On Wed, Apr 25, 2001 at 10:05:03AM -0400, Ben Collins wrote: > On Wed, Apr 25, 2001 at 10:16:30PM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: > > It may be a minor catch-22, but ECN is currently so broken, that only power > > users should be using it, as the rest will just continue flooding the > > netfilter list with "Netfilter breaks all my websites!". [OK, ECN isn't > > broken, the routers are, I know, but same effect. ECN breaks stuff]. So, if > > you're smart enough to know that you want ECN, and smart enough to > > understand the consequences, you should be compiling your own kernel. > > Uh, no, ECN is not broken at all. What is broken are all of these > routers that depend on reserved bits in the TCP/IP packets. ECN itself > does not break things, it merely shows other things that are broken.
PEOPLE! I KNOW THIS! Please, stop telling me. > If we left everything to "you have to be smart enough", then let's just > leave out the entire linux kernel, most of the software in Debian, and > go for a minimum cygnus install. Let's just ditch all non-i386 > architectures. Hell, let's get rid of everything that might potentially > break your system, unless you are smart enough to use it. You know, > things like X that can fry a monitor, or mkfs that might trash your > harddrive. Have a towel to wipe your mouth, there's still a bit of sarcasm dripping out. I love the humourous exaggeration. Couldn't stop laughing. > > No way should we be pushing ECN to the masses. It should stay in the domain > > of people like DaveM, until routers get fixed. > > If we did that, then maybe 4 people would be using it (there's not many > people in the same class as davem). > > This needs to be pushed to the masses. If we watited for all of these > vendors to fix their equipment, and all of these corporations to apply > those fixes, before spreading ECN, then DaveM might be the only person > who ever uses it, and nothing will get fixed. > > That fact that things get broken, and people complain, is one reason > that things get fixed. Wow, I can see it now. Stuff "Debian: When the code matters more than the commercials", why not have "Debian: We put stuff that exploits braindeadness and makes chunks of the net inaccessable by default" on t-shirts! Yeah! -d, who can't be stuffed reading any more of -devel this morning -- Daniel Stone [EMAIL PROTECTED]
