On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 16:41, Ed Murphy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Detail: http://zenith.homelinux.net/cotc/viewcase.php?cfj=2112
>
> ============================== CFJ 2112 ==============================
>
> Publishing the message "I object", in response to an attempt to
> perform a dependent action, causes an action to be taken by
> announcement.
>
> ========================================================================
>
> Caller: comex
>
> Judge: woggle
> Judgement:
>
> ========================================================================
>
> History:
>
> Called by comex: 23 Jul 2008 16:28:03 GMT
> Assigned to woggle: (as of this message)
>
> ========================================================================
[snip]
Proto-judgment:
Evidence:
(from R2124)
[...] An Objector to a
dependent action is a first-class player (or other person
explicitly allowed to object to that action by the rule allowing
that action to be performed dependently) who has publicly posted
(and not withdrawn) an objection to the announcement of intent
to perform the action.
(from R478)
Where the rules define an action that CAN be performed "by
announcement", a person performs that action by announcing that
e performs it. Any action performed by sending a message is
performed at the time date-stamped on that message.
Arguments:
Problematically for root's arguments, R478 doesn't explicitly define
"by announcement". It makes it clear what happens when the rules state
something CAN be performed by announcement and is followed by a
broader statement which uses "by sending a message", avoiding an
implication that it is limited to actions that the rules state CAN be
performed by announcement. But does R478 imply that "An action can be
taken "by announcement" only if the rules define it as such."? I don't
think there's any good reason to apply this restriction. But we can
logically conclude that any action is taken by announcing one performs
it can count as an action by announcement.
But does it apply when the rule-recognized mechanism recognizing the
action doesn't require an announcement that causes the action to occur
to take the form of announcing that the author performs it? This would
lead to some strange conclusions. "I submit the following ballot:
...." would be performing an action by announcement (submitting a
ballot) but the common unmarked replies to the distribution would not.
SImarily "I submit the following proposal: " would be performing an
action by announcement, but a less-well-marked proposal submission
would not.
While ordinarily these conclusions would be IRRELEVANT, R2208 makes
them highly relevant: these apparent attempts at clarifying the
actions would, in fact, increase the standard of clarity required for
the action to be effective. I do not think this restriction would be
in the best interest of the game. And, as I think this feature of
R2208 reflects, we tend to think of actions "by announcement" as
actions which have been defined with certain criteria for performance,
not as actions that we happen to choose a certain form for.
Therefore, I judge FALSE.
Some side issues:
That posting an objection to a dependent action is only recognized
indirectly (by causing the player to become an Objector) hurts the
case for "I object" to be taking an objection by announcement further.
We might take "I object" is a reasonable synonym for "I post an
objection", but that only helps so much. Would the rule's recognition
be sufficient effectiveness rendered by announcing it to render it an
"action by announcement" -- it is really no different than the
equivalent unregulated action, so I think not. (But perhaps you could
stretch things and find that it's also a synonym for "I become an
Objector", but that seems a real stretch.)
If we were to accept a broader definition of "action by announcement":
then if a rule stated "A player who has publicly posted an odd number
of Es in eir messages within the current Agoran Month is a Foo, and
other players are a Bar", would we then conclude that "I hereby turn
myself into a Foo." is an action by announcement?
-woggle
