Peter Stuge posted on Thu, 09 Aug 2012 14:29:42 +0200 as excerpted: > systemd isn't at all unstable in my experience, the only thing that it > is lacking is experience among administrators.
FWIW, the "unstable" I was referring to wasn't necessarily crashing or refusing to do its init job, but "design unstable" -- continuing to add and change functionality such as logging, where the format is specifically declared to be unstable and subject to change. When all that stuff gets worked out and functionality begins to settle down into predictable, and when an admin can read a systemd log with his choice of tools from a well documented and well supported by multiple tools format... THEN I believe is when gentoo will likely switch to systemd by default, along with most users, altho based on upstream and leading distro predictions, various bits of nice desktop GUI functionality will likely be broken without systemd somewhat before then, so those gentoo desktop users who like their automatic GUI bells and whistles such as automount, etc, may find themselves switching somewhat before that... Which is precisely where crashing-instability may begin to show its ugly head as well, with various desktop users unfortunately not so well prepared to fix things... yes, even on gentoo. Hopefully not, but... > I agree that as long as there is anyone interested in maintaining and > supporting openrc, it will be available in Gentoo. The alternatives and > choice is what makes Gentoo great, and I think this fundamental > principle will never change, no matter what Red Hat or anyone else wants > to do. Hear, hear! =:^) > Don't worry, it will all be fine. While I've little doubt most will ultimately navigate the hazards (tho the process may take years) unfortunately, that sounds WAY too much like what we heard in both the kde4 and gnome3 cases. IOW, at least to folks who have gone thru that, your "reassurances" will likely make many even more sure than they were before, that systemd is an iceberg with users looking like the Titanic! IOW, stay FAR FAR away from it! I know that wasn't your intent, but given recent events on the desktop, and the assurances WAY too much like the above that came before them... > As long as you and I run no systemd maybe it's OK if we still download > it's tarball in order to build and install the udev files. I don't see a problem with that. After all, many packages, especially those from kde's monolithic tarballs, already work that way. But if we have to build systemd as part of the udev build, only to delete it before final qmerge... which appears from what I've read to be the case despite promises that it'll work just as before... (But that angle has been discussed already and other than fork, it seems there's little choice unless upstream changes its mind. And so far, it hasn't seemed enough to actually do that fork, tho the mdev alternative project certainly seems to be getting some traction because someone did actually step up and take responsibility for making it happen But that too has been discussed...) > If you feel > very strongly not OK, after much experience with systemd and udev, then > by all means do fork udev. But I *seriously* don't see the point. Please > choose another project. :) As I said, I think gentoo will eventually default to systemd. But I do hope openrc stays the default until systemd dev-stabilizes quite a bit from its current state. Fortunately, it does seem openrc will remain the gentoo assumed default for at least the near future, anyway, and hopefully by the time that changes, systemd really has reasonably matured and stabilized. Prospects look reasonable so far! =:^) -- Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman
