The earliest instances of LLMs apparently did not have this kind of obsequiousness. I remember reading about people getting (I think it was v.1, or beta, of chatGPT) getting crafting long conversations on "dark' topics. One in particular involved the LLM becoming a very convincing, so the story went, Domme. Also, several racist and misogynist rants. The algorithms were very quickly changed to prevent this.
davew On Wed, Aug 14, 2024, at 10:44 AM, steve smith wrote: > Marcus wrote: >> The recent results about AI Models collapsing when trained on recursively >> generated data seems to me to apply to this kind of human political activity >> as well. >> >> https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-024-07566-y > I think the MAGA machine is collapsing under this weight as we speak, and it > may have risen in the wake of the a similar collapse of it's parent > GOP/TeaParty and it's antiChrist Liberal/Progressive ness. >> Btw, is there a disagreeable LLM bot out there? Whenever I chat with LLMs, >> I get a lot of accommodation. > Per "the other thread" here, I believe this design bias was installed to > "enhance coherence" but that it is "ham fisted" and limits what human-LLM > interaction is capable of. > > In my open-ended experiments with LLMs (GPT in particular) I have tried to > steer it away from this as well as trying to renormalize my own response to > that amiability. I don't seek to pick fights with it, but I work hard not to > let it mollify me with flattery or amiability. > > I don't need the sinister "What are you doing Dave?" of HAL but I do get very > tired of it's obsequiousness, it takes work to balance that I could put maybe > more productively in seeking a more genuine "coherence"? > > I hope there is serious work going on there. > > > > >> >> *From: *Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> on behalf of Frank Wimberly >> <wimber...@gmail.com> >> *Date: *Tuesday, August 13, 2024 at 5:40 PM >> *To: *The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <friam@redfish.com> >> *Subject: *[FRIAM] This makes me think of this list... >> >> >> >> >> Are We Living in the Age of Info-Determinism? >> <https://link.newyorker.com/click/36396552.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> >> >> *Increasingly, our networks seem to be steering our history in ways we don’t >> like and can’t control.* >> >> Image removed by sender. Image may contain: Person, Advertisement, Poster, >> and Art >> <https://link.newyorker.com/click/36396552.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> >> >> Illustration by Josie Norton >> <https://link.newyorker.com/click/36396552.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> >> >> *“Call it info-determinism:* the belief that the ways that information flows >> through the world are actually a kind of web in which we’re ensnared,” >> Joshua Rothman writes. The Internet can make it feel as though information >> is endless, and access can make everyone feel like an expert—or, at least, >> an expert subreddit debater. The sense that there is always more to know >> undermines the authority of an article or an institution, as does the >> thriving trade, among those debaters, in the disassembly of ideas. Rothman’s >> column, Open Questions >> <https://link.newyorker.com/click/36396552.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>, >> unpacks open-ended queries each week. Today, he considers: What is >> information? Does it matter if it’s true? Are we trapped? >> >> Read the story >> <https://link.newyorker.com/click/36396552.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> >> >> --- >> Frank C. 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