I think given the stability of Arrow Java, dropping support probably makes sense. If a bug comes up or consumers really need to new features we can always make a patch release of an older version.
On Thu, Oct 5, 2023 at 3:13 PM Dane Pitkin <d...@voltrondata.com.invalid> wrote: > I also learned today that Apache Spark has dropped support for Java 8 and > 11 for their next release (v4.0)[1]. Should we consider dropping Java 11 as > well? > > [1]https://github.com/apache/spark/pull/43005 > > -Dane > > On Thu, Oct 5, 2023 at 3:30 PM Dane Pitkin <d...@voltrondata.com> wrote: > > > I created a GH issue[1] proposing the removal of Java 8 support. It > > would target the Arrow v15 release (~Jan 2024). > > > > IMO it would be in the best interest of the project for two major > reasons: > > 1. Unblock the Java Platform Module System (JPMS)[2] implementation. > > 2. Unblock Arrow from upgrading dependencies that no longer support Java > > 8. (See [1] for examples) > > > > Since Arrow Java has been quite stable, will Java 8 users be okay with > > pinning Arrow to the last supported release (v14) if the Arrow project > > ultimately decides to remove Java 8 support? > > > > > > [1]https://github.com/apache/arrow/issues/38051 > > [2]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_Platform_Module_System > > > > -Dane > > > > On Fri, Sep 15, 2023 at 12:26 PM Dane Pitkin <d...@voltrondata.com> > wrote: > > > >> - As a low level library, users have to add specific flags to use > >>> Java 9 and up with Arrow to resolve issues with java.nio. This has > >>> been annoying for our customers constantly. If this is not resolved, > >>> I would say we may see a lot of complaints in the future. > >>> > >> I filed issue 37739[1] to track this, but it sounds like this can't be > >> changed until Java 21 or 24. > >> > >> - It seems that the EOL of Java 8 from Oracle is Dec 2030 [2]. A lot > >>> users will still stay on it for a long time. At least this is true for > >>> our > >>> customers. So I am afraid we may not upgrade to newer versions > >>> of Arrow if it no longer supports Java 8. > >>> > >> Java 8 does have a long Extended Support timeline, but a recent > >> report shows Java 11 increasing in adoption vs Java 8. "More than 56% of > >> applications are now using Java 11 in production (up from 48% in 2022 > and > >> 11% in 2020). Java 8 is a close second with nearly 33% of applications > >> using it in production (down from 46% in 2022)."[2] > >> I expect the Java ecosystem will find a way to move on from Java 8 much > >> sooner than 2030, meaning many of Arrow's dependencies could drop > support > >> for Java 8 before then. At this point, Arrow may be forced to support a > >> higher minimum Java version. > >> > >> That being said, it's hard to argue against real use cases. I'd be > >> curious to hear what Java version other users of Arrow are using (and if > >> there is a timeline to upgrade if on Java 8). > >> > >> > >> [1]https://github.com/apache/arrow/issues/37739 > >> [2] > >> > https://newrelic.com/sites/default/files/2023-04/new-relic-2023-state-of-the-java-ecosystem-2023-04-20.pdf > >> > >> > >> -Dane > >> > >> > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2023 at 11:45 AM Gang Wu <ust...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >>> Thanks for bringing this up! > >>> > >>> I have two concerns of dropping Java 8 support: > >>> - As a low level library, users have to add specific flags [1] to use > >>> Java 9 and up with Arrow to resolve issues with java.nio. This has > >>> been annoying for our customers constantly. If this is not resolved, > >>> I would say we may see a lot of complaints in the future. > >>> - It seems that the EOL of Java 8 from Oracle is Dec 2030 [2]. A lot > >>> users will still stay on it for a long time. At least this is true for > >>> our > >>> customers. So I am afraid we may not upgrade to newer versions > >>> of Arrow if it no longer supports Java 8. > >>> > >>> [1] https://arrow.apache.org/docs/java/install.html#java-compatibility > >>> [2] > >>> https://www.oracle.com/java/technologies/java-se-support-roadmap.html > >>> > >>> Best, > >>> Gang > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Sep 14, 2023 at 11:14 PM David Dali Susanibar Arce < > >>> davi.sar...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> > >>> > Hi Arrow Java developers, > >>> > > >>> > I would like to propose a timeline for dropping support for Java 8: > >>> > - Propose to drop JDK8 in Arrow v15 (2 releases from now) > >>> > - JDK 21 support will be added before removal of JDK8 > >>> > > >>> > Why? > >>> > - Java 8 no longer receives Premier Support (1) > >>> > - Some Arrow Java (test) dependencies have already started to drop > >>> > Java 8 support, forcing us to pin to older packager versions > >>> > > >>> > Also note: > >>> > - gRPC Java may drop support for a JDK version when that version is > no > >>> > longer receiving Premier Support from Oracle (2), more detail at Java > >>> > 8 / Java 11 support timeline in gRPC here (3) > >>> > - Spark plans to tentatively drop JDK 8 support in Spark 4.0 (4), > >>> > which has a release timeline of approximately 2024-06 (5). Is it fine > >>> > for us to drop JDK 8 support before spark? > >>> > > >>> > (1) > >>> https://www.oracle.com/java/technologies/java-se-support-roadmap.html > >>> > (2) > >>> > > >>> > https://github.com/grpc/proposal/pull/283/files#:~:text=gRPC%20Java%20may,support%5D > >>> > . > >>> > (3) https://groups.google.com/g/grpc-io/c/-XK6Kd_19YQ/m/-4s07TzdAgAJ > >>> > (4) https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SPARK-44112 > >>> > (5) https://www.mail-archive.com/dev@spark.apache.org/msg30460.html > >>> > > >>> > Consider: > >>> > - JDK8 deprecation is currently not mandatory. We simply want to > >>> > devote more time to development of Java LTS versions 11, 17 and 21. > >>> > - Java 11 is dropping Premier Support this month. > >>> > > >>> > Best regards, > >>> > > >>> > -- > >>> > David Susanibar > >>> > > >>> > >> >
