È una riproduzione. In UE è permessa solo per scopo di text and data mining per ricerca senza finalità commerciali, oppure commerciali se l’autore non ha riservato il diritto. In USA si entra nel limbo del fair use, su cui nessuna corte di è ancora pronunciata. M.
On Fri, 29 Sep 2023 at 20:03, Stefano Quintarelli <stef...@quintarelli.it> wrote: > grazie > > e per quanto riguarda l'uso di testi generati facendo scansione ed OCR ? > > grazie!, s. > > On 29/09/23 19:58, Maurizio Borghi wrote: > > Caro Stefano, il tuo ragionamento è corretto. Aggiungo che la rimozione > del DRM è già > > perseguibile come violazione del diritto d’autore, non solo nei paesi > UE, ma anche in USA. > > Se l’opera non è protetta da DRM il discorso è un po’ più complicato: in > UE, il contratto > > di licenza non può escludere certi usi consentiti, in particolare il > text and data mining > > per scopi non commerciali. Può però escludere lo stesso utilizzo se per > scopi commerciali > > e se l’uso è espressamente riservato. In USA non ci sono regole precise, > ma la libertà > > contrattuale tende di solito a prevalere sulla disponibilità di > eccezioni (fair use). Non > > è un caso che nella class action contro GitHub / Copilot i claim si > basino interamente su > > violazione dei contratti di licenza (open source) e sulla rimozione dei > DRM, anziché sulla > > violazione del copyright nel software utilizzato per addestrare > l’algoritmo. > > Un caro saluto > > Maurizio > > > > > > > > On Fri, 29 Sep 2023 at 15:21, Stefano Quintarelli < > stef...@quintarelli.it > > <mailto:stef...@quintarelli.it>> wrote: > > > > Ho una domanda per i giuristi (anzi, piu' di una) > > > > per allenare un modello, ho bisogno di un file con la versione > digitale di un testo. > > (cosnsidero ovviamente testi non PD, CC0, ecc.) > > > > la versione digitale di un testo la posso ottenere da un ebook (gia' > digitale), togliendo > > il probabile DRM. > > ma un ebook non e' unbene ma e' un servizio soggetto a licenza > d'uso, quindi se non e' > > prevista nella licenza d'uso la facolta' di estrarre il testo > digitale per allenarci un > > modello, mi sembra che ci sia gia' una violazione della licenza, per > cui, credo, non > > possa > > essere usato come base di un allenamento, tanto piu' se il fine di > tale allenamento e' > > commerciale (se vendo un servizio basato su quel modello). > > > > se e' cosi', per allenare il mio modello devo allora prednere il > testo digitale facendo > > scan/ocr di un testo cartaceo. > > ma cio' e' possibile, se non erro, solo per uso personale e non > commerciale. > > > > se questo e' corretto, non mi pare ci sia un modo per prendere un > testo digitale senza > > infrangere una licenza d'uso/copyright > > > > dove e' la fallacia del ragionamento ? > > > > grazie, s. > > > > On 29/09/23 15:00, Stefano Borroni Barale wrote: > > > Buongiorno lista, > > > > > >> L'idea che istruire un modello su dei testi coperti da copyright > sia una > > violazione del suddetto copyright è altamente opinabile > > > > > > Fin qui, ho l'impressione che tutti i legali in lista > concorderanno. > > > > > >> ragionamento è in realtà abbastanza semplice: se istruirsi su un > > >> testo ne violasse il copyright, saremmo tutti dei criminali. > > > > > > Ma siccome noi siamo umani e quello che produciamo non è - salvo > i discorsi dei > > politici(*) - ontologicamente identico alla produzione di esseri > tecnici non viventi, > > logica vuole che quanto si applica a noi non possa applicarsi a un > LLM, tanto quanto > > la legge sul copyright non si applica pedissequamente all'utilizzo > di testi umani per > > creare modelli linguistici. > > > > > > Questo è il motivo per il quale tutti i tentativi di "proteggere > via copyright" il > > prodotto di software generativi sono falliti miseramente, e con > motivazioni scritte in > > sentenze; che per il diritto credo abbiano un peso assai maggiore > del sito di CC. > > > > > > La mia impressione è che la questione terrà impegnati legali, > informatici, filosofi > > e società ancora moooooolto a lungo. > > > SBB > > > > > > (*) Come sanno bene i bambini degli anni '80 che hanno giocato > con questo spassoso > > giocattolo: https://www.enricodalbosco.it/giochi/tubolario/ > > <https://www.enricodalbosco.it/giochi/tubolario/> > > > > > > > > > Di quei testi > > >> non c'è fisicamente traccia all'interno dei modelli, non viene > copiato > > >> niente. I modelli sono un'opera trasformativa di quei testi, non > > >> derivativa. > > >> > > >> Lo argomenta molto bene Creative Commons: > > >> > https://creativecommons.org/2023/02/17/fair-use-training-generative-ai/ > > < > https://creativecommons.org/2023/02/17/fair-use-training-generative-ai/> > > >> > > >> Detto questo, cito le parole di un altro autore, Jeff Jarvis: > > >> > > > https://www.facebook.com/jeff.jarvis/posts/pfbid0LMFeqdTYoxnGHQAZwp5HMmeeVqgMSjL2dkcwMcBojkb2cinBpgYTHyc7Fhq1B9NPl > < > https://www.facebook.com/jeff.jarvis/posts/pfbid0LMFeqdTYoxnGHQAZwp5HMmeeVqgMSjL2dkcwMcBojkb2cinBpgYTHyc7Fhq1B9NPl > > > > >> > > >> «I, for one, am not complaining about my books being in in large > > >> language model training sets. I write to enter ideas into public > > >> discourse. I prefer informed over ignorant AI. I believe it is > fair > > >> use for anyone to read & use books for transformative work. In > fact, > > >> I'd probably feel snubbed if my books were not there. I'm happy > when > > >> they are in libraries. I'm fine that they're here.» > > >> > > >> Fabio > > >> > > >> Il giorno ven 29 set 2023 alle ore 07:52 Alberto Cammozzo via > nexa > > >> nexa@server-nexa.polito.it <mailto:nexa@server-nexa.polito.it> > ha scritto: > > >> > > >>> > > > https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/sep/28/australian-books-training-ai-books3-stolen-pirated > < > https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/sep/28/australian-books-training-ai-books3-stolen-pirated > > > > >>> > > >>> Thousands of books from some of Australia’s most celebrated > authors have > > potentially been caught up in what Booker prize-winning novelist > Richard Flanagan has > > called “the biggest act of copyright theft in history”. > > >>> > > >>> The works have allegedly been pirated by the US-based Books3 > dataset and used to > > train generative AI for corporations such as Meta and Bloomberg. > > >>> > > >>> Flanagan, who found 10 of his works, including the > multi-international > > award-winning 2013 novel The Narrow Road to the Deep North, on the > Books3 dataset, > > told Guardian Australia he was deeply shocked by the discovery made > several days ago. > > >>> > > >>> “I felt as if my soul had been strip mined and I was powerless > to stop it,” he > > said in a statement. > > >>> > > >>> “This is the biggest act of copyright theft in history.” > > >>> > > >>> AI could ‘turbo-charge fraud’ and be monopolised by tech > companies, Andrew Leigh > > warns > > >>> > > >>> The Australian Publishers Association confirmed to Guardian > Australia on > > Wednesday that as many as 18,000 fiction and nonfiction titles with > Australian ISBNs > > (unique international standard book numbers) appeared to be affected > by the copyright > > infringement, although it is not yet clear what proportion of these > are Australian > > editions of internationally authored books. > > >>> > > >>> “We’re still working through [the data] to work out the impact > in terms of > > Australian authors,” APA spokesperson Stuart Glover said. > > >>> > > >>> “This is a massive legal and ethical challenge for the > publishing industry and > > for authors globally.” > > >>> > > >>> A search tool published on Monday by US media platform The > Atlantic and uploaded > > by the US Authors Guild on Wednesday revealed the works of Peter > Carey, Helen Garner, > > Kate Grenville, Anna Funder, Christos Tsiolkas and Thomas Keneally, > as well as > > Flanagan and dozens of other high-profile Australian authors, were > included in the > > pirated dataset containing more than 180,000 titles. > > >>> > > >>> On Thursday, the Australian Society of Authors issued a > statement saying it was > > “horrified” to learn that the works of Australian writers were being > used to train > > artificial intelligence without permission from the authors. > > >>> > > >>> ASA chief executive, Olivia Lanchester, described the Books3 > dataset as piracy on > > an industrial scale. > > >>> > > >>> “Authors appropriately feel outraged,” Lanchester said. “The > fact is this > > technology relies upon books, journals, essays written by authors, > yet permission was > > not sought nor compensation granted.” > > >>> > > >>> Lanchester said the Australian literary industry, while not > objecting per se to > > emerging technologies such as AI, was deeply concerned about the > lack of transparency > > evident in the development and monetisation of AI by global tech > companies. > > >>> > > >>> “Turning a blind eye to the legitimate rights of copyright > owners threatens to > > diminish already precarious creative careers,” she said. > > >>> > > >>> “The enrichment of a few powerful companies is at the cost of > thousands of > > individual creators. This is not how a fair market functions.” > > >>> > > >>> Josephine Johnston, chief executive of Australia’s Copyright > Agency, described > > the Books3 development as “a free kick to big tech” at the expense > of Australia’s > > creative and cultural life. > > >>> > > >>> “We’re going to need greater transparency – how these tools > have been developed, > > trained, how they operate – before people can truly understand what > their legal rights > > might be,” she said. > > >>> > > >>> “We seem to be in this terrible position now where content > owners – remembering > > that the vast majority of them will be individual authors – may > actually have to take > > out court cases to enforce their rights.” > > >>> > > >>> Australian copyright law protects creators of original content > from data scraping. > > >>> > > >>> Litigation in the US against ChatGPT creator OpenAI over use of > allegedly pirated > > book datasets, Books1 and Books2 (which do not appear to be > affiliated with Books3) > > has already commenced. > > >>> > > >>> In July, North American horror/fantasy writers Mona Awad > (author of Bunny) and > > Paul Tremblay (author of The Cabin at the End of the World) filed a > lawsuit in a San > > Francisco federal court, alleging ChatGPT unlawfully digested their > books as part of > > its AI training data. > > >>> > > >>> On 28 August, OpenAI filed a motion to dismiss the lawsuit, > arguing that the > > authors “misconceive the scope of copyright, failing to take into > account the > > limitations and exceptions (including fair use) that properly leave > room for > > innovations like the large language models now at the forefront of > artificial > > intelligence”. > > >>> > > >>> On 19 September the Writers Guild and 17 of its members, > including bestselling > > novelists John Grisham, George RR Martin and Jodi Picoult, filed a > complaint in a New > > York district court against OpenAI, seeking redress for “flagrant > and harmful > > infringements” of guild members’ registered copyrights. > > >>> > > >>> In a statement on its website, the guild says while it is aware > that companies > > such as Meta and Bloomberg have used the Books3 dataset to train > their LLMs, it is not > > yet clear whether OpenAI is using Books3 to train its ChatGPT models > GPT 3.5 or GPT 4. > > >>> > > >>> Democracies face ‘truth decay’ as AI blurs fact and fiction, > warns head of > > Australia’s military > > >>> > > >>> Guardian Australia has sought comment from OpenAI, which has > yet to officially > > respond to the guild’s complaint, and Meta. > > >>> > > >>> On 4 September, US technology magazine Wired reported that a > Danish anti-piracy > > group called Rights Alliance had been told by Bloomberg that the > company did not plan > > to train future versions of its BloombergGPT using Books3. > > >>> > > >>> Bloomberg declined to respond to the Guardian’s queries. > > >>> > > >>> The APA said the global nature of the issue would present > significant challenges > > in enforcement and prosecution, and has joined the authors’ society > in calling for AI > > technologies to be regulated. > > >>> > > >>> Consultation closed last month for a Department of Industry, > Science and > > Resources discussion paper on supporting responsible AI. > > >>> > > >>> A parliamentary inquiry is under way examining the use of > generative artificial > > intelligence in the Australian education system. > > >>> > > >>> Flanagan said it was up to the Australian government to act to > protect > > Australia’s writers. > > >>> > > >>> “It has power and we do not,” he said. > > >>> > > >>> “If it cares for our culture it must now stand up and fight for > it.” > > >>> > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> nexa mailing list > > >>> nexa@server-nexa.polito.it <mailto:nexa@server-nexa.polito.it> > > >>> https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa > > <https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa> > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> nexa mailing list > > >> nexa@server-nexa.polito.it <mailto:nexa@server-nexa.polito.it> > > >> https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa > > <https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa> > > > _______________________________________________ > > > nexa mailing list > > > nexa@server-nexa.polito.it <mailto:nexa@server-nexa.polito.it> > > > https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa > > <https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa> > > _______________________________________________ > > nexa mailing list > > nexa@server-nexa.polito.it <mailto:nexa@server-nexa.polito.it> > > https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa > > <https://server-nexa.polito.it/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nexa> > > >
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