On Sat, Aug 22, 2015 at 2:10 AM, Anatol Belski <anatol....@belski.net> wrote:
> Hi, > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Anthony Ferrara [mailto:ircmax...@gmail.com] > > Sent: Friday, August 21, 2015 3:37 PM > > To: Scott Arciszewski <sc...@paragonie.com> > > Cc: Pierre Joye <pierre....@gmail.com>; Trevor Suarez <ric...@gmail.com > >; > > Niklas Keller <m...@kelunik.com>; PHP Internals <internals@lists.php.net> > > Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Recap - Core functions throwing exceptions in PHP7 > > > > On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 6:14 AM, Scott Arciszewski <sc...@paragonie.com> > > wrote: > > > On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 3:52 AM, Pierre Joye <pierre....@gmail.com> > wrote: > > >> On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 9:38 AM, Scott Arciszewski < > sc...@paragonie.com> > > wrote: > > >>> On Wed, Aug 19, 2015 at 11:36 AM, Trevor Suarez <ric...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > >>>> Ah, I didn't realize this thread existed. I had just commented on > > >>>> the old one, but the point still stands: > > >>>> > > >>>> PHP 7.0 RC1 was just tagged. > > >>>> Shouldn't this be a relatively high priority to fix/decide so we > > >>>> don't end up with behavior that can't be fixed until PHP 8.0? > > >>>> > > >>>> On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 6:54 PM Niklas Keller <m...@kelunik.com> > wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > Okay, great, we have people on both sides on this discussion. I > > >>>>> > hope nobody minds if I sit this part out. > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > What specifics need to be discussed? Should somebody set up a > > >>>>> > poll? (I don't know how to do that.) > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> You can find information on how to setup a poll in step 6 here: > > >>>>> https://wiki.php.net/rfc/howto > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Regards, Niklas > > >>> > > >>> I agree that this should be a relatively high priority. I'm not sure > > >>> what the next steps would be. (Aside: I still have a PR I need to > > >>> write that I've been holding off on until the fate of PHP 7's CSPRNG > > >>> feature is determined.) > > >>> > > >>> Can we reach some sort of consensus on throw new Exception vs throw > > new Error? > > >> > > >> I think the best would be a RFC, not only for the decision itself but > > >> also to have a clear view about what will be changed or affected. > > >> > > >> Cheers, > > >> -- > > >> Pierre > > >> > > >> @pierrejoye | http://www.libgd.org > > > > > > Fine, let's do this: > > > > > > 1. Violate the feature freeze for this exceptional decision. > > > 2. One of the folks in the camp that WANTS an RFC and a drawn out > > > formal decision-making process opens it with a poll. > > > 3. Give me voting karma. > > > > > > Let's NOT make the CSPRNG feature fail open. That is an absolutely > > > terrible idea. > > > > My proposal/stance: > > > > Let's make random_* throw an Exception if it cannot connect to a random > > source. And let's have it throw an TypeError if ZPP fails, or Error if > min >= max. > > > > The first two are consistent with existing exceptions. > > > > The third (Error if min>max) is where the contention lies. I'm > suggesting Error as > > it's consistent with parameter errors in the sense that the type may be > correct, > > but the value isn't (hence it's the same kind of error as a parameter > error, just a > > different sub-classification. > > > > MHO is this is too important of a distinction to simply gloss over. > > Having it return false (or null) will be a problem, as nobody will > perform the error > > checks. And returning $x where `$x == 0` in a security context could be > incredibly > > bad. As such, I think the security implications here outweigh nearly all > of the > > other concerns about consistency and convention. > > > > That's my opinion. I'll be happy to make the changes if a RM gives me > the green > > light to do so. > > > The change being proposed was discussed once more in the RM circle and is > being seen as inappropriate. > > The CSPRNG RFC and the implementation was voted. The change being proposed > amends the paradigm of the current language behavior. Currently no effort > has been done do discuss and work out the paradigm change. > There has been quite extensive discussion on this topic. Apart from 30 comments on the original PR for this, there are 100 mails across three topics discussing this issue. As far as I can discern, there was a rather clear consensus in these discussions to make the error conditions throw (although this may be confirmation bias speaking). The only point of contention that was left towards the end of the discussion, was which exception specifically should be thrown in one of the cases. This was a bikeshedding concern. All the people who participated in the Exception vs. Error discussion are okay with either choice here, with mild preferences going in different directions. You could flip a coin and nobody would complain about the result. Nobody really cares whether this exception is green or blue. I'm honestly surprised at this decision. I had assumed that the question of whether we throw was already a done matter and we're only talking about the exception type at this point. Nikita
