been > over this > already. And I'd like to see where the FSF OKed it, the only > thing I > can turn up on Google is Richard Stallman not being too happy > about it. > > I already changed the viewer I used to be working on to Luna, > but both > the GPL incompatabilities and this rather infuriating "cost/benefit" > comment by Joe have resulted in me deciding that LL does not > deserve any > further OSS development work from me. > > > On Wed, 2010-04-14 at 14:11 -0400, Ron Festa wrote: > > Honestly I tried looking through my inbox to find out what your > > concerns were and why no one else addressed them so forgive me > if I > > couldn't find them. The only problems I saw you had was > compatibility > > with the GPLv2 and the use of "Life" in your viewer name. > > > > > > The issues with Section 7 were in fact addressed and took up > most of > > the meeting. Someone claimed they went as far as bringing the TPVP > > before the FSF to verify if its GPLv2 compliant and sadly > according to > > them it is as its restricting a service not the code. Never > the less > > concerns were brought up and productive changes were suggested. > > > > > > As for the branding this should be no argument. If in a court > of law > > they can make Lindows change their name to Linspire because > Microsoft > > owns *indows then LL can do the same with all the TPV's as > stupid as > > that is. > > > > > > If these aren't your only concerns please share them so some > of us can > > deliver them by proxy for you since the time zone difference > seems to > > be the biggest problem for you. > > > > > > Ron Festa > > Virtual Worlds Admin > > Division of Continuing Studies at Rutgers University > > PGP key: http://bit.ly/b1ZyhY > > Phone: 732-474-8583 > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Rob Nelson > > <nexisentertainm...@gmail.com > <mailto:nexisentertainm...@gmail.com>> wrote: > > I decided to read the transcript and it did not > address any of > > my > > concerns. > > > > [12:21][Voice Transcript] Joe Linden: we've ha a lot of > > internal debate > > around cost/benefit of OS > > > > ^ That was all I needed to hear. Debate's effectively > over. > > > > On Wed, 2010-04-14 at 09:27 -0700, Joe Linden wrote: > > > > > > > Rob, > > > > > > I take it you weren't at the meeting yesterday? > > > > > > -- Joe > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 9:02 AM, Rob Nelson > > > <nexisentertainm...@gmail.com > <mailto:nexisentertainm...@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > It's already reached a point where LL has > told us, > > to our > > > faces, that > > > they are not going to change the policy, > meaning our > > opinion > > > doesn't > > > mean diddly to them. There's no use > continuing to > > discussion, > > > just as > > > there's no use continuing TPV development. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 2010-04-14 at 07:52 -0500, Jonathan > Irvin > > wrote: > > > > To Whom It May Concern: > > > > > > > > I'm requesting Linden Lab's response to this > > inquiry due to > > > the recent > > > > influx of new topic related...or should I say > > unrelated to > > > the > > > > development of the SnowGlobe viewer. > Lately, when > > I open my > > > email, I > > > > get 5-10 different topics and responses > daily to > > the recent > > > changes > > > > for the Third Party Viewer policy and I > feel that > > this is > > > not related > > > > to SnowGlobe or related development at all. > > > > > > > > To "clear the pipes", can we please move these > > discussions > > > to a > > > > different forum or list so valid OpenSource > > development > > > questions are > > > > not lost in the flames, complaints, and > > discussions related > > > to this > > > > specific topic? > > > > > > > > I do not feel it is valid in this forum to > talk > > about which > > > > Third-Party Viewers in the directory were > already > > > impersonated or > > > > which part of the third party viewer > policy they > > do not > > > like. > > > > > > > > Linden Labs, if you can please isolate this to > > another > > > forum, I bet > > > > those who are truly interested in the > opensource > > development > > > of the > > > > Second Life viewer would be more in tuned to > > staying here > > > rather than > > > > wake up to read yet another unproductive > "I hate > > LL and the > > > TPVP lets > > > > get together and share our misery post". > > > > > > > > Respectfully & Best Regards, > > > > > > > > Jonathan Irvin > > > > SL Resident of 5 Years. > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Policies and (un)subscribe information > available > > here: > > > > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > > > > Please read the policies before posting to > keep > > unmoderated > > > posting privileges > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Policies and (un)subscribe information available > > here: > > > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > > > Please read the policies before posting to keep > > unmoderated > > > posting privileges > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > > Please read the policies before posting to keep > unmoderated > > posting privileges > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting > privileges > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkvHHQsACgkQ8ZFfSrFHsmUIugCfQPRZuC5NNyZoXA9ywIoL1ja1 IcgAn2xU38G5TKplSRpVfqpwFyUckUJt =qc0G -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
