My C&C 35-2 had the same problem and it was discovered in 2007during the course of an extensive cosmetic deck upgrade which grounded the boat since 2006. In my case the deck was waterlogged, but still firm. As a consequence, I did a lot of research on this and face the following choices at that time:
1) Rip up the outer deck skin in pieces, replace core then re-skin 2) Remove all the useful hardware from the boat, cut off the lead keel ($2.00/lb for 5500 lbs) and sell everything and scuttle the boat and buy a new one. Because I'm a stubborn soul, I opted for 1 but no longer had the time and paid a yard to do it. 5 years later, with luck I might launch before freeze up. The only bright side to the story is that for some miraculous reason, I still remain married to my wife of 35 years. Hindsight says option 2 would have been smarter. ALEX GIANNELIA Phone (416) 203-9858 Fax (416) 203-9843 Cell (416) 529-0070 email: a...@airsensing.com WEB: www.airsensing.com -----Original Message----- From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com Sent: August 9, 2012 10:40 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: CnC-List Digest, Vol 79, Issue 20 Send CnC-List mailing list submissions to cnc-list@cnc-list.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com You can reach the person managing the list at cnc-list-ow...@cnc-list.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of CnC-List digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Starting problems (Rich Knowles) 2. Re: Starting problems & worse (Russ & Melody) 3. Re: Starting problems & worse (Rich Knowles) 4. Starter Problem solved (John Russo) 5. Sailing gloves (Dennis C.) 6. Re: Sailing gloves (Frederick G Street) 7. Spongy deck (Don Jonsson) 8. Re: C&C 34 Sail Selection (OldSteveH) 9. Re: Spongy deck (Hoyt, Mike) 10. Re: Spongy deck (Chris Duer) 11. Re: Sailing gloves (Walt Dickie) 12. Re: C&C 34 Sail Selection and Reefing (Steve Thomas) 13. Re: Sailing gloves (Ian Matthew) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 15:54:52 -0300 From: Rich Knowles <r...@sailpower.ca> To: "Dennis C." <capt...@yahoo.com>, "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Starting problems Message-ID: <77c346af-1a31-49cf-8d2c-2e9fa38c7...@sailpower.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" I'd add one thing to Dennis' excellent list: get a handful of butt connectors and a good crimper and remove the engine harness connectors completely. They serve no useful purpose. Rich (mobile) On 2012-08-08, at 15:02, "Dennis C." <capt...@yahoo.com> wrote: John, Been down this road on a couple of boats with Yanmars. Likely problem areas, poor connection or connector on the positive wire from the starter switch, poor connection in the harness connector, poor connection or connector at the solenoid. Same for all negative wires. First, make sure you're getting a reliable 12 volts to the input of the ignition switch. If so, I would first replace the connector on the positive wire on the starter switch. Use a marine grade connector and coat both the connection and connector with USS TefGel and re-attach. If that doesn't fix it, test the switch several times with an ohmmeter. It should work immediately each try. If it doesn't replace it. Next, pull the engine harness connector apart, spray it with Boeshield T-9 (not WD-40), push it back together and pull it apart several times. See how that works. If it works, pull it apart, coat the connections with USS TefGel, put it back together and tape the mating surfaces. Next, replace the connector on the positive wire at the solenoid. The above steps have fixed intermittent starter problems on at least two Yanmar powered boats I've worked on. Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA From: John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> To: CnC-List@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, August 8, 2012 8:22 AM Subject: Stus-List Starting problems I just developed intermittent electrical starting problems on my 1984 C&C 32 with a 2GMF engine. I assume it is either the starting push button switch or the Solenoid and an off to the boat to investigate and hopefully confirm prior to a one week cruise starting this weekend. The engine control panel is a Type B and I was wondering if anyone knew the make and/ or part #?s of a compatible push button switch and starting Solenoid. Thanks you in advance for any answers/suggestions. John Arpeggio Norwalk,CT _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120808/583ab61f/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2012 12:14:52 -0700 From: Russ & Melody <russ...@telus.net> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Starting problems & worse Message-ID: <20120808191457.QXZC23453.priv-edmwes48.telusplanet.net@edmwcm04> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed How 'bout checking with Wally first? He did time in San Francisco... and could probably warn them 'bout the butt connectors and crimpers. Cheers, Russ At 11:54 AM 08/08/2012, you wrote: >I'd add one thing to Dennis' excellent list: get a handful of butt >connectors and a good crimper and remove the engine harness >connectors completely. They serve no useful purpose. > >Rich >(mobile) ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 16:25:17 -0300 From: Rich Knowles <r...@sailpower.ca> To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Starting problems & worse Message-ID: <d1bf104e-fcc9-4304-a144-1df1a9f26...@sailpower.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii That's scary! Good idea though. Rich (mobile) On 2012-08-08, at 16:14, Russ & Melody <russ...@telus.net> wrote: How 'bout checking with Wally first? He did time in San Francisco... and could probably warn them 'bout the butt connectors and crimpers. Cheers, Russ At 11:54 AM 08/08/2012, you wrote: > I'd add one thing to Dennis' excellent list: get a handful of butt connectors > and a good crimper and remove the engine harness connectors completely. They > serve no useful purpose. > > Rich > (mobile) _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2012 17:58:51 -0400 From: John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> To: CnC-List@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Starter Problem solved Message-ID: <004b01cd75b0$feb9b650$fc2d22f0$@optonline.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thank you for the many suggestions. I tested the push button starter and found that I really had to press very hard to get a consistent connection so replaced it with the Yanmar Part # 124070-91300. Piece of cake. John Arpeggio Norwalk CT -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120808/1aa77d0e/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 15:10:08 -0700 (PDT) From: "Dennis C." <capt...@yahoo.com> To: Cn Clist <CnC-List@cnc-list.com> Subject: Stus-List Sailing gloves Message-ID: <1344463808.16789.yahoomail...@web114313.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I was sorting through Touche's glove locker over the weekend.? Over the years, I've accumulated all manner of gloves.? On inspection, the ones that seemed to be in the best shape were the old Trophy brand goatskin? gloves from my catamaran days.? They seemed to be in the best shape.? The Harken Black Magic and Gill "hi tech" grippy gloves seemed to have the worst wear. What's the list finding for good gloves?? Anyone use Atlas sailing gloves?? Henri Lloyd?? Gill Pro gloves?? Musto?? Zimco?? Five Oceans?? Victory?? Ronstan?? NRS?? Zhic? How about Dakine brand gloves?? I use them for snowboarding.? They make sailing gloves now. Cheap Home Depot gloves with the fingers cut down? I saw one reference to Ergodyne Proflex framer's gloves.? They actually look like they'd make a pretty good sailing glove.? :) Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120808/5ae2a231/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 17:24:33 -0500 From: Frederick G Street <f...@postaudio.net> To: "Dennis C." <capt...@yahoo.com>, cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Sailing gloves Message-ID: <b99eed89-8c27-4167-bee3-c700a07cc...@postaudio.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dennis -- I only use gloves when sailing if I need to keep my hands warm, so I don't have much experience with this; but I've used a bunch of these from time to time at work, and they seem to be quite a good value for the money: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1v/R-202021235/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=firm+grip&storeId=10051&superSkuId=202892938#.UCLmf0SUhoo I'd be curious to know how the waterproof version holds up -- might be nice to have some on the boat: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202021234/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=firm+grip&storeId=10051#.UCLm90SUhoo FWIW... Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Aug 8, 2012, at 5:10 PM, Dennis C. wrote: > I was sorting through Touche's glove locker over the weekend. Over the > years, I've accumulated all manner of gloves. On inspection, the ones that > seemed to be in the best shape were the old Trophy brand goatskin? gloves > from my catamaran days. They seemed to be in the best shape. The Harken > Black Magic and Gill "hi tech" grippy gloves seemed to have the worst wear. > > What's the list finding for good gloves? Anyone use Atlas sailing gloves? > Henri Lloyd? Gill Pro gloves? Musto? Zimco? Five Oceans? Victory? > Ronstan? NRS? Zhic? > > How about Dakine brand gloves? I use them for snowboarding. They make > sailing gloves now. > > Cheap Home Depot gloves with the fingers cut down? > > I saw one reference to Ergodyne Proflex framer's gloves. They actually look > like they'd make a pretty good sailing glove. :) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120808/33b34259/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 20:40:34 -0700 From: "Don Jonsson" <dbjons...@shaw.ca> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Stus-List Spongy deck Message-ID: <007901cd75e0$bba1a730$32e4f590$@ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello All I have a 1981 C&C 34. At the front bulkhead, port side a diesel heater had been installed and water got into the deck around the chimney. I sealed this up several years ago but now the deck has become spongy forward and towards the mast, covering an area of about 1.5 feet square. At the moment it is still fine for standing on but it makes me nervous that it will get worse. For anyone who is familiar with this problem I have some questions. 1. It appears the deck has delaminated from the core, which I believe is balsa. I have heard that once this sets in it will just continue to spread. Is this true, or now that water is no longer getting in will it stop? 2. Is there any way to tell if it is still wet in there without drilling holes in the deck? 3. What are peoples recommendations on how to fix this? Any other advice on this is appreciated. Thanks Don -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120808/5c57dc5d/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 22:54:59 -0700 From: OldSteveH <oldste...@sympatico.ca> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection Message-ID: <blu0-smtp80f6b7dc00fd158e1b99a9cf...@phx.gbl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format=flowed Thanks for feedback. I was quoting true wind so add 5 knots. We didn't lose the 1/2 knot of speed when reefing, only once we doused the main. I too have inboard tracks for the #3, they work well. John, the 34's main is not all that big to start with, I have considered having a second reef point put in but didn't think it was worth the bother. Cheers, Steve Hood S/V Diamond Girl C&C 34 Lions Head ON ------------------------------------------------------------ On Aug 7, 2012, at 8:32 PM, "John and Maryann Read" <johnpr...@comcast.net> wrote: >> Sounds about right and what we experience. For racing, we use a full hoist >> #3 with battens that not quite overlaps the shrouds and uses an inboard >> track I mounted on the cabin top. Starts to be really effective at 25 >> apparent. We have 2 reefs in the main, and if all that is too much it is >> time for the storm sail. Key is keep up boat speed and VMG. The more on >> her feet, the better the VMG >> >> John and Maryann >> Legacy III >> 1982 C&C 34 >> Noank, CT >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] >> On Behalf Of dwight veinot >> Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2012 12:52 PM >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection >> >> Sounds about right...the only important winds when under sail are apparent >> winds so I assume you are giving apparent wind strengths...surprised you >> lost 1/2 kt boat speed when you reefed, I would have expected less or no >> speed loss and less heel with more control in puffs...I also had a 24 and a >> 27III, before I got my present boat the 35 MKII which is a bit stiffer that >> either the 24 or the 27 MKIII but IMHO it could do with about 500 pounds >> more ballast low despite that it already has nearly 6000 pounds of lead in >> the keel >> >> Dwight Veinot >> C&C 35 MKII, Alianna >> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS >> -----Original Message----- >> From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] >> On Behalf Of OldSteveH >> Sent: August 7, 2012 1:32 PM >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection >> >> >> Now in my 3rd summer with this boat I am getting better at choosing sails >> for the wind conditions, and would like to know how it compares with others >> experiences. >> >> From I have heard the 34 is a 'Lake Ontario' boat, designed for light air >> conditions, but able to handle other conditions as one would expect. >> >> Yesterday my crew and I were quite comfortable in steady 22-25 knot winds >> carrying the 3 and a full main on a beat, eventually putting in a reef. Heel >> angle was 20ish. When gusts to 27-29 started we were getting over to 30 >> degrees at times and I had to feather even the reefed main to keep the boat >> on its feet. We kept hull speed the whole time. >> >> Per other posts baby stay tension was moderate, backstay had 2500 psi on >> adjuster, mast pumping was minimal, weather helm one wedge of my wheel. >> >> Once we got steadily overpowered I dropped the main and sailed under #3 >> only, with much better heel angle. But we lost 1/2 a knot to about 6.2-6.3. >> Mast pumped a bit more but I only have 2:1 purchase on the baby stay so >> couldn't do much about it. >> >> My background comes from a C&C24 and a 27 MkIII, also tender boats so all >> here seems about right. How does it compare with others? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Steve Hood >> S/V Diamond Girl >> C&C 34 >> Lions Head ON >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2012 09:34:23 -0300 From: "Hoyt, Mike" <mike.h...@impgroup.com> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Spongy deck Message-ID: <4cdebb6b0f16c541ba8f985b72705d5413efc...@hfxexc02.impgroup.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Don Engage a Marine Surveyor to determine the extent of the wet area. It is likely wet a lot further from the source than the "soft" feeling indicates. Wet balsa can still be strong or feel strong depending on the degree of saturation and its bonding to top layer and underside. A benefit of a competent surveyor is that they can give you this information in a non destructive manner while at the same time advising on best fix .... I have dealt with wet balsa core in several areas on the deck of my boat. In some areas the wet area spread very little and others quite far. You can see this on the following site under projects. Mike Nut Case http://users.eastlink.ca/~mhoyt ________________________________ From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Don Jonsson Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2012 12:41 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Spongy deck Hello All I have a 1981 C&C 34. At the front bulkhead, port side a diesel heater had been installed and water got into the deck around the chimney. I sealed this up several years ago but now the deck has become spongy forward and towards the mast, covering an area of about 1.5 feet square. At the moment it is still fine for standing on but it makes me nervous that it will get worse. For anyone who is familiar with this problem I have some questions. 1. It appears the deck has delaminated from the core, which I believe is balsa. I have heard that once this sets in it will just continue to spread. Is this true, or now that water is no longer getting in will it stop? 2. Is there any way to tell if it is still wet in there without drilling holes in the deck? 3. What are peoples recommendations on how to fix this? Any other advice on this is appreciated. Thanks Don -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120809/95326bdd/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2012 09:04:19 -0400 From: "Chris Duer" <chris.d...@gmail.com> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Spongy deck Message-ID: <005401cd762f$7d8e4a30$78aade90$@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Don ? Once sealed (properly), the migration will slow as you need oxygen to continue the rotting of the balsa. You need to have a professional test the extent of the damage. It may not be as easy as simply running a tap test. If the rotten balsa hasn?t caused a delamination from the skin (yet), a tap test may miss areas. The core in the cabin top of C&C 34 was ?? contour scrim balsa. If you decide to do the repair, I can offer some advice as I had to recore over 60% of my cabin top last year. The most pictures can be found at: http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.218582014849563.49715.1559709444440 04 <http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.218582014849563.49715.155970944444 004&type=3> &type=3 Chris Duer C&C 34 #117 Morning View Best Regards, Chris Duer President Description: duerComposites email signature (640x178) 229 Morrow Lane, Hardeeville, SC 29927 <http://www.duer.co> www.duer.co | 1.843.784.DUER (3837) <mailto:chrisd...@duer.co> chrisd...@duer.co | 1.843.540.5764 (M) From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Don Jonsson Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 11:41 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List Spongy deck Hello All I have a 1981 C&C 34. At the front bulkhead, port side a diesel heater had been installed and water got into the deck around the chimney. I sealed this up several years ago but now the deck has become spongy forward and towards the mast, covering an area of about 1.5 feet square. At the moment it is still fine for standing on but it makes me nervous that it will get worse. For anyone who is familiar with this problem I have some questions. 1. It appears the deck has delaminated from the core, which I believe is balsa. I have heard that once this sets in it will just continue to spread. Is this true, or now that water is no longer getting in will it stop? 2. Is there any way to tell if it is still wet in there without drilling holes in the deck? 3. What are peoples recommendations on how to fix this? Any other advice on this is appreciated. Thanks Don -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120809/b9814bc4/attachment-0001.html> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image003.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4968 bytes Desc: not available URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120809/b9814bc4/attachment-0001.jpg> ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2012 09:20:24 -0500 From: Walt Dickie <wa...@crresearch.com> To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Sailing gloves Message-ID: <0451e38bf87bf74e9fc850ec40acf81c088667a...@ausp01vmbx09.collaborationhost.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" We were talking about this before going out racing last night. Two of us had Gill gloves simply disintegrate during the Mac this year, and my college-age son says that when he was racing 420s in high school the whole team swore off Gill forever. He was wearing an ancient pair of Ronstans that were still in great condition after multiple seasons. Impressive. From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G Street Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 5:25 PM To: Dennis C.; cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Sailing gloves Dennis -- I only use gloves when sailing if I need to keep my hands warm, so I don't have much experience with this; but I've used a bunch of these from time to time at work, and they seem to be quite a good value for the money: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1v/R-202021235/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=firm+grip&storeId=10051&superSkuId=202892938#.UCLmf0SUhoo I'd be curious to know how the waterproof version holds up -- might be nice to have some on the boat: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202021234/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=firm+grip&storeId=10051#.UCLm90SUhoo FWIW... Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Aug 8, 2012, at 5:10 PM, Dennis C. wrote: I was sorting through Touche's glove locker over the weekend. Over the years, I've accumulated all manner of gloves. On inspection, the ones that seemed to be in the best shape were the old Trophy brand goatskin? gloves from my catamaran days. They seemed to be in the best shape. The Harken Black Magic and Gill "hi tech" grippy gloves seemed to have the worst wear. What's the list finding for good gloves? Anyone use Atlas sailing gloves? Henri Lloyd? Gill Pro gloves? Musto? Zimco? Five Oceans? Victory? Ronstan? NRS? Zhic? How about Dakine brand gloves? I use them for snowboarding. They make sailing gloves now. Cheap Home Depot gloves with the fingers cut down? I saw one reference to Ergodyne Proflex framer's gloves. They actually look like they'd make a pretty good sailing glove. :) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120809/fe8a789c/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2012 10:33:13 -0400 From: Steve Thomas <sthom...@sympatico.ca> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection and Reefing Message-ID: <blu0-smtp43fb8f62214a26fa95d27dbf...@phx.gbl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Mystique, a C&C27 MKIII, is as tender as any of the old C&Cs and I have long considered putting in a 3rd set of reef points. A storm main sail is pretty much out of the question unless permanently rigged on a separate track imho. Otherwise changing mains once the wind has picked up sounds difficult at best. I have found the option of a second reef to be useful on many occasions, and I think you would too. As for sailing with no main at all, my experience has been that performance to weather suffers noticeably. The boat has proven to have better balance at the helm than I had originally expected. This must be due at least in part, to hydrodynamic effects that tend to make the boat want to round up the harder it is driven leeward. Whatever the reason, rudder drag is not is not what makes the boat go slower if the helm is reasonably well balanced, so it has got to be the sail plan. I think you will get better performance with even a scrap of mainsail up when going to weather, and probably on a reach as well. Anyway, that's my take on it. Steve Thomas sv Mystique C&C 27MKIII Port Stanley, ON -----Original Message----- From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com]On Behalf Of OldSteveH Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2012 1:55 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection Thanks for feedback. I was quoting true wind so add 5 knots. We didn't lose the 1/2 knot of speed when reefing, only once we doused the main. I too have inboard tracks for the #3, they work well. John, the 34's main is not all that big to start with, I have considered having a second reef point put in but didn't think it was worth the bother. Cheers, Steve Hood S/V Diamond Girl C&C 34 Lions Head ON ------------------------------------------------------------ On Aug 7, 2012, at 8:32 PM, "John and Maryann Read" <johnpr...@comcast.net> wrote: >> Sounds about right and what we experience. For racing, we use a full hoist >> #3 with battens that not quite overlaps the shrouds and uses an inboard >> track I mounted on the cabin top. Starts to be really effective at 25 >> apparent. We have 2 reefs in the main, and if all that is too much it is >> time for the storm sail. Key is keep up boat speed and VMG. The more on >> her feet, the better the VMG >> >> John and Maryann >> Legacy III >> 1982 C&C 34 >> Noank, CT >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] >> On Behalf Of dwight veinot >> Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2012 12:52 PM >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Re: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection >> >> Sounds about right...the only important winds when under sail are apparent >> winds so I assume you are giving apparent wind strengths...surprised you >> lost 1/2 kt boat speed when you reefed, I would have expected less or no >> speed loss and less heel with more control in puffs...I also had a 24 and a >> 27III, before I got my present boat the 35 MKII which is a bit stiffer that >> either the 24 or the 27 MKIII but IMHO it could do with about 500 pounds >> more ballast low despite that it already has nearly 6000 pounds of lead in >> the keel >> >> Dwight Veinot >> C&C 35 MKII, Alianna >> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS >> -----Original Message----- >> From: cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] >> On Behalf Of OldSteveH >> Sent: August 7, 2012 1:32 PM >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Stus-List C&C 34 Sail Selection >> >> >> Now in my 3rd summer with this boat I am getting better at choosing sails >> for the wind conditions, and would like to know how it compares with others >> experiences. >> >> From I have heard the 34 is a 'Lake Ontario' boat, designed for light air >> conditions, but able to handle other conditions as one would expect. >> >> Yesterday my crew and I were quite comfortable in steady 22-25 knot winds >> carrying the 3 and a full main on a beat, eventually putting in a reef. Heel >> angle was 20ish. When gusts to 27-29 started we were getting over to 30 >> degrees at times and I had to feather even the reefed main to keep the boat >> on its feet. We kept hull speed the whole time. >> >> Per other posts baby stay tension was moderate, backstay had 2500 psi on >> adjuster, mast pumping was minimal, weather helm one wedge of my wheel. >> >> Once we got steadily overpowered I dropped the main and sailed under #3 >> only, with much better heel angle. But we lost 1/2 a knot to about 6.2-6.3. >> Mast pumped a bit more but I only have 2:1 purchase on the baby stay so >> couldn't do much about it. >> >> My background comes from a C&C24 and a 27 MkIII, also tender boats so all >> here seems about right. How does it compare with others? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Steve Hood >> S/V Diamond Girl >> C&C 34 >> Lions Head ON >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2012 07:39:38 -0700 From: Ian Matthew <ian.matthew....@gmail.com> To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Sailing gloves Message-ID: <CAPg2B9Y1+Zm8-b+QgHMPg9nPLq2NbS3dKM-+P+98===dvnr...@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I can't imagine sailing without gloves. But then the SF Bay isn't exactly the warmest sailing environment! Fred - you mustn't be doing any sheet adjustment! I also sail on a Cal-40 and do main trim on that. Gabbing the main without gloves is really painful. My best gloves are Harkens. They are in their 3rd season - not bad. I had some Gill's but they disintegrated quickly - went back to te Harkens. Recently I bought some West Marine gloves which seem to be doing OK, but this is their first year - but when I go on the Cal, then I like my Harkens. On Thursday, August 9, 2012, Walt Dickie wrote: > We were talking about this before going out racing last night. Two of us > had Gill gloves simply disintegrate during the Mac this year, and my > college-age son says that when he was racing 420s in high school the whole > team swore off Gill forever. He was wearing an ancient pair of Ronstans > that were still in great condition after multiple seasons. Impressive.**** > > ** ** > > *From:* cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > 'cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com');> > [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com<javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > 'cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com');>] > *On Behalf Of *Frederick G Street > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 08, 2012 5:25 PM > *To:* Dennis C.; cnc-list@cnc-list.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com');> > *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Sailing gloves**** > > ** ** > > Dennis -- I only use gloves when sailing if I need to keep my hands warm, > so I don't have much experience with this; but I've used a bunch of these > from time to time at work, and they seem to be quite a good value for the > money:**** > > ** ** > > > http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1v/R-202021235/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=firm+grip&storeId=10051&superSkuId=202892938#.UCLmf0SUhoo > **** > > ** ** > > I'd be curious to know how the waterproof version holds up -- might be > nice to have some on the boat:**** > > ** ** > > > http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202021234/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=firm+grip&storeId=10051#.UCLm90SUhoo > **** > > ** ** > > FWIW...**** > > > Fred Street -- Minneapolis > S/V *Oceanis* (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^(* > *** > > ** ** > > On Aug 8, 2012, at 5:10 PM, Dennis C. wrote:**** > > > > **** > > I was sorting through Touche's glove locker over the weekend. Over the > years, I've accumulated all manner of gloves. On inspection, the ones that > seemed to be in the best shape were the old Trophy brand goatskin? gloves > from my catamaran days. They seemed to be in the best shape. The Harken > Black Magic and Gill "hi tech" grippy gloves seemed to have the worst wear. > **** > > ** ** > > What's the list finding for good gloves? Anyone use Atlas sailing > gloves? Henri Lloyd? Gill Pro gloves? Musto? Zimco? Five Oceans? > Victory? Ronstan? NRS? Zhic?**** > > ** ** > > How about Dakine brand gloves? I use them for snowboarding. They make > sailing gloves now.**** > > ** ** > > Cheap Home Depot gloves with the fingers cut down?**** > > ** ** > > I saw one reference to Ergodyne Proflex framer's gloves. They actually > look like they'd make a pretty good sailing glove. :)**** > > ** ** > -- Ian Matthew "Siento el Viento" C&C 29 mk 1 San Francisco Bay Sent from my iPad using Gmail Mobile -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20120809/94b09c88/attachment.html> ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ CnC-List mailing list CnC-List@cnc-list.com http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com End of CnC-List Digest, Vol 79, Issue 20 **************************************** _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
