On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 12:00 AM, MZMcBride <z...@mzmcbride.com> wrote:
> Dan Rosenthal wrote: > > On Feb 16, 2011, at 5:52 PM, Nathan wrote: > >> At some point WMF employees might just stop posting here altogether, > >> to escape the unfounded criticism. > > > It's not about assuming that Wikimedia's positions are "wrong," that's a > bad > and unfair characterization. But Wikimedia has a tendency, as an > organization, to not be as transparent as it sometimes likes to think it > is. > Looking at the long view, more and more decisions _are_ being made > privately > among Wikimedia staff rather than with community consultation (or even > notification). That's the reality, but to blame this shift (and the > resulting skepticism from the community) on foundation-l is a red herring. > > MZMcBride > > > > > I'm not sure I would say it like that (that they would simply stop responding at all) but I worry that the method at which discussion and criticism has developed is encouraging the growth of a culture where goes against the very thing we say we vocally fighting for. This is definitely not just a foundation-l thing and you're right to say it like that is a bit of a red herring and ignores the real issue (we're good at that). It is also something that I think has roots in all of the active aspects of the community (I at the very least see everyone, staff/contributer/reader/donor etc as part of that community) . There is no doubt that there are many things that the foundation, the local arbcoms, the stewards etc could do far better (though while I'm biased I do think there has been improvement on that). So frequently whenever someone opens their mouth they get bitten, regardless of what is happening the tenants of assuming good faith are just thrown out the window. This thread is about when it happens to staff but the same exact thing happens to other community members speak up. We see it with Arbcom members or Stewards, Article writers and anti-vandal fighters. So many people who love the community and truly want what is best for it are met only with skepticism, the assumption of bad faith and the decision that they only way to question is to do so harshly and without mercy. Is that really what we our community wants or needs? While the words that are used espouse the rightful desire (that I think every one of us wants) for transparency, discussion and community input (and decisions) throughout the foundation and the projects I worry that the result we are getting from this style of attack is exactly the opposite. We are breeding a culture where maybe the staff member doesn't stop posting here (or the Arbcom member stop posting decisions or the stewards enforcing them) but where everyone is forced to sit and think and plan the best way to break the news writing and rewriting announcements to try and "spin" it how the rest of the community will want to hear it (or worse how particular people they know will be vocal want to hear it). In the end they still post but they do so with far less transparency, far less discussion and take far longer . I've always found that one of the best ways for me to work is to throw my ideas in to the mix and debate it out with everyone. I end up with a better understanding of what all the variables and issues are and in the end I feel we come up with a better conclusion. The other side, asking everyone to come up with their own idea means they come back in the end having 'decided' on the best course of action. Getting them to deviate from that action is far harder now because they've hashed it all out on their own, they're much more sure and in the end I don't think we get the best conclusion because we don't get to mesh everyone's nearly as well. Maybe this is how I work but I feel like we want a culture where it is perfectly acceptable for someone to respond without all the data, for them to make mistakes and get corrected and have that debate and those arguments. I think we come out all the better for it. But to do that we have to be able to do it in a collegial (sp?) way. I know I want that in a work environment and whether I'm getting paid or not I certainly see the projects as a work environment for us all. James -- James Alexander jameso...@gmail.com _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
