I'll add, David, I really don't see how else Musk could have done it.
First, I think it's fair to consider the Roadster as Tesla's first mass
produced model. I believe that preceded all other mass produced EVs by a
good margin, except the EV1.
Considering the cost of the battery, especially roughly 20 years ago,
how could Musk have marketed a vehicle oriented to the average consumer
? True, that's the large market that needed (and still needs) to be
satisfied. But he couldn't build that car at a competitive price. So, he
had to market to the affluent who wanted something unique to show off
and have fun with. Adding some walnut trim (or whatever it was), leather
seats, and other fancy stuff was relatively cheap compared to the
battery cost so, volià, a luxury EV. And it sold. Well. Do you think an
expensive car with vinyl trim, cloth seats, no automatic controls, etc.
would have appealed in the same way ?
Peri
<< Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>
------ Original Message ------
From: "paul dove via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
Cc: "paul dove" <dov...@bellsouth.net>; "EV List Lackey"
<evp...@drmm.net>
Sent: 20-Dec-22 06:14:58
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Tesla accepting CCS
Really, how did you get so jaded? It is getting tiresome. Ask yourself how many
automobile startups have you seen in your life that were successful? Nissan,
Mitsubishi and others are established companies who are subsidized by their
governments. Tesla has been fighting and uphill battle. Everyone wants to
punish them when they have been an American company bringing good jobs to
America. The Leaf had battery problems when it came out. The I-MiEV was
discontinued because of lack of sales. Here you are in your armchair trying to
convince us about what the people want.
Electric vehicles were expensive. When the plasma TV came out it was 15,000.
Without rich people as you call them some companies would have never made it
past the first year.
Tesla all by itself changes Americas view of the electric car. It certainly
wasn’t the I-MiEV or the Leaf. The model 3 out sells the Camry.
Sent from AT&T Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Monday, December 19, 2022, 4:16 PM, EV List Lackey via EV
<ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
On 19 Dec 2022 at 20:44, Peri Hartman via EV wrote:
If Elon hadn't started the EV mass production revolution, some one else
surely would have. But it might have been several years later and might
have been to weak the first time around to not be squashed by the ICE
industry.
"Someone else" was already advancing the production EV movement by the time
the model S arrived. The Mitsubishi Imiev and Nissan Leaf were ahead of it,
and IIRC the Renault Zoe (not offered in the US) launched at around the same
time.
Tesla certainly had some innovations that those EVs didn't have. Some were
substantial, but many were just luxury gadgets.
Tesla's primary "innovation" was making an EV that appealed to rich folks,
especially celebrity greens awash in excess cash. Those gadgets and
gimmicks were part of the appeal.
That was easy for Musk to push, because he was already then such an
obscenely rich person.
To this day, Teslas are based not on what research shows the average driver
needs, but on what appeals to Elon Musk. If you don't like what he likes,
tough luck.
That's why I think that despite strong (but declining) Tesla sales, Renault,
Stellantis, and VW will eventually clean Tesla's clock in Europe. They
actually build EVs for normal people - and normal, middle-income Europoeans
are buying them. And despite what all y'all may think, I'm still convinced
that the future success of EVs is mostly in the EU and China, not here in
the US.
David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey
To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it. Use my
offlist address here : http://evdl.org/help/index.html#supt
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tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear
more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of ideas.
-- John Ciardi
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