On Fri, 13 Mar 2009, Mark R. Lindsey wrote: > On Mar 13, 2009, at 4:14 PM, Brandon S. Allbery KF8NH wrote: > >> On Mar 13, 2009, at 13:17 , Richard Chycoski wrote: >>> Licensing to ensure a minimum level of skill (like drivers' >>> licences - >>> look how well *that* works! :-) is a public safety issue. >> >> Drivers' licensing is a joke; the public has spoken, any warm body >> must be licensable, and there's hell to pay if someone who really has >> no business on the road is denied the *right* (not, as it should be, >> *privilege*) of driving. It's only an example if you're specifically >> looking for something that is unfixably broken, and then I call >> shenanigans. > > > > It's interesting that driver's licenses have come up, because that's > an example of establishing "Common Knowledge". We have Common > Knowledge if you know you're supposed to disable ssh root logins, and > I know that too, and I know that you know, and you know that I know, > and I know you know I know, ad infinitum. [1, 2]
except when it makes sense to have ssh root logins enabled (so that central management tools can do root privilage required functions on the box for example) the fundamental problem is that for every rule that you state, there will be cases where it is not only reasonable, but ideal to violate that rule. > Licensing serves a special purpose in many disciplines: it helps you > know what *other* people know, and they know that you know what they > know, and you know they know you know they know, etc. > > (And interestingly, it's been proven that you cannot establish common > knowledge via ordinary message passing as you have with packet > delivery in IP networks.) > > So licensing might be beneficial if there are things about system > administration where it's critical that we all know that we all know > something. For example, all electricians know that the green wire is > NEVER the hot wire. actually, I believe that there are cases where the green wire can be labled with tape and used to carry power. > And all drivers know that the person turning right > has the right-of-way (unless you're at a red light in Philadelphia, > where all the rules are different). > > For example, do we all know that a default route is supposed to point > toward the Internet? not always. if a machine is not supposed to talk to the Internet it may make sense for it to have a default route that points elsewhere. > Less trivially, do we all know that the root password shouldn't be > 'root'? Can we all depend on everybody else knowing that? if a machine is not remotely accessable and there are physical controls around who can get at the box locally, what's the problem with the root password being 'root' David Lang > Would it be valuable for us to have some way of establishing -- among > ourselves -- what we all know that we know? > > > [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_knowledge_(logic), > [2] http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/common-knowledge/ > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss@lopsa.org > http://lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss > This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators > http://lopsa.org/ > _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lopsa.org http://lopsa.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss This list provided by the League of Professional System Administrators http://lopsa.org/
