On 3/20/07, Carl Fink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Mon, Mar 19, 2007 at 10:37:34PM -0500, Ron Johnson wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On 03/19/07 22:11, Carl Fink wrote: > > I just can't handle the absurdly-long release cycle any more. > > Sid? Using. Not developing. I run Etch on my home box (the one I'm typing on now) but for servers it isn't always practical to use Testing, and that means you can almost never use a currently-in-production server with Debian, unless you want to hand-compile at the very least a kernel.
Some people seem confused about what and why this was said. He said "currently -in-production" which I believe means new off the shelf servers. The struggle is installing Debian while the kernel on the installer is over 2 years old. Yes, there are non-CD install methods, but they are not seen as a standard way to install, and it adds more complexity to training others on how to install the OS. If the installer can't see the disk because the chipset drivers or disk controller drivers are not available, then people don't get very far. Some would rather switch Debian for another distro at this point than spend their time and research to adopt something like a net install. The 19,000 available packages and all that is of little interest to someone running a single purpose server. As I mentioned in another thread, other distros/vendors do update their kernel on the installer, possibly 4 times per version of their distro. Perhaps this is needed on certain platforms where the hardware related to getting Debian on the disk (only this hardware) has changed to the point that the Debian CD installer will fail to see a disk target. I'm a little amazed to be encountering some of the same level of "huh?" within Debian users as I did on the Gentoo forums. It seems to be a gap of understanding between people who run hobby or single production servers and those who have server rooms of a variety of hardware, services, and OSes to maintain. The later group need much of what Debian offers. The installer's old kernel has been a thorn in the side for arguing in favour of Debian in my shop. It is one thing for a user who controls their environment completely to start up non-standard solutions for installation. It is another thing for people who have managers that question everything, want their thumbs in the pie, and prefer to see conservative actions taken for something as typical as an OS install. In such environments, even taking the time to set up a DHCP server to support the PXE/netboot could be questioned. As well, some of the steps for supporting a network boot are not the sort of thing I'd give to a junior admin that is already capable of doing a normal install. Some things to consider. If you are interested in seeing Debian deployment go up, installer developers should take heed. If you just want to argue that Debian is better than brand X, don't bother - I already know it. --Donald
