Let’s just say that it is quite typical that, “FreeMail” mail providers such as HotMail and … others … are typically not classical Profit Centers.
Some try and fund their services with ads. Some … try and run it for the, “Good Will” (in the Financial Sense). Few charge for a standard mailbox. But to think that such an enterprise would hire thousands, if not tens of thousands, of folks to provide the necessary levels of technical support … Not happening. Aloha, Michael. -- Michael J Wise Microsoft Corporation| Spam Analysis "Your Spam Specimen Has Been Processed." Open a ticket for Hotmail<http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866> ? From: Chris Woods <christopherwoods+list-mai...@gmail.com> Sent: Friday, July 31, 2020 6:34 PM To: Michael Wise <michael.w...@microsoft.com> Cc: mailop@mailop.org Subject: Re: [mailop] [EXTERNAL] Need help with Microsoft S3150 and Yahoo TSS09 on recently transferred /24 On Fri, 31 Jul 2020 at 23:39, Lili Crowley <lili.crow...@verizonmedia.com<mailto:lili.crow...@verizonmedia.com>> wrote: Chris- I'm from Yahoo/AOL/VMG. I just helped him and help lots of people who contact me from mailop so perhaps adjust your commentary accordingly. Thanks. Lili Noted, and apologies. Frankly it was brainfade on my part to suggest that and I was wrong to say it. Long stressful day, making generalisations, frustration from experiences with other providers, not excuses though! We've obviously all seen you and colleagues engaging and investigating issues on the list, credit to you. I appreciate your efforts, same to you Marcel. NB that I said I'd never personally noticed any deliverability problems for any of my customers sending to Yahoo/Verizon/AOL, top marks. Whatever approach you take regarding weighting or filtering has always apparently worked well for me, even through several recent customer mail IP and hosting provider changes. I'm very happy about that. My small fish experience is that if you can talk to someone from a big provider they're often only able to discuss in generalities and can't address specific problems. I understand that can be due to the nature of their role, employer limitations or because they're only here in an individual capacity. I wrote a few frustrated paragraphs about the state (lack) of support for lower volume operators delivering in to EO/365 and GSuite but it's veering OT and we've all heard it before! Still status quo in that regard. (down down, deeper and down) Of course Lili and Marcel and all other ops on the list who offer proactive support, it's great to see you care. When we're allowed in bars again, I'll gladly buy you various drinks as thanks for you sensibly running your services and offering support to the community. It's a continued pain that some other providers are not contactable at a human level, nor willing or able to investigate issues outside of a decision tree. And apologies again for opening mouth before engaging brain, yours humble pie-edly... On Sat, 1 Aug 2020 at 01:33, Michael Wise via mailop <mailop@mailop.org<mailto:mailop@mailop.org>> wrote: Normally, for Office365, we'd suggest beginning your journey here: https://sender.office.com/<https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fsender.office.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7CMichael.Wise%40microsoft.com%7C41ee776c906a470514d108d835bafae5%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C0%7C0%7C637318424475553705&sdata=lvTqDhIQ445wuP0HH4OUVhQYgyxAvBHPlNpBQZyCVB4%3D&reserved=0> And for "HotMail", we would suggest going ... here. What to do in that case can be found by searching the archives of this ML. 😃 You will *NEVER* get anything aside from automated responses from Sender Support because … that is the way the Lawyers have stipulated it. And aside from pointing out the above noted two resources, there is very little else you will get from posting to this mailing list because … *I* don’t scale. Aloha Michael :-) I appreciate you contribute where you can, but as you say, there's not much else you can do. I empathise, I'd be equally frustrated by the limitations. Even if you are able to quietly backchannel some problems back to teams, you can't possibly be expected to scale to triage WW support. But it's nuts that there's no viable alternative. I'm amazed that the world's largest provider of hosted enterprise mail apparently doesn't feel the need to scale deliverability support or respond usefully to technical queries. I question the benefit of the lawyers to MS or the community. ;-)
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