My phone is being crazy with sending replies :( So if we don't want to use ~ here, I am fine with that. However I do not want this used for full text searching. Your argument is that its "not a natural fit" for use in this nullness checking, but that same argument fits full text searching.
On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 6:17 PM Steve Ebersole <st...@hibernate.org> wrote: > So if we don't want to use ~ here, I am fine with that. However I do not > want this used for full text searching. > > On Sat, Aug 29, 2015, 6:07 PM Sanne Grinovero <sa...@hibernate.org> wrote: > >> I think we all agree that we want at least the high level intent of an >> HQL query to be understandable without having to keep a reference >> sheet of its special symbols at hand. >> >> I would interpret that "~" symbol differently, so I don't think it's >> suited to imply some special meaning related to "null" and while I >> normally understand we argue about "naming things" as we all have >> different language backgrounds, this one seems universally established >> in the scientific world, so I'm afraid that it would look a really odd >> choice to most users. >> >> Gunnar's proposal looks better, as that's commonly used in similar >> scenarios: beyond Groovy, it's commonly used for ternary operator >> which is essentially a short hand for a conditional: >> - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%3F: >> >> On full-text query, looks like a clarification is in order on why I >> was thinking about that symbol specifically: >> A full-text query goes far beyond "containing" some keywords; for >> example it can provide matches on synonyms, disregard typos, expand >> acronyms, or even give different semantic value for words depending on >> their position and role in a sentence. The match is really about >> "search stuff which is semantically similar to this". >> I realize that most SQL technologies provide only a limited subset of >> such options, and that's exactly why we provide alternatives like >> Hibernate Search which do much more and better ;-) >> i.e. with Search such an operator would mean "equals or almost >> equals", for some definition of "almost equals" which we allow the >> user to specify precisely in the mapping and configuration. >> >> Thanks, >> Sanne >> >> On 29 August 2015 at 18:21, Steve Ebersole <st...@hibernate.org> wrote: >> > Sorry, but I agree with Brett. CONTAINS is a much more natural way to >> > perform a full-text search, especially for those coming from SQL. >> > >> > On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 1:47 AM Gunnar Morling <gun...@hibernate.org> >> wrote: >> > >> >> I like the idea of a new operator, but I side with Sanne that "~" >> >> would be useful for similarity/full-text searches. >> >> >> >> What about "?=", somewhat inspired by Groovy's Elvis operator? It >> >> seems nicer to me for expressing null-awareness. The pattern could >> >> even be generalized by using the operator prefix for making some more >> >> comparison operators null-aware: "?<", "?>" etc. >> >> >> >> --Gunnar >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 2015-08-28 16:36 GMT+02:00 Brett Meyer <br...@hibernate.org>: >> >> > +1 to ~. Sanne has a good point, but I think I'd rather see a >> function >> >> > name there (CONTAINS, etc.). >> >> > >> >> > On 08/28/2015 10:09 AM, Sanne Grinovero wrote: >> >> >> On 28 August 2015 at 15:02, Steve Ebersole <st...@hibernate.org> >> wrote: >> >> >>> What do y'all think of using a symbol like ~ for this? The idea >> would >> >> be >> >> >>> similar to the "wavy equals" from logic used to denote >> "approximately >> >> >>> equals". >> >> >> I was hoping that one day we would be able to use the '~' symbol for >> >> >> full-text queries, i.e. a fuzzy match for text fields to extend HQL. >> >> >> But we have no concrete plans about that, and we currently don't do >> a >> >> >> great job in allowing people to combine full-text restrictions with >> >> >> relational restrictions, so that might be an unrealistic dream. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Thu, Aug 27, 2015 at 7:05 AM andrea boriero < >> and...@hibernate.org> >> >> wrote: >> >> >>> >> >> >>>> i like the idea of "matches" operator for dealing with "is null". >> >> >>>> +1 >> >> >>>> >> >> >>>> On 26 August 2015 at 19:32, Steve Ebersole <st...@hibernate.org> >> >> wrote: >> >> >>>> >> >> >>>>> https://hibernate.atlassian.net/browse/SQM-11 >> >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >> >>>>> hibernate-dev mailing list >> >> >>>>> hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> >> >>>>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> >> >>>>> >> >> >>>> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >> >>> hibernate-dev mailing list >> >> >>> hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> >> >>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> hibernate-dev mailing list >> >> >> hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> >> >> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> >> > hibernate-dev mailing list >> >> > hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> >> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> hibernate-dev mailing list >> >> hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> >> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > hibernate-dev mailing list >> > hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> _______________________________________________ >> hibernate-dev mailing list >> hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org >> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev >> > _______________________________________________ hibernate-dev mailing list hibernate-dev@lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev
