On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 4:34 PM, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]>wrote:
> > > On Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:05:45 AM UTC-4, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote: > >> >> >> > Maybe one day you will have the class to acknowledge that Bruno and comp >> have helped you articulate or conceive of certain things in fresh ways, at >> least. But I wouldn't count on it. PGC >> > > I do acknowledge that I have used my time talking with Bruno and others > here to help articulate and conceive of things. Maybe not as much as I have > learned from Chalmers, Deleuze, Wilber, etc. but so what? Why am I being > held to some weird standard where I am expected to give thanks to my > influences publicly? Why is this something that you have a right to an > opinion on? > You are trying to show merits of MSR here. I can state where I think it has gaps in it, and have extended MSR to MSR + any noun that we like, when it suits our mood or the argument we're in. Has this list become a groupie thing for people who propose models of TOEs? No, so one can still state why something is not plausible or why one finds propositions dubious. If the list's purpose is just to give you good feedback, no matter your propositions, then fine, I stand corrected and will refrain. > > >> >> > Being able to improvise is a different kind of talent than being able to >>> read and interpret music written on a page. >>> >> >> By measure of your own theory of sense experience: do YOU have experience >> in either? >> > > No, nothing to do with my own sense experience. My wife is a flutist and a > flute instructor. She has students. She talks about their progress. Some > have a natural ability to improvise and others do not. Those who can > improvise often have more difficulty with reading music. > Is that controversial for you? Do you deny it? > No Coltrane, Davis, Marsalis, Parker and virtually everybody's work in Jazz denies this: they sight read and improvise at highest level, irrespective of the anecdotal evidence you offer. Same for many contemporary improvisers and composers, too numerous to cite. > What is your accusation about other than the compulsion to attack me > personally? > No accusation, just giving feedback that your points are vacuous, regarding what your realism purports to explain, especially regarding music, aesthetics, feeling, qualia, and related areas that MSR supposedly champions . Why you have to always victimize yourself that this be some personal attack against you, instead of feedback on the work you are trying to strengthen is anybody's guess, so you can answer your own question there. PGC > > >> >> >>> Music theory is different from music performance. >>> >> >> Yes, that's why we use different words, obviously. But from your theory: >> explain why both appear necessary and provide some definition of music >> (what and who is sensing) >> > > Music theory is not necessary. Music performance is necessary. Music > theory is an optional layer of analytical insights that relate to the > broader, but flatter scientific context that musical structures fit into. > Music theory provides no definition of who is sensing, and neither does > performance. In my view 'who' is a nested event within sense. > Fundamentally, sense is not a matter of who, but of 'which' experience > occurs when. > > >> >> We all have different ranges of sensitivity and some people are able to >>> 'hear the music' inside an equation, while others perform incredible >>> mathematical feats just by swinging a tennis racket. >>> >> >> Some people like to fish in muddy waters and sometimes they find gold >> there... They also sometimes tell other people of their "great catch", >> without convincing evidence/explanations. PGC >> > > I have no problem with hanging on to the gold myself. If other people are > interested in finding it, I am happy to oblige, but I am certainly not > obligated to give them a piggy back ride. > > Craig > > >> >> >>> Craig >>> >>> >>>> >>>> I'll now watch the clip you posted! >>>> >>>> Kim >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Kim Jones B. Mus. GDTL >>>> >>>> Email: [email protected] >>>> [email protected] >>>> Mobile: 0450 963 719 >>>> Phone: 02 93894239 >>>> Web: http://www.eportfolio.kmjcommp.com >>>> >>>> >>>> *"Never let your schooling get in the way of your education" - Mark >>>> Twain* >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>> >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
