Hello, Igniters. I think we shouldn't put so many emotions in discussion of any contribution. Even so big and important as SG redesign.
The crucial point we all agreed about: Service Grid redesign a big feature that
can significally improve Ignite.
We all want to have it in the product.
Let me write my vision of the current task state:
1. Design of SG is discussed *and aligned* both: privately with Ignite
experts(Vladimir Ozerov, Alexey Goncharyuk, Anton Vinogradov, Denis Mekhanikov)
and publicly on dev-list. This task is done.
2. Current PR state - *on my review*.
I spend some time with this contribution and gave Vyacheslav a feedback.
I expect he can fix my comments in a day or two.
Seem we can ask of Anton Vinogradov review on the beginning of next week.
If Dmitriy or any community member wants to help *by doing things, not
discussing them on dev-list*.
Please, join to the review - you are welcome. PR is here [1]
3. I think, we have two mutually exclusive options regarding of release 2.7
a. We release 2.7 in planned dates.
b. We include SG in release scope.
My vote goes to option *a*.
I think we should release 2.7 with the bunch of new cool features.
*AND* we should plan 2.8 release at the end of the year with SG redesign and
MVCC stabilization tasks.
Anyway, while we preparing release a lot of things can happen.
Let's come back to discussion of SG release version *when it will be ready to
be merged to master*.
Guys, does it makes sense for you?
[1] https://github.com/apache/ignite/pull/4434
В Пт, 28/09/2018 в 19:47 +0300, Dmitriy Pavlov пишет:
> Hi Dmitriy,
>
> The design is aligned totally. The thread you mention was not named
> properly.
>
> It seems to me some community members are trying to take over the community
> and lead it instead of doing.
>
> As a member of the Apache community, I value Do-ocracy and power of those
> who do, but not just disagree. There are no leaders in open source, just
> do'ers.
>
> By do'ers here I mean Nikolay and Vyacheslav. For me, their conclusion has
> more weight here. If Vladimir is ready to lead an additional release for SG
> and SG developers agree, it works for me.
>
> Sincerely,
> Dmitriy Pavlov
>
>
> пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 19:39, Dmitriy Setrakyan <dsetrak...@apache.org>:
>
> > Dmitriy,
> >
> > We agreed in the beginning of this thread that Service Grid changes are not
> > going to make the release because the community still did not approve the
> > design. Nothing has changed since. I have not seen any design discussions.
> > At this point, I have no confidence that the Service Grid changes will make
> > it into the 2.8 release. The 2.7 release seems out of question altogether.
> >
> > Also, Nikolay is a release manager. We should let him drive the release. To
> > my knowledge, he is doing a great job and the release is going according to
> > the schedule he proposed.
> >
> > D.
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 4:31 AM Dmitriy Pavlov <dpavlov....@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Dmitriy, Vladimir,
> > >
> > > I suggest we stop this nonsense with release dates-pushing because of
> >
> > some
> > > open question.
> > >
> > > Just because you disagreed with any include/exclude something into scope,
> > > does not mean that whole community disagreed.
> > >
> > > If folks will start a separate discussion with results of the review, I
> >
> > see
> > > no reasons to reject their contribution, even if we need to revisit our
> > > agreements and wait for a couple of days more.
> > >
> > > Am I missing some reason why dates are so fundamentally important to you?
> > >
> > > Sincerely,
> > > Dmitriy Pavlov
> > >
> > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 12:20, Dmitriy Setrakyan <dsetrak...@apache.org>:
> > >
> > > > If services is not ready, which it is not, then we should include them
> > >
> > > into
> > > > the next release. There is no need to force them into 2.7. I suggest we
> > > > move according to the schedule we all agreed on.
> > > >
> > > > D.
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 1:22 AM Dmitriy Pavlov <dpavlov....@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Yes, so correct statement is "community did not make any decisions
> > >
> > > about
> > > > > services not go to 2.7/ services are out of scope".
> > > > >
> > > > > If so, please forgive me my confusion.
> > > > >
> > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:19, Vladimir Ozerov <voze...@gridgain.com
> > >
> > > :
> > > > >
> > > > > > Exactly. So correct statement is “it is up to *community* to decide
> > > > >
> > > > > whether
> > > > > > something goes to 2.7”.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:11, Dmitriy Pavlov <
> >
> > dpavlov....@gmail.com
> > > > :
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > No, it is up to the community to discuss after their review
> > >
> > > results.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:09, Vladimir Ozerov <
> > >
> > > voze...@gridgain.com
> > > > > :
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Dmitriy,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Did I read your words correctly that it is up to implementor
> >
> > of a
> > > > > > single
> > > > > > > > feature to decide whether release of all other features and
> >
> > fixes
> > > > to
> > > > > be
> > > > > > > > delayed?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 11:00, Dmitriy Pavlov <
> > > >
> > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com
> > > > > > :
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > My point we can wait a bit for services because
> > > > > > > > > 1 we are open-minded and we don't have outside pressure to
> >
> > do
> > > > > > release
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > October
> > > > > > > > > 2 and services it is not some new feature, which suddenly
> > > >
> > > > appeared
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > autumn, it is a well known and important feature.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > So it is up to Vyacheslav, Anton and Nikolay to decide.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Decisions can be services are not ready/ready to merge only
> >
> > to
> > > > > > > > master/ready
> > > > > > > > > to merge to master and to 2.7.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > пт, 28 сент. 2018 г. в 10:46, Vladimir Ozerov <
> > > > >
> > > > > voze...@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Dmitry,
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Community agreement was to perform the release in October.
> >
> > Of
> > > > > > course
> > > > > > > we
> > > > > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > > > wait a bit for services. Then we wait a bit for other cool
> > > > >
> > > > > features
> > > > > > > > ready
> > > > > > > > > > by that time, then again and again, and release will never
> > > > >
> > > > > happen.
> > > > > > > And
> > > > > > > > > > while we are waiting for new features to come, already
> > > >
> > > > completerd
> > > > > > > > > features
> > > > > > > > > > cannot be used by anyone.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > This is why we have an agreement that if feature is not
> > >
> > > ready,
> > > > it
> > > > > > > > should
> > > > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > > > moved to future release, instead of shifting release. The
> > >
> > > sole
> > > > > > reason
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > have strict dates when decisions are made is to let release
> > > > >
> > > > > happen.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Sep 28, 2018 at 2:22 AM Dmitriy Pavlov <
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Vladimir, I'm not searching for enemy, and not fighting
> > >
> > > with
> > > > > > you.
> > > > > > > > I'm
> > > > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > > > happy about cases when we are hurrying.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > We can't fix test, fill ticket details, can't wait for
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > contributions
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > finish their tasks. It is not best idea to use
> >
> > experience
> > > > from
> > > > > > > > > > commercial
> > > > > > > > > > > companies in open source. Are there any pressure outside
> > > > > >
> > > > > > community?
> > > > > > > > Did
> > > > > > > > > > > someone promised rest of features to be released at 30
> > > > >
> > > > > September?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Let's remember principle do-orcracy, power of those who
> >
> > do.
> > > > If
> > > > > > > > > contribor
> > > > > > > > > > > does change and reviewer does review, let's give right of
> > > > >
> > > > > making
> > > > > > > > > decision
> > > > > > > > > > > to them, but not to some closed club of people who
> > >
> > > privately
> > > > > > > discuss
> > > > > > > > > > > something.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely
> > > > > > > > > > > Dmitriy Pavlov
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г., 23:42 Vyacheslav Daradur <
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > daradu...@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Igniters!
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > As I have written about Service Grid before [1] I'm
> > > > >
> > > > > finalizing
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > solution to be sure that implementation is reliable.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > About including it in 2.7, if we talk that code freeze
> > > > >
> > > > > tomorrow
> > > > > > > > then
> > > > > > > > > > > > the solution is not ready to merge yet.
> > > > > > > > > > > > I hope that prereviewers Anton Vinogradov and Nikolay
> > > >
> > > > Izhikov
> > > > > > > will
> > > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > > > > > able to answer if solution out of scope or not in a
> > >
> > > couple
> > > > of
> > > > > > > days.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > [1]
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> >
> > http://apache-ignite-developers.2346864.n4.nabble.com/Apache-Ignite-2-7-release-td34076.html#a34485
> > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 11:14 PM Dmitriy Pavlov <
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, I agree, NPE during WAL flush is definitely a
> > > >
> > > > blocker.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > It is strange why the current test set did not fail
> > >
> > > after
> > > > > > > commit.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 21:45, Andrey Kuznetsov <
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > stku...@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Igniters,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've bumped into a new bug in WAL manager recently,
> > >
> > > see
> > > > > > [1].
> > > > > > > It
> > > > > > > > > > looks
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > critical enough, and can be a good candidate for
> > >
> > > fixing
> > > > > > > before
> > > > > > > > > 2.7
> > > > > > > > > > > > release.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do you agree?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > [1]
> > >
> > > https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/IGNITE-9731
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 19:45, Dmitriy Pavlov <
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I need Vhyacheslav's opinion to be absolutely
> >
> > sure
> > > > what
> > > > > > > > status
> > > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > > now.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We never committed to dates of release, as well.
> >
> > I
> > > > > don't
> > > > > > > > quite
> > > > > > > > > > > > understand
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > what can mean 'the community committed to
> > > > >
> > > > > doing/releasing
> > > > > > > > > > > something'.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > About SG, I also concerned why such a big feature
> > >
> > > has
> > > > > > > quite a
> > > > > > > > > few
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussions on the list. But it is another story.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 19:33, Vladimir Ozerov <
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > voze...@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Folks,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please stop looking for enemies everywhere.
> >
> > Just
> > > > went
> > > > > > > > through
> > > > > > > > > > > this
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > thread
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and search for "service" word.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 7:30 PM Denis Magda <
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > dma...@apache.org
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Denis, as PMC Chair, could you please
> >
> > control,
> > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > Service
> > > > > > > > > > > Grid
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > inclusion/exclusion is discussed properly
> > > > >
> > > > > according
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Apache
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Way.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's fine when committers/contributors have
> > > >
> > > > private
> > > > > > > > > > discussions
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > related
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a feature they've been working on. Not
> > >
> > > everything
> > > > > > should
> > > > > > > > go
> > > > > > > > > > > > through
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dev
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > list. Otherwise, it will be inundated.
> >
> > However,
> > > > > > agree,
> > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > architectural
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and release decisions need to be done
> >
> > publicly.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Speaking about Service Grid, there was a
> > > >
> > > > discussion
> > > > > > > where
> > > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > > > > saw
> > > > > > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > was
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > questionable whether it gets added to the
> > >
> > > release
> > > > or
> > > > > > > not.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Vladislav*, could you please shed some light
> >
> > on
> > > > the
> > > > > > > > current
> > > > > > > > > > > > status of
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > service grid?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 9:12 AM Dmitriy
> >
> > Pavlov <
> > > > > > > > > > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok, let's wait for feedback from SG
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Author(s)/Reviewer(s)
> > > > > > > > > > > > first. If
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > not ready, ok. But I thought it is almost
> > >
> > > done.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I apologize if I missed some discussion (it
> > >
> > > can
> > > > > > > happen),
> > > > > > > > > but
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > According to the statement "our current
> > > >
> > > > agreement"
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can suspect some members are making some
> > >
> > > sort
> > > > of
> > > > > > > > private
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > agreements,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do not to discuss it on the list.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's build consensus here first, and then
> > >
> > > name
> > > > an
> > > > > > > > > > agreement.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Denis, as PMC Chair, could you please
> >
> > control,
> > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > Service
> > > > > > > > > > > Grid
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > inclusion/exclusion is discussed properly
> > > > >
> > > > > according
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Apache
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Way.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 18:55, Vladimir
> >
> > Ozerov
> > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > voze...@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dmitriy,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is an outcome of current state of
> > >
> > > Service
> > > > > > Grid -
> > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ready.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > never committed to have it to 2.7. Our
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > goal
> > >
> > > was
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > try
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > include
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > into
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2.7.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 6:48 PM Dmitriy
> > >
> > > Pavlov
> > > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Could you please provide a reference to
> > >
> > > some
> > > > > > > thread?
> > > > > > > > > > > > Probably I
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > missed
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 18:46, Vladimir
> > > >
> > > > Ozerov <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > voze...@gridgain.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Our current agreement is that Service
> > >
> > > Grid
> > > > is
> > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > > > scope.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > This
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is a
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > huge
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > feature, which hasn't entered review
> > >
> > > stage
> > > > so
> > > > > > > far,
> > > > > > > > We
> > > > > > > > > > > will
> > > > > > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > able to
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > review/fix/test it properly.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 6:32 PM
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dmitriy
> > > > >
> > > > > Pavlov
> > > > > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dpavlov....@gmail.com
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree, and I prefer four weeks for
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > stabilization*
> > > > > > > > > > (1
> > > > > > > > > > > > Oct -
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 29
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oct)
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do I understand it correctly:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Service
> > > >
> > > > Grid
> > > > > is
> > > > > > > > still
> > > > > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > > > > scope,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it? I
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > find it very important.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г. в 18:28,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nikolay
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Izhikov <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > nizhi...@apache.org
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello, Vova.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for clear release
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > status.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm +1 for your proposal.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > чт, 27 сент. 2018 г., 18:25 Alexey
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Kuznetsov
> > > > > > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > akuznet...@apache.org
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > :
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vova,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Huge +1 to do a stabilization.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alexey Kuznetsov
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Andrey Kuznetsov.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > > Best Regards, Vyacheslav D.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
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