Hi Esther and Buddy, I want to thank you both for the ideas for using mail in the newer "modern" view and being able to close up the message body pane. It works great for me now and the read/unread flags don't get changed by merely going up and down the message list anymore. I think mail on the Mac may actually become a pleasure to work with now.
OK mutt, better step aside now. <smile> Oh, mutt is that other mail client I love so much:). On 4/16/12, Esther <mori...@mac.com> wrote: > Hi Ioana, > > If you're using the IOGear Bluetooth keyboard, I'm not sure how that works > on the splitters. (The "small" keyboard description was the give-away -- > everyone who recommends that keyboard for touch typing adds the comment, > "but I have small hands".) Yes, that keyboard has a num lock key in the > F-key row, just as my 12" PowerBook G4 laptop does. (I got this laptop when > I first joined the Macvisionaries list, back when I still used a dial-up > connection. It was my first Mac, and it still works.) And you can use that > laptop to type numpad style numbers with and embedded keyboard using the Fn > key plus the letters on the right side of the keyboard (in the numpad > region), just as I can on the PowerBook (in Tiger). I think you can activate > the numeric functions when paired to the Mac by pressing the Numlock key -- > which may be F6 -- without turning on NumPad Commander. But I don't think > the modified NumPad Commander keys will work on this, such as using the > Control key. I can't be sure, because I don't use this keyboard with my > laptop, and only checked out its pairing behavior to learn what it could do. > I'd have to use this in place of my Mac's laptop keyboard to check this > out. > > HTH. Cheers, > > Esther > > On Apr 16, 2012, at 11:06 AM, Ioana Gandrabur wrote: > >> Pretty good explanation Esther as usually. >> >> A few observations however.1. I have a small keyboard and activate numpad >> keys with fn +letter keys but you are right that I do have numpad condor >> on. >> 2. Control numpad 5 did not work for the vertical splitter on my mac mini. >> Neither did vo shift space. Heard sound of click but nothing else >> happened. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Ioana >> Please check out my cd on www.ioanagandrabur.com on iTunes and most online >> stores. >> >> On Apr 16, 2012, at 4:24 PM, Esther wrote: >> >>> Hi Ioana, >>> >>> That's an "Oops!". I keep forgetting that the VoiceOver Getting Started >>> manual used to recommend that you should not turn on Mouse Keys if you >>> have NumPad Commander turned on. I only remember that from the Leopard >>> guide. You have a Mac Mini, and are using a full-sized keyboard with a >>> numpad. I'm used to using the laptop keyboard, so I only turn on NumPad >>> Commander when I want to attach a USB numpad or do fancy simulations of >>> numpad actions with the top row of number keys in combination with an >>> arrow key. (This will let you access the unmodified NumPad Commander >>> sequences for the same keys on the numeric keypad.) >>> >>> What happened when support for the embedded numeric keypad in laptops >>> went away in Leopard, I found I could use some of the keys by turning >>> MouseKeys on. But the side effect was that some of your control keys >>> (like the Command key, as I recall) don't work in VoiceOver any more, so >>> that is doubtless why they told us not to try using both NumPad Commander >>> and Mouse Keys simultaneously in Leopard. In later versions of OS X I >>> bet they simply disabled some of the functions if you have both modes >>> activated. >>> >>> Regardless of the "Oops!", people who have full keyboards with NumPad >>> Commander activated can use their numpad to click on the splitter for the >>> Preview pane in Mail by pressing Control+"5" in Snow Leopard and Lion. >>> The "5" is the key on the numpad. No need to turn on Mouse Keys. >>> >>> HTH. Cheers, >>> >>> Esther >>> >>> On Apr 16, 2012, at 10:03 AM, Ioana Gandrabur wrote: >>> >>>> HI all, >>>> >>>> I had a strange behavior with Esther's procedure. I placed mouse pointer >>>> on vertical splitter, turned mouse keys on and when pressing I key just >>>> heard a ding. It worked when I performed the FN +i on my keyboard to get >>>> the numpad 5 but only after turning vo off. What ever works as they >>>> say. >>>> I also tried it with quicknav on or off in case the quicknav keys were >>>> interfering with mouse keys but nope. >>>> I a not even going to go there to try to get why this is. IF others are >>>> so inlined have fun puzzling it out. Smile. >>>> >>>> Please check out my cd on www.ioanagandrabur.com on iTunes and most >>>> online stores. >>>> >>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 10:01 PM, Esther wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Buddy and Jon, >>>>> >>>>> This was interesting. I just re-enabled and disabled the Preview pane >>>>> in the new mail view for Lion by clicking on the vertical splitter, but >>>>> I did it with mouse keys. I was using Mouse pointer ignores VoiceOver >>>>> Cursor for my navigation tracking options under VoiceOver Utility, with >>>>> the other 4 boxes checked for cursors to track each other (keyboard >>>>> focus, insertion point, and VoiceOver cursor). >>>>> >>>>> In the new mail view mode in Lion, navigating horizontally (with >>>>> VO-Right arrow or just right arrow in Quick Nav mode) starting from the >>>>> Mailbox list, which I have set to be shown under the View options >>>>> (toggle between show and hide with Command-Shift-M), I hear VoiceOver >>>>> announce: "Mailboxes", "Vertical Splitter", "Message Column", "Vertical >>>>> Splitter", then "Message Content" if the preview pane is not hidden. >>>>> >>>>> Once I'm navigate past the "Message Column" to the vertical splitter, I >>>>> can move my mouse pointer to my VoiceOver cursor with VO-Command-F5. >>>>> Then I can turn on mouse keys by pressing the option key 5 times (as I >>>>> have this configured under System Preferences > Universal Access > >>>>> Mouse & Trackpad). If I double tap the "i" key I can hide the preview >>>>> pane. This moves the vertical splitter to the far right, eliminating >>>>> the "Message Content". I can also reverse the instructions and >>>>> navigate to the new position of the vertical splitter, route my mouse >>>>> cursor to my VoiceOver cursor again with VO-Command-F5, and double tap >>>>> the "i" key to show the preview pane again. I do have to remember to >>>>> turn mouse keys off again by pressing the option key 5 times if I want >>>>> to type with other letter keys. I haven't been able to use >>>>> VO-Shift-Space for clicking on the vertical splitter. I can do show or >>>>> hide the preview pane in the new mail view for Lion whether or not I'm >>>>> in full screen mode. When I switch between the new view and classic >>>>> mail view the preview pane is either present or gone consistently in >>>>> both views. >>>>> >>>>> Buddy is correct that the it's the vertical splitter in the new mail >>>>> view that works analogous to the horizontal splitter in classic mail >>>>> view to show or hide the preview pane. >>>>> >>>>> HTH. Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Esther >>>>> >>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 3:17 PM, Buddy Brannan wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> OK, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have all cursors tracking. That is, keyboard focus follows >>>>>> Voiceover, VO cursor follows keyboard focus, insertion point follows >>>>>> VO, mouse pointer follows VO. >>>>>> >>>>>> Oh wait. I just did something dumb. Never mind. I should maybe >>>>>> actually do this with Lion. LOL >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA >>>>>> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 9:09 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn <jonc...@cox.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I just tried this and was unable to reproduce on my MacBook. Did you >>>>>>> interact did you simulate a single click as I implied from your >>>>>>> message? Please provide step by step including what your tracking >>>>>>> settings in Voice Over settings are... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jonathan >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jonathan C. Cohn >>>>>>> jonc...@cox.net >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 8:54 PM, Buddy Brannan wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If you're in the new mail view, and not classic, it's the vertical >>>>>>>> splitter that hides the preview pane. And, indeed, you can double >>>>>>>> click with VO+shift+space to move it. I just did, both to open and >>>>>>>> to close the preview pane. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I can't say how this works with classic view though, sorry. >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA >>>>>>>> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 7:33 PM, Esther <mori...@mac.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi Mike, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Double-clicking on the horizontal splitter with VO-Shift-Space >>>>>>>>> (e.g., by holding down the Control, Option, and Shift keys while >>>>>>>>> double tapping the space bar) used to work in Leopard to hide the >>>>>>>>> Preview pane. I think this ability went away in Snow Leopard. >>>>>>>>> There are definitely other examples of instances where you need a >>>>>>>>> "hardware" key click to work. I think that you may be able to >>>>>>>>> press the "5" key on the numeric keypad with NumPad Commander to >>>>>>>>> click, as well, but since I use a laptop I'd have to attach a USB >>>>>>>>> numeric keypad to try this. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> HTH. Cheers, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Esther >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 12:56 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I do find that moving through messages is more responsive with the >>>>>>>>>> preview pane turned off. Interesting that the voiceover click >>>>>>>>>> mouse command doesn't work here, but it definitely does not. >>>>>>>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 1:56 PM, Esther wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Anne, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Just as an added comment, in situations like this one, where I >>>>>>>>>>> want to make sure that the mouse pointer doesn't move when I >>>>>>>>>>> double click, and a physical click with trackpad or mouse is >>>>>>>>>>> required, I use mouse keys instead to perform the click. After >>>>>>>>>>> routing my mouse cursor to the VoiceOver cursor with >>>>>>>>>>> VO-Command-F5, I quickly press the option key 5 times to turn on >>>>>>>>>>> mouse keys, then I double tap the "i" key instead of performing a >>>>>>>>>>> double click with mouse or trackpad, and turn mouse keys off >>>>>>>>>>> again by quickly pressing the option key 5 times. As you know, >>>>>>>>>>> this requires having the box in the System Preferences > >>>>>>>>>>> Universal Access > Mouse & Trackpad tab checked for "Press the >>>>>>>>>>> Option key five times to turn Mouse Keys on or off". This will >>>>>>>>>>> work whether or not Trackpad Commander is turned off. Also, you >>>>>>>>>>> can additionally check the option for "Ignore built-in trackpad >>>>>>>>>>> when Mouse Keys is on" if you press (with VO-Space) the button >>>>>>>>>>> for "Trackpad Options…" on the Mouse & Trackpad tab of the >>>>>>>>>>> Universal Access menu of System Preferences in Lion. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> This is for cases where people have difficulty with clicking the >>>>>>>>>>> mouse or trackpad without moving the pointer, but it's useful in >>>>>>>>>>> general to know. It's most useful when using applications which >>>>>>>>>>> are transitioning in accessibility, where neither VO-Space or >>>>>>>>>>> VO-Shift-Space will work to click on controls, and you need to >>>>>>>>>>> perform physical clicks. Turning mouse keys on and clicking with >>>>>>>>>>> the "i" key always works as an alternative in these instances. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> HTH. Cheers, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Esther >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 15, 2012, at 7:43 AM, Anne Robertson wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Franc, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> First of all, you need to be in classic view to do this. You >>>>>>>>>>>> also need to have the Trackpad Commander turned off. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Go to the horizontal splitter above the body of the message >>>>>>>>>>>> using the VO keys, then bring the mouse (VO-Cmd-F5) and double >>>>>>>>>>>> click using either the trackpad or the mouse, depending on what >>>>>>>>>>>> kind of computer you have. If you move the mouse pointer even >>>>>>>>>>>> slightly before the double click, it won't work. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Anne >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 15 Apr 2012, at 16:10, Frank Ventura wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi all, I am using a Mac with the latest of Lion. Can anyone >>>>>>>>>>>>> tell me how to disable the preview pane in Mac mail. I had some >>>>>>>>>>>>> old directions for, I think, Leopard but they don't seem to >>>>>>>>>>>>> work. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>>>>>>> Frank >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>> >>> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
