Do we have a process or workflow for proposing changes to the roadmap? A number of the things from the V5 roadmap didn't happen, so it might make sense to move some things around to V6 (and possibly a V5.1) roadmaps
-Jon On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 9:12 AM, Wayne Stambaugh <stambau...@gmail.com> wrote: > Jon, > > The v6 road map is here: > > http://docs.kicad-pcb.org/doxygen/v6_road_map.html > > I was planning on working on the schematic object but I wouldn't be > offended if you want to implement it. If you do decide to work on this, > please keep me in the loop. I have some things that I definitely want > implemented as part of this object most of which you have probably > already run into with your connectivity work. > > Cheers, > > Wayne > > > On 3/4/2018 3:07 PM, Jon Evans wrote: > > We should probably make some kind of road map if it doesn't exist > > already, concerning the path to GAL for eeschema and who will be doing > > what. For example, it might make sense to do the SCHEMATIC class > > refactoring you were talking about before or in parallel with parts of > > the porting effort. > > > > I'm up for working on this too, as soon as my connectivity / bus stuff > > has landed. > > > > -Jon > > > > On Sun, Mar 4, 2018, 14:46 Wayne Stambaugh <stambau...@gmail.com > > <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > > I agree. If it's not an easy straight forward fix, I would prefer to > > spend our precious manpower resources on the GAL port as well. I > don't > > know when in the v6 cycle any of this will happen but I'm guessing it > > will happen fairly early. Tom or Orson, do either of you have any > idea > > when this will happen? > > > > Wayne > > > > On 03/04/2018 02:40 PM, Jon Evans wrote: > > > FWIW, I don't find the existing performance to be unusable, it's > just > > > not up to the standards of PcbNew/GAL. I don't think it's worth > any > > > effort beyond easy fixes, we should put that energy into the GAL > > port. > > > > > > -Jon > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 4, 2018, 14:34 Bernhard Stegmaier > > <stegma...@sw-systems.de <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de> > > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>> > > wrote: > > > > > > I would judge it wrt eeschema GAL conversion. > > > If that starts with v6, I don’t know if it is worth the effort. > > > If it is unsure when this will happen, it might be worth it. > > > > > > > > >> On 4. Mar 2018, at 20:30, Wayne Stambaugh > > <stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com> > > >> <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>> > > wrote: > > >> > > >> Ughh! I don't have a good answer for this one. My best > guess is > > >> to fix > > >> the wx macos code first and see what performance issues are > > left. The > > >> problem with messing with any of this is that if you break > > >> something it > > >> will break all of the legacy canvas rendering not just the > > schematic > > >> editor. I would move extremely carefully here. I would > prefer > > >> that we > > >> don't go too crazy this late in the v5 release cycle. If the > > >> performance is truly not usable on macos, then we may have no > > choice. > > >> > > >> On 03/04/2018 02:07 PM, Jeff Young wrote: > > >>> It turns out the fonts aren’t really the problem. > > >>> > > >>> It starts with this gem in wxWidgets: > > >>> > > >>> > > voidwxWidgetCocoaImpl::ScrollRect(constwxRect*rect,intdx,intdy) > > >>> > > >>> { > > >>> > > >>> #if1 > > >>> > > >>> SetNeedsDisplay(); > > >>> > > >>> #else > > >>> > > >>> //Weshoulddosomethinglikethis,butitwasn'tworkingin10.4. > > >>> > > >>> if(GetNeedsDisplay()) > > >>> > > >>> { > > >>> > > >>> SetNeedsDisplay() ; > > >>> > > >>> } > > >>> > > >>> NSRectr=wxToNSRect([m_osxViewsuperview],*rect); > > >>> > > >>> NSSizeoffset=NSMakeSize((float)dx,(float)dy); > > >>> > > >>> [m_osxViewscrollRect:rby:offset]; > > >>> > > >>> #endif > > >>> > > >>> } > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> SetNeedsDisplay() with no rectangle argument invalidates the > > >>> entire window. > > >>> > > >>> Even if you fix that (to scroll most of the window and only > > >>> invalidate > > >>> the newly-exposed parts), you run into this: > > >>> > > >>> > > voidwxWidgetCocoaImpl::drawRect(void*rect, > WXWidgetslf,void*WXUNUSED(_cmd)) > > >>> > > >>> { > > >>> > > >>> //preparingtheupdateregion > > >>> > > >>> wxRegionupdateRgn; > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > //sinceaddingmanyrectstoaregionisacostlyprocess, > bydefaultusetheboundingrect > > >>> > > >>> #if0 > > >>> > > >>> constNSRect*rects; > > >>> > > >>> NSIntegercount; > > >>> > > >>> [slfgetRectsBeingDrawn:&rectscount:&count]; > > >>> > > >>> for(inti=0;i<count;++i) > > >>> > > >>> { > > >>> > > >>> updateRgn.Union(wxFromNSRect(slf,rects[i])); > > >>> > > >>> } > > >>> > > >>> #else > > >>> > > >>> updateRgn.Union(wxFromNSRect(slf,*(NSRect*)rect)); > > >>> > > >>> #endif > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> …which will /also/ cause the whole window to be repainted if > > there’s > > >>> both an invalidated horizontal strip and a vertical one. > > >>> > > >>> And the latter turns out to be pretty much guaranteed by this > > >>> one, which > > >>> batches repaints: > > >>> > > >>> voidwxNonOwnedWindow::Update() > > >>> > > >>> { > > >>> > > >>> if(clock()-s_lastFlush>CLOCKS_PER_SEC/30) > > >>> > > >>> { > > >>> > > >>> s_lastFlush=clock(); > > >>> > > >>> m_nowpeer->Update(); > > >>> > > >>> } > > >>> > > >>> } > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> But even Kicad isn’t blameless. Once you fix all those > there’s > > >>> still no > > >>> checking in SCH_SCREEN::Draw() to see if the individual draw > > items > > >>> intersect the update region. (Sure, the actually drawing is > > >>> clipped in > > >>> the end, but you still go through a /lot/ of code to get > there.) > > >>> > > >>> All of these are fixable, and we’ve already crossed the > > Rubicon of > > >>> having our own OSX wxWidgets branch. > > >>> > > >>> But it’s still a reasonable amount of work, with a > > non-trivial risk > > >>> profile. Should I continue? > > >>> > > >>> Cheers, > > >>> Jeff. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>>> On 4 Mar 2018, at 01:30, Bernhard Stegmaier > > >>>> <stegma...@sw-systems.de <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de> > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>> > > >>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>> wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>> No. > > >>>> > > >>>>> On 4. Mar 2018, at 01:51, Andrey Kuznetsov > > <kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>> > > wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Would it be an easy fix to change the text/font such that > it > > >>>>> does not > > >>>>> affect performance so significantly on MacOS? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On Sat, Mar 3, 2018 at 5:20 AM, Wayne Stambaugh > > >>>>> <stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com> > > <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com > > <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On 03/03/2018 07:33 AM, Jeff Young wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Hi Andrey, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I did some profiling and I’d guess that the > > difference in > > >>>>> eeschema and pcbnew-legacy performance is down to > there > > >>>>> being > > >>>>> more text in the schema. Since we use a stroke > font, > > >>>>> there’s > > >>>>> a lot of stroke segments in each letter. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> @Devs, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I understand why we use a stroke font on the PCB, > but > > >>>>> there’s > > >>>>> not much reason in eeschema, is there? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> This is possibly one of the things that I plan on > > changing after > > >>>>> the new schematic file format is written. The new file > > format > > >>>>> will support font definitions so replacing the stroke > > font in > > >>>>> Eeschema should be doable. Whether or not I have time > > to make > > >>>>> this change remains to be seen. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Wayne > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Cheers, > > >>>>> Jeff. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On 3 Mar 2018, at 08:18, Andrey Kuznetsov > > >>>>> <kandre...@gmail.com <mailto: > kandre...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The motherboard project is not very complex, I > > would say > > >>>>> that performance should be tolerable UP to that > > size > > >>>>> complexity, if we set the bar any lower, > > usability will > > >>>>> suffer and people won't like KiCad because it's > > sluggish > > >>>>> and interface lag is the worst kind of lag. > > >>>>> My project isn't finished and Chris' project is > > >>>>> available > > >>>>> now, is just the right complexity and has layout > > >>>>> that can > > >>>>> be used for testing as well as a schematic. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> *LG 5K 27" display running 3200x1800 (the > highest > > >>>>> resolution without making text blurry, using > > this for > > >>>>> work every day, so it's extravagant, it's > > practical)* > > >>>>> > > >>>>> *Actions:* pan with middle mouse, zoom back and > > forth. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> *eeschema:* > > >>>>> Low Res - at least 2 times slower than would be > > >>>>> considered normal, I would have to guess ~400ms > lag > > >>>>> Normal - 4-5x slower compared to low res mode > > >>>>> ~1700ms lag > > >>>>> Even in low res mode, and removing 75% of the > > items from > > >>>>> Chris' schematic, the lag is still ~200-300ms, > > that's > > >>>>> just not right. Additionally, I filed > > >>>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1753054 > > >>>>> <https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1753054> > > because > > >>>>> the mouse zoom is screwed up in eeschema, > > coupled with > > >>>>> the lag, it's unusable. Maybe the pan lag is > > related to > > >>>>> the zoom, maybe there are multiple steps being > > rendered > > >>>>> when it should just jump to where the mouse > > ended up at, > > >>>>> I don't know. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> *pcbnew - **Normal Resolution:* > > >>>>> Accelerated: No-AA, <50ms > > >>>>> Fallback: 500-1000ms for panning, 300-600ms for > > zoom > > >>>>> Legacy: 1300-1700ms for panning, 600ms for zoom > > >>>>> Low Res mode: did not notice speed increase, > except > > >>>>> maybe > > >>>>> Fallback was ~400ms faster. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I'm not saying halt the horses, certain modes > are > > >>>>> obviously limited, ie Legacy and Fallback by > > the nature > > >>>>> of the task presented, but eeschema is barely > > displaying > > >>>>> 10% of the content pcbnew is but lagging so > > much worse! > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Just thought I'd include rendering of the > > Accelerated > > >>>>> Graphics (top to bottom: Supersampling 4x, > > Subpixel AA > > >>>>> (Ultra Quality), No AA) > > >>>>> All 3 modes are responsive, probably <50-100ms > > lag, I'd > > >>>>> consider this performance great, considering > > the amount > > >>>>> of elements on screen. > > >>>>> <image.png> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> How long should it take to delete this many > > selected > > >>>>> elements in pcbnew? > > >>>>> Answer: about 50x too long! I think it was like > > 3mins, > > >>>>> perhaps ESC key should be available to press > > anytime to > > >>>>> undo the delete action and restore to > > pre-delete screen > > >>>>> when accidental actions are triggered that take > > forever > > >>>>> to complete? > > >>>>> <image.png> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 9:53 AM, Bernhard > Stegmaier > > >>>>> <stegma...@sw-systems.de > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de> > > >>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>> > > >>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de> > > >>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de > > <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Hi, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> to be honest, I don’t really know what this > is > > >>>>> about. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> @Andrey: > > >>>>> You looked for a very complex (foreign) > project > > >>>>> (Chris mainboard?) > > >>>>> to prove that eeschema is slow on Mac? > > >>>>> Well, we know that and we told you already > some > > >>>>> weeks/months ago > > >>>>> why it is like it is (if memory serves me > > right). > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Or, do you have an own project that is so > > >>>>> ridiculously slow, that > > >>>>> you can’t work with it? > > >>>>> If so, please provide it so that we can > > analyse why > > >>>>> this specific > > >>>>> project behaves like that. > > >>>>> If you can’t or don’t want to provide it we > > could > > >>>>> tell you how to > > >>>>> do some performance measurements so that we > > >>>>> might see > > >>>>> something. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Obviously, there are a number of Mac users > > here and > > >>>>> also over at > > >>>>> the KiCad forum who might also be happy to > get > > >>>>> some more > > >>>>> performance here and there, but who are in > > general > > >>>>> reasonably able > > >>>>> to work on their projects (including > > myself, on a > > >>>>> 2012 Retina > > >>>>> MacBook with only an i5). > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Regards, > > >>>>> Bernhard > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > On 2. Mar 2018, at 17:59, Andy Peters > > >>>>> <de...@latke.net <mailto:de...@latke.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:de...@latke.net > > <mailto:de...@latke.net>> <mailto:de...@latke.net > > <mailto:de...@latke.net>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> <mailto:de...@latke.net > > <mailto:de...@latke.net> <mailto:de...@latke.net > > <mailto:de...@latke.net>>>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> >> On Mar 1, 2018, at 8:53 PM, Seth > Hillbrand > > >>>>> <seth.hillbr...@gmail.com > > <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com > > <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com > > <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com > > <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com > > <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>>>> wrote: > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> Andrey- > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> I'm moving this to a new thread so that > > we don't > > >>>>> conflate the > > >>>>> OpenMP discussion with this. > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> Can you test running Kicad with the > > "Open in Low > > >>>>> Resolution" > > >>>>> mode enabled? You can activate this by > > choosing > > >>>>> "Get > > >>>>> Info" on the > > >>>>> main KiCad application and checking the > > option that > > >>>>> says "Open in > > >>>>> Low Resolution". You may need to do the > same > > >>>>> for the > > >>>>> other > > >>>>> applications (Eeschema, pcbnew, etc) as > well. > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > testing on my 2017” touch-bar MBP … > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > Good g-d, low-res mode looks fuzzy and > weird! > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > I don’t notice any specific differences in > > >>>>> EESchema > > >>>>> performance. > > >>>>> Maybe my schematic isn’t busy enough? I’m a > > fan of > > >>>>> using more > > >>>>> smaller sheets with less info on each than > > one big > > >>>>> sheet with > > >>>>> everything. > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > I know, anecdote is not evidence. > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > -a > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> -Seth > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> 2018-03-01 18:09 GMT-08:00 Andrey > > Kuznetsov > > >>>>> <kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>>>: > > >>>>> >> Hi, > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> So for now I've had a chance to test the > > >>>>> motherboard project on > > >>>>> my Retina macbook display. > > >>>>> >> eeschema: horrible zoom, feels like > > elastic band > > >>>>> zoom and I > > >>>>> have all scroll wheel accelerations and > similar > > >>>>> disabled, zoom > > >>>>> response is super laggy, cannot work like > > this, will > > >>>>> need to make > > >>>>> schematics on windows. > > >>>>> >> pcbnew by order of slowness: > > >>>>> >> legacy - pretty slow, zoom lag is major, > > boo boo > > >>>>> >> modern (fallback) - decent, but the lag > > can be > > >>>>> felt, zoom lag > > >>>>> is minor > > >>>>> >> modern (accelerated) - almost cannot > > feel the > > >>>>> lag, > > >>>>> very nice, > > >>>>> nice zoom responsiveness > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> >> I'll report tomorrow on 5K LG display. > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> > Mailing list: > > >>>>> https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>> > > >>>>> > Post to > > >>>>> : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>>> > > >>>>> > Unsubscribe : > > >>>>> https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>> > > >>>>> > More help > > : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp> > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ______________________________ > _________________ > > >>>>> Mailing > > >>>>> list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>> > > >>>>> Post to > > >>>>> : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>>> > > >>>>> Unsubscribe > > >>>>> : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>> > > >>>>> More help > > : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp> > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> -- > > >>>>> Remember The Past, Live The Present, Change The > > Future > > >>>>> Those who look only to the past or the present > are > > >>>>> certain to miss the future [JFK] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>> > > >>>>> Live Long and Prosper, > > >>>>> Andrey > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> Mailing > > list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> Post to > > : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>>> > > >>>>> Unsubscribe > > : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad. > net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ > kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ > kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers> > > >>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>>> <https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> -- > > >>>>> Remember The Past, Live The Present, Change The Future > > >>>>> Those who look only to the past or the present are certain > > to miss > > >>>>> the future [JFK] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> > > >>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com > > <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> > > >>>>> Live Long and Prosper, > > >>>>> Andrey > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>>> > > >>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > > >>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>> <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > > <mailto:kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > > >>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > > >>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> 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