Hi, Actually, the tutorial does cover menus, and does do a reasonable job of explaining some basic functions of VO on the Mac.
Later… Tim Kilburn Fort McMurray, AB Canada On Jan 13, 2014, at 12:49 PM, Teresa Cochran <vegaspipistre...@gmail.com> wrote: > Yes, I remember using the quick-start tutorial about twenty minutes after > taking my Mac Mini out of the box. Once I went through it, the registration > form for my Mac was a breeze. As I recall, I then panicked because I couldn’t > remember the keystroke to get into menus, and my husband had to look it up > for me. LOL I think the tutorial doesn’t cover menus, which is VO-m or > control-f2. > > Teresa > > "Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too > dark to read."--Groucho Marx > > On Jan 13, 2014, at 11:15 AM, Phil Halton <philh...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> If I may say, the Quickstart tutorial is for people who have never even >> touched a Mac >> Before. It's not a review for experts. >> >> Sent from my IPhone >> >> >> On Jan 13, 2014, at 1:10 PM, Anne Robertson <a...@anarchie.org.uk> wrote: >> >>> Hello April, >>> >>> Looking back over your posts, I see that you said you had to relabel your >>> bumblebee keyboard. What kind of keyboard is this? It could well be that >>> all your confusion stems from not having an Apple keyboard. >>> >>> VoiceOver is not really a program as such, it’s a method of interacting >>> with the Operating System, so turning it off is like turning the screen off. >>> >>> When using VoiceOver, you need to treat the Control and Option keys as >>> though they were pedals on a piano. You hold them down before pressing >>> other keys. >>> >>> If you have problems holding down so many keys at once, there is a setting >>> in System Preferences where you can turn on Sticky Keys which allows you to >>> press one key at a time. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Anne >>> >>> >>> On 13 Jan 2014, at 18:06, April Brown <aprilbrownwr...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Donna, >>>> >>>> I'm going to do my best to politely disagree with you. The training >>>> program is fine for a review for people who have used VoiceOver, and >>>> perhaps other screen readers successfully.. >>>> >>>> However, for someone who never has been successful at using a >>>> screen reader, it is totally unclear. The only clear step - is how to >>>> turn it on and off. >>>> >>>> Most people trying to learn it would have far less computer knowledge than >>>> either me or my husband, are not young, can't read the developer's mind, >>>> and are still partially sighted, or only recently lost their vision. The >>>> training program is not geared for those people - exactly the people >>>> trying to use it. >>>> >>>> I have asked specifically to a link to a specific web site with step by >>>> step directions. Although, others responded offering to help off list, >>>> the first person reminded me that I am too stupid to live, and no one has >>>> the time to write a step by step guide. >>>> >>>> I should say thank you to that person for reminding me what I heard many >>>> times a day for the first twenty years of my life. >>>> >>>> I am too stupid to live if I can't read the developer's mind, and need a >>>> actual training manual to learn something new. >>>> >>>> I have asked, at least three times what three specific terms meant, hoping >>>> I could figure it out if I cold figure out those terms. One person >>>> defined one of them today. And a search on the Internet does not reveal >>>> definitions related to computers, or VoiceOver. >>>> >>>> I think I'm wasting my time trying to learn a program without a training >>>> manual. >>>> >>>> How many thousands of people have given up before this point, because >>>> there is no manual? >>>> >>>> How many people are sitting at home twiddling their thumbs because they >>>> are not a mind reader? >>>> >>>> I need to be spending the last few weeks with my remaining vision writing >>>> and learning Braille. >>>> >>>> This will be my last computer. I'm too old too keep up with the lingo. >>>> >>>> Since I am just a pest trying to ask questions to learn how to use this, I >>>> won't ask anymore. >>>> >>>> On Monday, January 13, 2014 8:05:57 AM UTC-5, Donna wrote: >>>> April, >>>> >>>> Just a few comments that I hope will be helpful. >>>> >>>> First, it seems like you've turned this thing into a dragon. It really >>>> isn't it's just a piece of software. Treat it that way. You're not >>>> climbing a mountain. Many of us, myself included found the Mac very >>>> frustrating at the beginning. for me, that lasted about three months, and >>>> then suddenly everything just clicked.. I don't think this is due to any >>>> inherent problems on the Mac, but rather that it was a new system and new >>>> screen-reader. I'm pretty sure I was equally frustrated with JAWS and >>>> Windows, but that was so long ago now that I've forgotten how frustrated I >>>> was. So take it easy, and take it in very small chunks. >>>> >>>> Second, don't rely too much on your husband. I'm not sure it's always >>>> intuitive to sighted person how someone who is blind or low-vision uses a >>>> computer, so his take/experience with Voiceover may not be the best >>>> measuring stick. this may apply to you as well. You've mentioned that >>>> you're losing both your hearing and your vision. That is going to require >>>> that you figure out new ways of interacting with things, which is >>>> inevitably going to be quite frustrating at times. So while you may have >>>> a lot of computer knowledge, I suspect that you are doing more than just >>>> learning to use a Mac, you're relearning how to use a computer. >>>> >>>> Regarding the terms you say overwhelm you, if you can figure out physics >>>> terms, then you know that every discipline, and even subdisciplines, have >>>> their specific terminology. If you don't know what a hot-spot is, either >>>> google it, or ask one of us. We'd be happy to tell you. Asking questions >>>> and then getting answers is a much better use of this list then just >>>> venting your frustrations, though of course many of us have had occasion >>>> to do that as well. :) >>>> >>>> As for dictation, I hate to shoot down your husband's theory, but it isn't >>>> context-based. So it works the same way, whether your using Facebook or >>>> Pages. It cares less about the inflection in your voice than it does the >>>> clarity of your speech. One key difference that I can see between social >>>> media and a pages document is that the latter is usually much longer. So >>>> I'm wondering if the chunks you are dictating in your social media posts >>>> are simply shorter, and thus you're having better luck. >>>> >>>> Just some thoughts, hope they're helpful. >>>> Good luck today, >>>> Donna >>>> On Jan 13, 2014, at 6:47 AM, April Brown <aprilbr...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I get to spend the afternoon doing one of my favorite things (and yes, >>>>> this is honest, not sarcastic): Re-formatting a computer for one of >>>>> hubby's co-workers. >>>>> >>>>> While in that room - Hubby and I will try the VoiceOver trainer on his >>>>> Mac, and see if he has any luck figuring it out. >>>>> >>>>> Most people say that if between his computer knowledge, and mine, it cant >>>>> be figured out, it either can't be important, or it isn't easy. >>>>> >>>>> I can figure out earthquake, volcano, and even some physics terms >>>>> relatively easy. And yet, these term that I cannot find defined anywhere >>>>> on the net that are used in the VoiceOver training are OverWhelming. >>>>> >>>>> Regina, I did see that link to Sarai's post, and have read all the pages >>>>> on that site, even before my first post on here. >>>>> >>>>> Oh, and hubby thinks he knows why I can use Dictation in social media, >>>>> and not Pages to tell a story. In social media, I rarely use inflection. >>>>> However, I am a storyteller, so in novel writing, I have all kinds of >>>>> inflection and excitement. I don't talk in a monotone while recording a >>>>> story. Makes sense. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>>> email to macvisionarie...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisi...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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