This has been in AUTH48 since August and not a single author has responded here. That's pretty awful.
Is there still any interest in seeing it published or should we abandon it? I don't really want to hand any dead work to my successor or to Zahed. -MSK, ART AD On Fri, Feb 7, 2025 at 1:05 PM Jonathan Lennox <jonathan.len...@8x8.com> wrote: > I’m not an author on this draft, but as chair I thought I would try to > answer these questions, to make sure the process could get done. I spoke > with Mo about these issues in Dublin and I think he’ll agree with all of > these. Mo, please correct me if I’ve misunderstood anything. > > > On Aug 13, 2024, at 12:27 AM, rfc-edi...@rfc-editor.org wrote: > > > > Authors and *AD, > > > > [AD - please see question 4 below] > > > > While reviewing this document during AUTH48, please resolve (as > necessary) the following questions, which are also in the XML file. > > > > 1) <!-- [rfced] Please insert any keywords (beyond those that appear in > > the title) for use on https://www.rfc-editor.org/search. --> > > Scalable video, h.264, h.265, vp9, layered video > > > 2) <!--[rfced] Please review whether "e.g." in the following should > > instead be "i.e.": > > > > Original: > > Because of inter-frame dependencies, it should ideally switch video > > streams at a point where the first frame from the new speaker can be > > decoded by recipients without prior frames, e.g. switch on an > > intra-frame. > > An intra frame is the most common situation where a stream can be decoded > without prior frames, but there are others for some codecs, so I think e.g. > is appropriate here. > > > > --> > > > > > > 3) <!--[rfced] Should "field" or some other noun follow > > "refresh_frame_flags" in this sentence? Or is this referring to > > the flags (as the verb "are" is plural)? > > > > Original: > > The D bit MUST be 1 if the refresh_frame_flags in the VP9 payload > > uncompressed header are all 0, otherwise it MUST be 0. > > --> > > I think “refresh_frame_flags bits" > > > > > 4) <!--[rfced] [*AD] We see several (similar) sentences like the example > > below where it might be difficult for the reader to correclty > > understand what part(s) of the sentence the keyword MUST applies > > to. We wonder if a rewrite may be helpful to the reader, > > possibly using a list... Please see the example below (again, > > other similar instances exist in the document) and let us know if > > an update like one of the following might work. > > > > Original: > > > > The D bit MUST be 1 when the NAL unit header NRI field is 0, or an > > aggregation packet or fragmentation unit encapsulating only NAL units > > with NRI=0, otherwise it MUST be 0. > > > > Perhaps A (the "when" clause applies to both the D bit being set to 1 or > NRI=0): > > > > When the NAL unit header NRI field is 0, the D bit MUST be either 1 or > > an aggregation packet or fragmentation unit encapsulating only NAL > > units with NRI=0. When the NAL unit header NRI field is not set to 0, > > the D bit MUST be 0. > > > > Perhaps B (the "when" clause only applies to the D bit being 0): > > > > The D bit MUST be: > > > > -1 when the NAL unit header NRI field is 0, > > > > -an aggregation packet or fragmentation unit encapsulating only NAL units > > with NRI=0, or > > > > - 0. > > The D bit MUST be 1 if either: > - The payload's NAL unit header’s NRI field is 0, or > - The payload is an aggregation packet or fragmentation unit > encapsulating only NAL units with NRI=0. > Otherwise, it MUST be 0. > > > > > 5) <!-- [rfced] Please review whether any of the notes in this document > > should be in the <aside> element. It is defined as "a container for > > content that is semantically less important or tangential to the > > content that surrounds it" ( > https://authors.ietf.org/en/rfcxml-vocabulary#aside). > > --> > > > > Both the two “Note:” comments could be <aside> elements. > > > > > 6) <!--[rfced] May we update this sentence as follows for the ease of the > > reader? Note that the introductory "when" phrase mentions a > > single frame while the recommendation mentions plural frames: > > please consider if further updates are necessary. > > > > Original: > > When an RTP switch needs to discard a received video frame due to > > congestion control considerations, it is RECOMMENDED that it > > preferably drop frames marked with the D (Discardable) bit set, or the > > highest values of TID and LID, which indicate the highest temporal and > > spatial/quality enhancement layers, since those typically have fewer > > dependenices on them than lower layers. > > > > > > Perhaps A: > > When an RTP switch needs to discard a received video frame due to > > congestion control considerations, it is RECOMMENDED that it drop: > > > > - frames marked with the D (Discardable) bit set, or > > > > -frames with the highest values of TID and LID (which indicate the > > highest temporal and spatial/quality enhancement layers) since those > > typically have fewer dependencies on them than lower layers. > > > > Perhaps B (to upddate the sg/pl switch): > > When an RTP switch needs to discard received video frames due to > > congestion control considerations, it is RECOMMENDED that it drop: > > > > - frames marked with the D (Discardable) bit set, or > > > > -frames with the highest values of TID and LID (which indicate the > > highest temporal and spatial/quality enhancement layers) since those > > typically have fewer dependencies on them than lower layers. > > > > --> > > I’m missing something here because I don’t see the difference between > these two options, but that text is fine. > > > 7) <!--[rfced] Please clarify what "and forward the same" means in this > text. > > > > Original: > > When an RTP switch wants to forward a new video stream to a receiver, > > it is RECOMMENDED to select the new video stream from the first > > switching point with the I (Independent) bit set in all spatial > > layers and forward the same. > > --> > > Perhaps “and forward the stream from that point on”. > > > 8) <!--[rfced] How may we update this text to more easily illustrate the > > 1:1 mapping between initialism and expansion? > > > > Original: > > ... source to generate a switching point by sending Full Intra > > Request (RTCP FIR) as defined in [RFC5104]... > > > > Perhaps: > > ... source to generate a switching point by sending RTCP Full Intra > > Request (FIR) as defined in [RFC5104]... > > > > --> > > That’s fine. > > > > > > > 9) <!--[rfced] In the following, are "layer" and "refreshes" redundant > > with what LRR stands for? Please let us know if any updates are > > necessary. > > > > Original: > > Because frame marking can only be used with temporally-nested > > streams, temporal-layer LRR refreshes are unnecessary for frame- > > marked streams. > > > > As expanded it would be: > > Because frame marking can only be used with temporally nested > > streams, temporal-layer Layer Refresh Request (LRR) refreshes are > > unnecessary for frame-marked streams. > > --> > > Perhaps “temporal-layer refreshes requested with an LRR message” would > avoid the duplicative language? > > > 10) <!-- [rfced] Would you like the references to be alphabetized or left > > in their current order? > > --> > > This is something where the RFC Editor’s style guide should dictate, I > don’t think there’s any particular preference for a specific reference > order. > > > > > > 11) <!-- [rfced] We had the following questions related to abbreviations > > used throughout the document. > > > > a) Please note that we have expanded these abbreviations as follows on > > first use. Please let us know any objections. > > > > MCU - Multipoint Control Unit (per RFC 7667) > > SRTP - Secure Real-time Transport Protocol > > IDR - Instantaneous Decoding Refresh (per RFC 6184) > > SDES - source description > > NAL - Network Abstraction Layer > > CRA - Clean Random Access > > BLA - Broken Link Access > > RAP - Random Access Point > > AVC - Advanced Video Coidng (per RFC 6184) > > SVC - Scalable Video Coding (per RFC 6190) > > PACSI - Payload Content Scalability Information > > NRI - Network Remote Identification > > No; the field in the H.264 specification is actually formally named > “nal_ref_idc”. I believe this stands for something like Network Adaptation > Layer Reference Indication but as far as I can tell it’s never explicitly > spelled out in that specification as far as I can tell. > > > VPS - Video Parameter Set > > SPS - Sequence Parameter Set > > PPS - Picture Parameter Set > > The other abbreviations all seem to be correct. > > > > > b) Please clarify if/how we may expand the following abbreviations: > > > > VPX > > PACI - is this intentionally different from PACSI? > > Yes; the protocol element field is called PACI in RFC 7798 (for H.265) vs. > PACSI in RFC 6190 (for H.264-SVC). > > > c) Should "intra (IDR)" frames instead be "IDR intra-frames"? This > > formation occurs twice in this document. > > Intra frames are the common term, IDR is the more formal term, so this is > a clarification with two synonymous terms, not a restrictive adjective. > > > > > d) Please note that the following similar abbreviations appear to be > > differently treated with regard to punctuation: > > > > H264 (AVC) > > H264-SVC > > > > We have expanded the abbreviations on first use, but please let us > > know if/how these should be made uniform with regard to parens and > > hyphantion. > > > > See also our cluster-wide question regarding H264 vs. H.264. > > --> > > Names of ITU specs (H.264 and H.265) should include the dot character. > > AVC and SVC are not parallel; AVC is the title of the H.264 specification > as a whole, whereas SVC refers specifically to the extensions to it > specified in Annex F. Thus the parentheses for the former (as an > explanatory synonym) vs. the hyphen for the latter (as a restriction). > > > > 12) <!--[rfced] We had the following questions related to terminology > used > > throughout the document. > > > > a) Two questions about the header extension: > > > > Should this RTP header extension appear using "Video" throughout? We > > see both of the following forms. > > > > Video Frame Marking RTP header extension vs. Frame Marking RTP header > extension > > Yes, I think having Video throughout is good. > > > > > Secondly, in the Abstract, we see: > > > > Original: > > This document describes a Video Frame Marking RTP header extension > > used to convey information about video frames that is critical for > > error recovery and packet forwarding in RTP middleboxes or network > > nodes. > > > > Is the use of the indefinite article "a" intentional ("a Video Frame > > Marking RTP header extension")? This seems (possibly) contradictory > > with the capitalization of the proper noun and use in Section 3 (are > > there more types of Video Frame Marking RTP header extensions?). > > Please review. > > --> > > There certainly are other RTP header extensions that mark video frames, > though none of them have been standardized by the IETF as yet; I think > that’s why there is the indefinite article here. > > > > > > > 13) <!-- [rfced] Please review the "Inclusive Language" portion of the > > online Style Guide > > <https://www.rfc-editor.org/styleguide/part2/#inclusive_language> > > and let us know if any changes are needed. Updates of this > > nature typically result in more precise language, which is > > helpful for readers. > > > > Note that our script did not flag any words in particular, but this > > should still be reviewed as a best practice. > > > > --> > > I don’t see any problems. > > > > > > > Thank you. > > > > RFC Editor/mf > > > > *****IMPORTANT***** > > > > Updated 2024/08/12 > > > > RFC Author(s): > > -------------- > > > > Instructions for Completing AUTH48 > > > > Your document has now entered AUTH48. 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Please use ‘REPLY ALL’, > > as all the parties CCed on this message need to see your approval. > > > > > > Files > > ----- > > > > The files are available here: > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626.xml > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626.html > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626.pdf > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626.txt > > > > Diff file of the text: > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626-diff.html > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626-rfcdiff.html (side by side) > > > > Diff of the XML: > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626-xmldiff1.html > > > > The following files are provided to facilitate creation of your own > > diff files of the XML. > > > > Initial XMLv3 created using XMLv2 as input: > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626.original.v2v3.xml > > > > XMLv3 file that is a best effort to capture v3-related format updates > > only: > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/authors/rfc9626.form.xml > > > > > > Tracking progress > > ----------------- > > > > The details of the AUTH48 status of your document are here: > > https://www.rfc-editor.org/auth48/rfc9626 > > > > Please let us know if you have any questions. > > > > Thank you for your cooperation, > > > > RFC Editor > > > > -------------------------------------- > > RFC9626 (draft-ietf-avtext-framemarking-16) > > > > Title : Video Frame Marking RTP Header Extension > > Author(s) : M. Zanaty, E. Berger, S. Nandakumar > > WG Chair(s) : Dr. Bernard D. Aboba, Jonathan Lennox > > Area Director(s) : Zaheduzzaman Sarker, Francesca Palombini > > > > > >
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