On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 5:47 PM, sebb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 02/06/2008, Les Hazlewood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> That's just the thing though: >> >> At the end of the day, the vast majority of TLP end users could care less if >> the TLP uses an incubator dependency or not, as long as it is Apache 2.0 >> compatible and easily available (i.e. in the central repo). They trust the >> TLP to do their due diligence to ensure the dependency works as expected >> within the TLP, is tested and has gone through stability sanity checks. The >> 'incubator' name in the release plus maybe a DISCLAIMER or entry in a README >> file is good enough. Anything requiring manual intervention is just a pain >> to deal with for almost everyone. >> >> I feel very strongly the incubator releases should be in the main repo for >> simplicity's sake and to encourage adoption, and that a TLP should be able >> to use its judgment on whether or not to include an incubator dependency - >> they know their project best and will support their community best. >> >> So I'm very much in agreement with 1) allowing incubator releases to go to >> the central repo and 2) allowing TLPs to decide themselves to include an >> incubator dependency or not. >> >> Both Incubator _and_ TLP communities will feel unnecessary burden or >> hindrance otherwise. >> > > Part of the Incubation process is to ensure that there is sufficient > community to maintain the code after incubation. > > Not all incubator projects achieve this. > > It seems a bad idea to allow artefacts into the main repository where > they can become dependencies unless there is some chance that they > will be maintained. > > Yes, there are ASF projects that fall by the wayside too, but that is > not the point.
The more projects use a given podling, the more changes there are that the project will create a good community. And again, it's exactly the same problem when a project use an artifact under ASL or any compatible license which is not hosted at the ASF: if the project is not maintained anymore by its community, the PMC has to decide what to do with it, but it's not related to being an incubating project per se. > >> On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 10:52 AM, sebb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >> > On 02/06/2008, Guillaume Nodet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > > On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 2:53 PM, Brian E. Fox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > wrote: >> > > > >> > > >> > > > 1. Incubator releases go into Central >> > > >> > > >> > > +1 >> > > >> > > I think having the "incubator" or "incubating" word in the version >> > > name brings sufficient awareness to the users. >> > >> > But Maven does not warn about using incubator versions. >> > >> > If you are adding a direct dependency on an incubator version, then >> > the user may understand the significance of the word. Or they may not, >> > depending on whether they understand the jargon correctly. >> > >> > But if the dependency is a transitive one, then the user does not get >> > to know about this (unless they scan the maven log very carefully) >> > >> > > While ServiceMix was in incubation, we had sometime a hard time to >> > > tell our users that being in incubation has nothing to do with the >> > > quality of the code, but rather with IP and mostly community building. >> > > Given we had to explain that, it is clear our users were aware that >> > > the project was still incubating. >> > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > 2. Regular releases cannot use Incubator artifacts >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > Cheers, >> > > Guillaume Nodet >> > > ------------------------ >> > > Blog: http://gnodet.blogspot.com/ >> > > >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > > >> > > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > >> > >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Cheers, Guillaume Nodet ------------------------ Blog: http://gnodet.blogspot.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
