I've never tried to live in a foreign country, but when I've traveled to places
where I have already learned some of the language, simple signs are definitely
helpful, but even more helpful are friendly people who figure out I'm not
fluent and choose their own words to help me understand and learn.
My 2 cents,
-Alex
On 5/30/19, 11:45 PM, "Myrle Krantz" <my...@apache.org> wrote:
I do think our focus, with respect to simplifying our language, needs to be
on websites and documentation rather than on mailing list communications.
I’ve been in Germany for nearly 20 years. As such I’ve developed a lot of
habits for speaking with non-Native speakers of English. And I still slip
up on a regular basis.
From the other side, I speak excellent German. But I usually don’t even
bother with the 200 euro question on “Wer wird Millionär?” (Who wants to
be a millionaire?) I just don’t have much chance when we’re talking about
German children’s rhymes and old television shows; I didn’t spend my
childhood here. Things that feel *really* basic to a native speaker, often
just aren’t.
That makes this an area where „testing“ is necessary: you won’t really be
able to tell where you’re losing people until you actually do lose them. So
people need to feel safe saying “I’m confused; can you say it differently
please?”
Best,
Myrle
On Thu, May 30, 2019 at 5:28 PM Patricia Shanahan <p...@acm.org> wrote:
> There has been a discussion on board@, subject "[Sidebar] [D&I] Example
> of exclusion from debate", about writing English in a style that will be
> accessible to as many ASF participants as possible.
>
> Tools for evaluating writing have been mentioned.
>
> LIX index:
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FLix_(readability_test&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7Cc649cee25ecb44af958108d6e5938265%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636948819043273578&sdata=I5ur8kQPQbft33SjGC2IO3NlXPYDn5V8djznW6EAm18%3D&reserved=0)
>
> Gunning-Fog:
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.webfx.com%2Ftools%2Fread-able%2Fgunning-fog.html&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7Cc649cee25ecb44af958108d6e5938265%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636948819043273578&sdata=doarWUmgR6y8Nmf1UnymjUX8yyX9HHO8BmJpUVBqVbI%3D&reserved=0
>
> I have a concern about both of those. They seem to be keyed to the
> sequence in which children develop written language skills in school.
>
> Most ASF participants are educated adults, typically very sophisticated
> readers and writers of at least one language. My question, especially
> for those who are not completely fluent in written English, is whether
> the same things give them difficulty.
>
> I have studied French, and can read it a bit. Complex sentence structure
> and multi-syllable words are no problem for me. Colloquial expressions
> and cultural references, even using single syllable words and short
> sentences, are much harder to understand.
>
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