I am not going to say anything good about Freedom, but you all act as if this
information is a done deal, where is the documentation that confirms it?
Rumors do not equal truth, so just where is this information coming from? I'm
not saying it isn't true, but I have to say that all that you learn on the
Internet isn't necessarily correct. If you doubt this, go to www.snopes.com :-)
----- Original Message -----
From: Carolyn
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 05, 2010 7:44 PM
Subject: Re: [bcab] End of Freedom?
And speaking of their stranglehold, some of you mac-savvy folks stand to gain
employability teaching the mac to those who either just start out, or move from
PC to Mac. Makes me want to really get cooking with mine!
carolyn
----- Original Message -----
From: Olivia Norman
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 05, 2010 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: [bcab] End of Freedom?
I agree with you! I've heard that "this works on JFW, so it must be
accessible" so many times! I'll be excited to see them loose some of their
strangle hold on the market.
Olivia
"Innovation distinguishes between a leader and a follower" Steve Jobs
On Jun 5, 2010, at 1:47 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> I will reserve comment on Freedom Scientific as a company. While I too
feel for those who will lose their jobs, I am more concerned for those who are
emotionally attached to jfw. Those who feel they have no choice but to use
windows. Those who are told that everyone uses jfw, and that you are not a good
blind person if you are not using it. those who fear going through the training
process again, if they ever got real training in the first place.
> Frankly I hope no one takes over the program. One of the blights on
access is the assumption that say banks and other commercial companies make
that if a site works with jfw, then it is fully accessible for all computer
users experiencing vision loss. That came from the strangle hold jfw had on the
state and government market.
> so removing the program all together opens the door indeed for a real
accessible level playing field. something rooted in w3c suggestions, not on
specific products. The adaptive market becomes one with many consumers making
computer choices based on their individual tastes and desires, not a one size
fits all lump of people.
> But someone is going to have to help those lost sheep know that they now
have more choices.
> Karen
>
> On Sat, 5 Jun 2010, Allison Manzino wrote:
>
>> Wow,
>>
>> That is just amazing. I thought Freedom would have gone under a long
time ago given their high prices and lack of tech support at least in my
opinion. I think that people are tired of paying $1500 for a screen reader. I
use Window-Eyes that is currently being paid off via a payment plan. But Jaws
kept crashing on me after version 6. I hope they will get someone to take the
project over, since I know that windows users outnumber Mac. If I remember
correctly, and this was way back in the late nineties I believe, JFW used to be
owned by Henter Joyce. They also own Blazie I think. I think this might finally
level the playing field for all of us. I don't have anything against Freedom, I
just want technology to be accessible and affordable for everyone.
>>
>> Allison
>>
>> On Jun 5, 2010, at 2:07 PM, Teresa Cochran wrote:
>>
>>> Well, it strikes me as being at the rumor and discussion level as of
yet, but I wouldn't be surprised to see FS move in that direction. Personally,
I won't be getting any more JAWS upgrades, and I'm perfectly happy with the Mac
and Alex. :)
>>>
>>> Teresa
>>> On Jun 5, 2010, at 9:42 AM, Kawal Gucukoglu wrote:
>>>
>>>> Off topic, but I feel everyone will be interested especially those
people who run Fusion on their Macs.
>>>>
>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>
>>>>> From: "Ibrahim Gucukoglu" <ibrahim_gucuko...@sent.com>
>>>>> Date: June 5, 2010 9:36:33 AM GMT+01:00
>>>>> To: "Kawal Gucukoglu" <kawal_gucuko...@sent.com>
>>>>> Subject: Fw: [bcab] End of Freedom?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colin r. Howard" <co...@pobox.com>
>>>>> To: <b...@freelists.org>; <access...@freelists.org>;
<av...@googlegroups.com>; <ntexpr...@googlegroups.com>; <jaws...@freelists.org>
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, June 05, 2010 1:30 AM
>>>>> Subject: [bcab] End of Freedom?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Greetings,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am posting the main text from a thread just seen on the Blind
Audio List
>>>>>> which I am surprised not to have seen on the BCAB or AccessUK groups.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ought we to give much credence to this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I, for one, would welcome any comments from Sight and Sound.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: "Otto Zamora" <donttreado...@bellsouth.net>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 05:44:14 -0400
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Morning,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In an advocate meeting yesterday, the subject came up reference
Freedom
>>>>>> Scientific, the company that among other things sports JFw.
>>>>>> Because the company is in the state of Florida, it came up on a
flag by an
>>>>>> analyst.
>>>>>> Seems this company is having bad money troubles, not surprising
given the
>>>>>> economy, but talk is that they are now looking to sell off some of
their
>>>>>> division, mainly their JFW area.
>>>>>> I am not sure who if anyone will buy this division, considering that
there
>>>>>> is an entity now selling a fully integrated package for only $700.
>>>>>> Besides a comprehensive screen reader, if the user chooses to get the
>>>>>> package, there is a browser, along with a customed and fully
accessible web
>>>>>> sites, word processing, and E mail.
>>>>>> all of this can apparently be accessed either on line, or as
individual
>>>>>> program.
>>>>>> ad to that, the entertainment mogill, and you have a powerful tool
indeed
>>>>>> for the kind of money they are asking for.
>>>>>> Another side of the equation is the apple company, now selling
computers
>>>>>> already with speech on board right out of the box and off the shelf.
>>>>>> Put these two aspects together, and you have a deadly combo that
might very
>>>>>> well result in a abrupt end to the JFW program.
>>>>>> Considering the way that technology is growing, older versions of
JFW, will
>>>>>> only work for a short while until the programs controlling the OS,
begins to
>>>>>> outgrow the application.
>>>>>> In seeing this package, one of the things which was pointed out to
me, was
>>>>>> the learning curve, which for the new package being sold by Mr..
Mike Calvo,
>>>>>> is very short.
>>>>>> The user has the option to learn as little or as much as they want
without
>>>>>> real loss. From: "Alison Trelfa" <codamu...@uwclub.net>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 15:36:47 +0100
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, Otto,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wonder whether many jaws users would move to another speech
program as yet
>>>>>> as many of the packages that are not standard probably wouldn't be
supported
>>>>>> by the out of the box speech. I run Sonar and Sibelius 5.25, both of
which
>>>>>> are using scripts that have been written by folk who specialise not
only in
>>>>>> Jaws, but only in the two programs. I suppose those people who only
need
>>>>>> computers for basic commands may well get away with speech such as
you
>>>>>> describe, but I don't think that Jaws would just be dismissed out of
hand
>>>>>> because Freedom is going. I think Jaws has changed hands once before
if I'm
>>>>>> not mistaken? Correct me if I'm wrong there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would be very sorry to see Jaws go under, but I'm not worried yet.
There
>>>>>> is a huge following for Jaws and I believe that someone would take
it over.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: "Otto Zamora" <donttreado...@bellsouth.net>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 10:49:36 -0400
>>>>>>
>>>>>> hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are correct, I am just stating that from what we were told, they
are
>>>>>> having a hard time finding someone who will take on the
project,especially
>>>>>> since as you point out, most people are not using anything that is
high
>>>>>> end, and from what we also have heard, people are tired of having to
pay
>>>>>> $1500 and change, when there now is a program which will do speech
and more
>>>>>> for only $700.
>>>>>> Given the economy, for many people, the sedition may be financial.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: Geoff Long <ge...@tisab.demon.co.uk>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2010 16:20:04 +0100
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Alison, I wonder how many JAWS users have to
>>>>>> pay for their own equipment. I use window-eyes,
>>>>>> which is considerably less expensive, and as I
>>>>>> had to pay for my training and kit from my own
>>>>>> pocket, it makes a big difference.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: "Dr Norman Waddington" <normanwaddington...@btinternet.com>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 16:36:22 +0100
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Geoff,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I need no introduction to you on this list.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am a Jaws user and have paid all the way through out of my own
pocket from
>>>>>> version 3.5 methinks if I remember correctly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: Anders Holmberg <and...@pipkrokodil.se>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2010 17:37:37 +0200
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello!
>>>>>> Also we have nvda as a very good and free alternative.
>>>>>> And Hal or supernova which costs less money than jaws.
>>>>>> From: "Mike Stewart" <stewar...@verizon.net>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2010 10:58:45 -0600
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The entry price is steep, but upgrades only run about $100-$140 or
so...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: "Alison Trelfa" <codamu...@uwclub.net>
>>>>>> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 21:31:33 +0100
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi, Geoff,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is expensive to get jaws I agree with that. The problem I have is
that
>>>>>> there are no other programs that support the music side as far as I
know. If
>>>>>> all programs worked as well as microsoft office or outlook express
then I
>>>>>> think Jaws would really be struggling. Most of the other programs
that I
>>>>>> know of don't support many programs apart from the basics.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From Colin Howard, for whom a small place near Southampton in
>>>>>> Southern England, has the honour of providing a home.
>>>>>> To find out more about BCAB and the benefits that membership can
bring, please visit our website:
>>>>>> http://www.bcab.org.uk/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To manage your subscription to the BCAB mailing list, please visit
our website:
>>>>>> http://www.bcab.org.uk/mailing-list.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To discuss matters relating to the mailing list, please email
bcab-moderat...@freelists.org
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ____
>>>> Kawal Gucukoglu
>>>>
>>>> (E-mail/MSN):
>>>>
>>>> kawal_gucuko...@sent.com
>>>>
>>>> (Skype ID):
>>>>
>>>> kawalgucukoglu
>>>>
>>>> (Mobile/Text):
>>>>
>>>> +447905618396
>>>>
>>>> --
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>>>>
>>>
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