Hi Ihor, Ihor Radchenko <yanta...@gmail.com> writes:
> To clarify, I did not intend to make you remove those links, but rather > wanted to hear your opinion and open a discussion. Sorry if I seemed to act upon this too hastily. Here is my opinion on the matter. I think we should consider two separate issues: (1) whether the donation mechanism requires users to load non-free Javascript and (2) whether the support mechanism is from an organization that actually supports Free Software maintainers and developers. Paypal is bad on (1) and irrelevant on (2): removing the Paypal link seems like a good move. The amount I receive from paypal (~150€ per year) is not something that can justify promoting Paypal for the ~30K monthly visitors of https://orgmode.org. GitHub Sponsors is bad on (1) and looks better on (2) but it requires donators to use GitHub, something that the GNU project does not want to encourage. If _I_ want to use GitHub Sponsors this is my decision, but a website from the GNU project should not advertize this donation mechanism. Liberapay is apparently not so good on (1) but the source code is under the CC0 license (this choice seems weird but I won't argue about it) and we can contact the developers so that they get better on (1). It seems to me a good solution for (2): it is run by people who care about Free Software developers and maintainers. So, promoting liberapay.com as the *only* donation mechanism seems the best move here. If we give the choice between GitHub Sponsors, Paypal and liberapay.com, donators will take the easy way and liberapay.com will miss opportunities to get more users and supporters. > As Michael pointed out, https://my.fsf.org/donate itself contains a > paypal payment option: > >>> PayPal (not recommended: requires nonfree JavaScript) The FSF is not the GNU project. I think it is good that GNU software maintainers can be more strict about this and avoid Paypal. > The entry barriers are important. From my own experience, compared to > just bank details, some online payment made a difference in my decisions > to donate. Easy and familiar web services really facilitate actual > donations (as well as feedback from new users). I understand. If one day more Org contributors appear on a Worg page where they advertize their need for donations (and I encourage Org contributors to add such a page), I would have no problem with links to donations services that are not aligned with GNU standards. But that's because Worg is a community-driven website, distinct from the official https://orgmode.org page. (As I said, perhaps a dedicated domain name for Worg would be useful.) > I wish there were more easy donation options for an ordinary user to > donate to FSF projects without a need to rely on non-free software. Sure! In the meantime, M-x list-packages RET could advertize ways to support maintainers. GNU ELPA packages would follow GNU standards on what donation services to accept, while NonGNU ELPA and MELPA would probably be less strict. But in general, having the links there would raise awareness about the maintainers need for support (I myself often install GNU and NonGNU ELPA packages without reading the associated website). > I just tried to setup a payment via liberapay using firefox with librejs > extension. I was unable to complete the card payment. See https://github.com/liberapay/liberapay.com/issues/1374 - I think there is room for progress. > But it leaves us with no real option to allow _easy_ > donations yet committing to FSF guidelines. My experience is that increasing donations is less about making it technically easier for potential donators and more about communicating about the need for donations. Which is not easy to do _at all_! >> I guess we shall remove references to non-free software (like the >> Sublime Text editor - I will do this later on.) > > Sounds reasonable. Done. > If we really want to be very strict about following FSF, we might advice > users about alternative ways to view youtube (invidious/youtube-dl). Adding this a notice for Worg would be useful, yes. (There is no youtube.com links on https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/orgweb.) Best, -- Bastien
