what is he doing these days? any one know? On Aug 14, 2009, at 7:08 AM, Daniel Crone wrote:
> > I remember the early jaws days. I knew that Ted Henter and all the > people there really gave their all. Seems that when a company is > small, it is easy for it to keep its focus. > On Aug 14, 2009, at 5:56 AM, Chris Hofstader wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I couldn't agree with you more as regards Apple and its efforts >> toward universal access. >> >> I understand the feeling you must have when the kid went off to >> school with a new talking iPod as, when I worked at HJ/FS, i was >> well aware that every new copy of JAWS that went out the door >> probably meant that someone got a job, is starting in college or >> furthering their scholastic life with a good tool. This was pounded >> into our heads by Ted Henter to whom every customer was special. >> Things became less satisfying in the FS days as, when Ted was in >> charge, he would virtually shut down the software engineering >> department until we fixed a bug or two for a single customer who had >> trouble doing his job. Now it's all about monthly/quarterly revenue >> figures than about the end user. It's sad but I neither own the >> company nor do I work there anymore. >> >> >> As regards other companies who make somewhat accessible items, the >> community should reward them in proportion to the number of features >> we can use versus those we cannot. If a product is 25% accessible >> for people with vision impairment, then we should give them a 25% >> pat on the back while handing them a list of the 75% of the features >> that they need to improve. >> >> Often, especially on iPhone and Windows Mobile, a program will be >> accessible, at least in part, because the API gives a lot of >> automatic accessibility so some of the software out there will b >> usable by default. I think the authors of such software should be >> contacted and applauded even if they didn't know they made an >> accessible application as it may help convince them to work with the >> community in the future to ensure their accessibility continues. >> >> Some companies or groups within a company are virtually hostile to >> our requests for accessibility. I have found that the entire >> product line from Intuit works very poorly with any and all screen >> readers but no matter how many emails and phone calls later, they >> refuse to give the screen reader authors even the tiniest crumb. >> Intuit and companies like it may require the stick as all of the >> carrots we've supplied were spit back out. >> >> cdh >> >> >> >> On Aug 13, 2009, at 12:07 PM, patrickneazer wrote: >> >>> Hello Chris and all: >>> >>> Yes, I am a fan of more carrots and less stick if possible. Sticks >>> are easy to make though I do not know anyone who enjoys being hit >>> by one no matter how worthy or just the cause (grin). >>> >>> The best way to accomplish what is desired is to reward apple for >>> their innovation with both financial and public support. >>> >>> As a trainer there is nothing cooler than showing a parent a >>> talking ipod, having them purchase one for their child, having the >>> child take it to school and the child being queen or king for the >>> day and possibly longer (grin). >>> >>> That is priceless and customer loyalty will be established forever >>> (grin). >>> >>> And just think, people thought it just played music (grin). >>> On Aug 13, 2009, at 10:01 AM, Chris Blouch wrote: >>> >>>> It would also be nice, albeit unmeasurable, that Apple would be >>>> rewarded for implementing universal design. I could then point to >>>> it as an example of what happens when a company does things right. >>>> I have lots of examples of when companies do things wrong (Target, >>>> PriceLine, Ramada and recently CVS). I'd like more carrot and less >>>> stick when I do presentations to developers or at conferences. >>>> >>>> CB >>>> >>>> Chris Hofstader wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hello Chris the Other, >>>>> >>>>> I agree with your thoughts on universal design. Six or seven >>>>> years ago we found that a lot of rehab counselors were >>>>> downloading daily content from audible.com and listening on a PAC >>>>> Mate as they went from client to client in their cars. this, I >>>>> suppose, was a bit of accidental universal design. >>>>> >>>>> Apple seems to have really figured it out in the iPod Shuffle >>>>> where the product can be used by almost everyone straight out of >>>>> the box and no features are inaccessible to any portion of a >>>>> large universe of potential users. >>>>> >>>>> I hope that Apple's leadership on this front will drag along >>>>> other mainstream players and that we'll start to see the >>>>> blinkosphere expand along with the universe. >>>>> >>>>> cdh >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Aug 12, 2009, at 11:40 AM, Chris Blouch wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> With most mainstream popular products there is huge value in not >>>>>> only the thing itself but in the universe that surrounds it. The >>>>>> iPod being a case in point. There are jillions of add ons and >>>>>> public shared community knowledge which extending the value and >>>>>> uses far beyond what maker originally envisioned. This is the >>>>>> mainstream or universal access argument. If you can simply make >>>>>> an existing thing accessible you get the universe that goes with >>>>>> it for free. The VictorReader Stream may be a fine product, but >>>>>> being a niche product it will never have the vast array of >>>>>> cases, docking stations, FM tuners, chargers etc. Adding a >>>>>> screen reader to a PC is another big example which connected >>>>>> another audience to a large existing universe of tools. >>>>>> >>>>>> One of my favorite authors was Isaac Asimov who wrote a lot >>>>>> about robots, including some basic tenants about behavior and >>>>>> form. He postulated that they would have to be human form to >>>>>> work with the universe of existing devices and objects that were >>>>>> designed for our use. To make a robot that could only interface >>>>>> with special robot tools was doomed to failure in the long run. >>>>>> I think this idea can have application in accessible technology. >>>>>> Creating helper devices (tools) that work for all folks, not >>>>>> just blind, deaf, low cognition, ambulatory or whatever will >>>>>> bring the greatest long term success. >>>>>> >>>>>> Of course everybody's favorite example of universal design is >>>>>> curb cuts which not only make places wheelchair accessible but >>>>>> are also great for baby strollers and shopping carts. I even >>>>>> know one guy who uses Voiceover on his laptop read off long >>>>>> reports while he is driving to work. Why not? Universal design >>>>>> goes both ways and I'm sure he wouldn't have sprung for Jaws >>>>>> just to do that. >>>>>> >>>>>> CB >>>>>> >>>>>> Chris Hofstader wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No! If we expect mainstream companies, like Apple for >>>>>>> instance, to follow the philosophy of universal design, then we >>>>>>> need to make sure they know how they can improve for our >>>>>>> segment of the universe. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> With Apple, we compared VO to JAWS; iPod to Zen Stone and >>>>>>> Victor Stream and iPhone to Mobile Speak on the AT side and the >>>>>>> LG with its built in "accessibility." >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As there is a universe of products, we need to measure them >>>>>>> against each other. Navigon, in my opinion, has a number of >>>>>>> things it does much better than the AT solutions (will show up >>>>>>> in a blog entry soon) but Mobile Speak does some other things >>>>>>> better. For instance, if one wants to use an iPhone, Navigon >>>>>>> is just about the only solution. It also costs a whole lot >>>>>>> less and, in my opinion, is vastly more precise. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> All technology needs to be compared on a reasonably level set >>>>>>> of criteria applied to all solutions, mainstream or blind guy >>>>>>> ghetto. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> cdh >>>>>>> On Aug 12, 2009, at 7:19 AM, patrickneazer wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello Krister and all: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I would have just written I agree in this message though that >>>>>>>> would chew up unnecessary bandwidth and not really explain >>>>>>>> anything and no I am not taking a shop at the moderators with >>>>>>>> that statement because I actually agree with the policy. I am >>>>>>>> not usually a get it off my chester though ... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I do believe that when critiques are made against mainstream >>>>>>>> products and the evaluative measure for the critique is how it >>>>>>>> measures up to a community specific product, that is like >>>>>>>> comparing apples to oranges. What it also does is defeat the >>>>>>>> purpose of mainstream developers wanting to make things >>>>>>>> accessible. Why go out and make things accessible when what >>>>>>>> seems to be wanted is a blind specific product that already >>>>>>>> exists for $70. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I personally am tired of the argument that navigon is good for >>>>>>>> the $70. Navigon is a good app that actually is accessible. >>>>>>>> Now, I and others might have to access the information in a >>>>>>>> manner which is new or initially uncomfortable though that >>>>>>>> does not make the product inaccessible or poorly designed. >>>>>>>> What it does make the product is open to individual >>>>>>>> evaluation.In short, it is perfectly acceptable for a product >>>>>>>> to fit one persons needs, not fit a second persons needs, and >>>>>>>> still be both a good product which can always be improved. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Opened myself up for trouble (grin). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Aug 12, 2009, at 5:12 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Ok, Il moderatore, i know this is off-topic somewhat but i as >>>>>>>>> they say >>>>>>>>> in online business promoting mails, have to get it out of my >>>>>>>>> chest >>>>>>>>> before i explode! I think it's a bit unfair to compare >>>>>>>>> standard gps >>>>>>>>> solutions with those made strictly for blind folks and if >>>>>>>>> Navigon as a >>>>>>>>> standard gps solution makes a very good job of helping us >>>>>>>>> around the >>>>>>>>> place, it's great! What really would've been great would be >>>>>>>>> if someone >>>>>>>>> could do a podcast of a navigon session so that one may here >>>>>>>>> it in >>>>>>>>> action, rather like people have done with Wayfinder access >>>>>>>>> and Mobile >>>>>>>>> geo. >>>>>>>>> /Krister >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> 11 aug 2009 kl. 14.10 skrev Chris G: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>> FYI Humanware Trekker is not using the Sendero SDK. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Chris >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 10:01:26 +0100 >>>>>>>>>> william lomas <lomaswill...@googlemail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> what will the update in december contain for navigon? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 10 Aug 2009, at 18:50, Chris Hofstader wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> EI don't do podcasts. I will write some blog entries on >>>>>>>>>>>> this stuff >>>>>>>>>>>> soon (www.blindconfidential.blogspot.com). >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Of those available to blinks, Wayfinder is the one I know >>>>>>>>>>>> the least >>>>>>>>>>>> about as I only used it for a month or so about a year >>>>>>>>>>>> ago. Almost >>>>>>>>>>>> all of the players in the AT biz are using the same >>>>>>>>>>>> Sendero engine. >>>>>>>>>>>> So, Humanware, Nuance, Freedom Scientific, Code Factory >>>>>>>>>>>> are all >>>>>>>>>>>> about >>>>>>>>>>>> the same underneath but have different UI that one can >>>>>>>>>>>> pick from. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Just based on my minimal experience with Navigon, though, >>>>>>>>>>>> I would >>>>>>>>>>>> suggest you stick with Wayfinder/Access until they put out >>>>>>>>>>>> an update >>>>>>>>>>>> expected in December. Navigon is fine if you don't >>>>>>>>>>>> already have >>>>>>>>>>>> something but I wouldn't scrap your current solution quite >>>>>>>>>>>> yet. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> These opinions are mine and mine alone and are the result >>>>>>>>>>>> of messing >>>>>>>>>>>> around with Navigon for less than two days and I've been >>>>>>>>>>>> using >>>>>>>>>>>> Mobile >>>>>>>>>>>> Geo very frequently since it came out and it is my >>>>>>>>>>>> favorite but that >>>>>>>>>>>> is likely because it is the one with which I'm most >>>>>>>>>>>> familiar. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> cdh >>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:40 AM, william lomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> can you do a podcast on navigon so ican hear it? at >>>>>>>>>>>>> present i am a >>>>>>>>>>>>> wayfinder user and want to "hear" how it compares >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 10 Aug 2009, at 14:09, Chris Hofstader wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> While I have had and enjoyed my iPhone for about a month >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> half, I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> hadn't, before yesterday, needed to switch between >>>>>>>>>>>>>> running tasks. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Specifically, I was following directions to our local >>>>>>>>>>>>>> YWCA using >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Navigon yesterday. I received a phone call and, after >>>>>>>>>>>>>> hanging >>>>>>>>>>>>>> up, I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> couldn't figure out how to get back to Navigon to look >>>>>>>>>>>>>> at some >>>>>>>>>>>>>> things. Navigon continued giving me directions but I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> could not >>>>>>>>>>>>>> get >>>>>>>>>>>>>> back to its interface where VoiceOver reads the street >>>>>>>>>>>>>> names and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> such. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I looked in the iPhone manual and searched on "task >>>>>>>>>>>>>> switching" and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "background task" using VO's search facility as well as >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the one in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Preview and didn't find anything. I can't believe that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> this would >>>>>>>>>>>>>> be >>>>>>>>>>>>>> too difficult but I can't find it in the manual given >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the search >>>>>>>>>>>>>> criteria I can think up. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Any help will be appreciated. I'm going back into the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> manual to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> see >>>>>>>>>>>>>> what I might be able to find. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Happy Hacking, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> cdh >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Chris G <cgrabowsk...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Take good care and I wish you enough. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Love >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Me >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Take good care and I wish you enough. >>> >>> Love >>> >>> Me >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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