Imo Kyle that's just good nomic lol. Also, creation + stamps working is just like creation working except with the addition of a step where stamps disappear.
On Fri, Sep 8, 2017 at 6:21 AM, Kyle Anderson <kyescott5...@gmail.com> wrote: > Just as an aside, this shit is crazy. Pardon my French. It makes me wonder > how many players know of issues in the rules similar to this and are just > waiting for the right time to exploit them. > > K > > On Sep 7, 2017 10:15 PM, "Owen Jacobson" <o...@grimoire.ca> wrote: > > > > On Sep 7, 2017, at 11:58 PM, Kyle Anderson <kyescott5...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > I hate to be annoying, but will someone explain to me what just happened > with stamps? I've read through the posts, but I'm confused at why they no > longer exist. I thought that the scam did not succeed, though I'm not > entirely sure why. Did the scam work? > > > > Sorry, just trying to wrap my head around this. There's a lot to follow > tonight. > > > > K > > I hold that neither CuddleBeam’s scams, nor Gaelan’s scam, worked. > Furthermore, there may not be any stamps at all. > > The rule “Mother, May I?” defines several terms. Key for unpicking this > situation are the terms “CAN” and “MAY”. A rule stating that something CAN > be done defines a mechanism for doing it. A rule saying that something MAY > be done prevents the doing of a thing from drawing a penalty. This > distinction has gone wrong several times. > > The rule “Economic Victory” defines stamps, and states that several things > MAY be done, but does not state that those things CAN be done. The rule > “Regulated Actions” is phrased in such a way that a CAN would be required > for those actions to be possible. One of the things that the rule states > MAY be done is the destruction, by announcement, of any stamp, with Agora > paying the announcing player the current Stamp Value. Had MAY been CAN, > this rule would have allowed Gaelan to sequentially destroy stamps and > harvest their value, regardless of who owned the stamps. > > Gaelan’s scam would have worked, where CuddleBeam’s would not have even > with a CAN, because Gaelan specified the order stamps should be destroyed > in sufficiently clearly to avoid ambiguity. CuddleBeam simply said “all > stamps”, in a situation where more stamps existed than Agora had Shinies to > pay for. The rule only allows a single stamp to be destroyed this way at a > time, so order matters, and depending on the order in which stamps were > destroyed, different stamps may end up existing afterwards - hence the > ambiguity that ruined CuddleBeam’s second attempt. > > CuddleBeam’s first attempt failed for a simple wording error. > > -o > > >
