On Friday, October 22, 2021 at 10:19:44 PM UTC+2 Fernando Serboncini wrote:
> [coming from the other thread... :) ] > > +1 to what David said. It doesn't seem that returning dynamic-range: high > right now would be useful. > > The spec could use some clarification: > - clarify if those criterias need to be supported on different conditions: > CSS, images, canvas, ... > - clarify if the criterias need to be supported for both with/without > alpha (afaik there may be implementation differences there, but I may be > wrong here). > - I wonder if the definitions of high contrast/peak brightness should > match the industry definitions for HDR displays? I'm not an expert, but I > know those exist. > I think it's potentially okay to ignore those definitions, but I'd ask for > a rationale here. > > I think it's a great thing to summarize hdr into a single media query, but > the risk here would be to release a semantic that guarantees very little, > and therefore is not useful in the long run. > > > On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 10:04 AM David Baron <[email protected]> wrote: > >> This sounds like exactly the sort of case where an implementation should >> report (dynamic-range: standard) and (video-dynamic-range: high). It >> would be great to see the spec clarified to make it clearer what UA support >> is expected for each, though. >> >> -David >> >> On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 7:03 PM Will Cassella <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> Copying over from the other thread (trying to continue the discussion >>> here): >>> >>> The spec <https://www.w3.org/TR/mediaqueries-5/#dynamic-range> requires >>>> that "The combination of the User Agent and the output device fulfill all >>>> of the following criteria" when describing what it means to be high >>>> dynamic-range. Since Chromium doesn't support wide-gamut colors in CSS, >>>> HTML, or Canvas >>> >>> David - I'm likely missing something here, but I thought (based on this thread <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/blink-dev/c/epSTNPYkLIs/m/o5l7pZk1AwAJ>) that we do have wide-gamut support in CSS, HTML and Canvas. Are you saying we don't support this due to lack of color level 4 support? Or something else? I also didn't interpret the spec as saying anything about gamut (but rather about color depth <https://www.w3.org/TR/mediaqueries-5/#color>), although it may be possible that wide gamuts and high color depth correlate 1:1. Can you clarify if that's what you meant? > , I think it's probably incorrect to report that (dynamic-range: high) is >>>> true based only on the device, which is what it looks to me like the >>>> current >>>> code >>>> <https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/renderer/core/css/media_query_evaluator.cc;l=351-378;drc=4d3cb20c1aebba55e54112531222c7434d29f3b0> >>>> does. >>>> Admittedly, the spec could probably use some clarification as to what it >>>> means for the User Agent to fulfill the criteria for both the >>>> dynamic-range and video-dynamic-range queries, but my understanding of >>>> what the spec is trying to say is that Chrome probably shouldn't say that >>>> (dynamic-range: >>>> high) is true until it supports wide-gamut colors in at least some and >>>> maybe all of those contexts. >>> >>> >>> I think you're right that the spec needs some clarification, since we're >>> trying to incrementally enable adoption of HDR on the web the intent isn't >>> to signal that HDR is supported by all APIs. We do already support HDR >>> in some scenarios, such as the <video> element, so having these queries >>> exist to let developers detect display capabilities is already useful. >>> >>> On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 11:27 PM Yoav Weiss <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 7:01 AM Will Cassella <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Thanks for the feedback! I've updated that section: >>>>> >>>>> Debuggability >>>>> >>>>> Styles with these media queries can be viewed and edited in the >>>>> devtools frontend, albeit without proper highlighting. I've created pull >>>>> requests on the relevant libraries used in the devtools frontend to >>>>> enable >>>>> this. https://github.com/stylelint/stylelint/pull/5613 >>>>> https://github.com/codemirror/CodeMirror/pull/6803 >>>>> >>>>> On Wednesday, October 20, 2021 at 9:10:36 AM UTC-7 Mathias Bynens >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Oct 20, 2021 at 5:44 PM Will Cassella <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact [email protected], [email protected], >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Explainer >>>>>>> Adds MediaQueries for detecting HDR vs HDR displays >>>>>>> https://www.w3.org/TR/mediaqueries-5/#dynamic-range >>>>>>> https://www.w3.org/TR/mediaqueries-5/#video-dynamic-range >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Specificationhttps://www.w3.org/TR/mediaqueries-5/#dynamic-range >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Summary >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Adds media queries to CSS which allow a page to detect the current >>>>>>> display device’s support for HDR. This feature adds two new CSS media >>>>>>> queries: 'dynamic-range' and 'video-dynamic-range', both of which may >>>>>>> be >>>>>>> one of 'standard' or 'high'. Chrome will resolve these queries >>>>>>> according to >>>>>>> the capabilities of the display device the browser window is currently >>>>>>> positioned on, allowing pages to toggle CSS rules accordingly or >>>>>>> respond in >>>>>>> Javascript via 'window.matchMedia()'. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Blink componentBlink>CSS >>>>>>> <https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Blink%3ECSS> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Motivation >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As HDR-supported displays become more common, web developers need >>>>>>> ways to enable HDR content on their web pages without compromising the >>>>>>> experience for users of non-HDR displays, or mixed-HDR multi-display >>>>>>> setups. CSS already provides the 'media query' concept for toggling >>>>>>> rules >>>>>>> based on display device characteristics, and this feature extends that >>>>>>> set >>>>>>> of queries to enable detecting HDR support on the current display >>>>>>> device. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Initial public proposal >>>>>>> >>>>>>> TAG reviewNot Filed. This is an incremental change to CSS Media >>>>>>> Queries, already adopted by CSS WG. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> I agree a TAG review is not needed for the `dynamic-range` MQ, as it's >>>> shipped in Safari and adopted by the CSSWG. >>>> The video variant however doesn't meet that criteria. Was the concept >>>> of `video-*` MQs discussed with the TAG? Are there other `video-*` MQs >>>> that >>>> are already shipped? >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> TAG review statusNot applicable >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Risks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Gecko: Worth prototyping ( >>>>>>> https://github.com/mozilla/standards-positions/issues/584) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WebKit: Shipped/Shipping ( >>>>>>> https://webkit.org/blog/10247/new-webkit-features-in-safari-13-1/) >>>>>>> Partially implemented - `video-dynamic-range` not yet supported >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Web developers: Positive ( >>>>>>> https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/4471#issuecomment-548085935) >>>>>>> Feature designed with the help of Netflix. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Debuggability >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No specific DevTools support >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Please follow https://goo.gle/devtools-checklist and elaborate on >>>>>> this a little bit. Per the guide, we need to ensure DevTools supports >>>>>> basic >>>>>> editing of this new media query. It looks like this works out of the box >>>>>> in >>>>>> Canary. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Is this feature fully tested by web-platform-tests >>>>>>> <https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/master/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md> >>>>>>> ?Yes >>>>>>> https://wpt.fyi/results/css/mediaqueries/dynamic-range.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Flag nameCSSDynamicRangeMediaQueries >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Requires code in //chrome?False >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Tracking bughttps://crbug.com/1224711 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Estimated milestones97 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5680926106320896 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This intent message was generated by Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>> <https://www.chromestatus.com/>. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CA%2BF%3DP4hQtag7Ja_7HF4jRHbuC8h5-_0TzjoJvVEMHmrUeZYW9g%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CA%2BF%3DP4hQtag7Ja_7HF4jRHbuC8h5-_0TzjoJvVEMHmrUeZYW9g%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/6655cbcd-90a1-4b34-a332-5adeada4b53fn%40chromium.org >>>>> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/6655cbcd-90a1-4b34-a332-5adeada4b53fn%40chromium.org?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> . >>>>> >>>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "blink-dev" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> > To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAG0MU3gbBzJUttDWuWDRFWnP-w7%3DP4G7TrBPJiU%3DyizEH2%2Bz_Q%40mail.gmail.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAG0MU3gbBzJUttDWuWDRFWnP-w7%3DP4G7TrBPJiU%3DyizEH2%2Bz_Q%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "blink-dev" group. 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