How long is LTS on Ubuntu compared to what Centos was? I think LTS is 5 years vs 10 years with Centos?
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 8:04 PM Steve Jones <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote: > I just rebuilt our librenms server on ubuntu. It doesnt seem bad, lots of > google answers. Webmin looks cool, dont knownifnits the new webmin or > because it's on ubuntu. I dont care for the weird adapter naming and this > yaml thing for configuring them. Commands arent that different. > Not sure if theres a way to enable root user or not. > I like that a lot of google advice is nano centric and not vi, I never > could figure out vi > > On Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 7:11 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote: > >> Cool. I hope they change the name though. >> >> >> >> This is reminding me of Mickey Mouse as the Sorcerer’s Apprentice in >> Fantasia, when he tries to stop the broom with an ax, only to have the >> splinters turn into a multitude of brooms. >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince >> *Sent:* Thursday, December 17, 2020 6:23 PM >> *To:* af@af.afmug.com >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead? >> >> >> >> More options: >> >> >> https://www.zdnet.com/article/cloudlinux-to-invest-more-than-a-million-dollar-a-year-into-centos-clone/ >> >> >> >> bp >> >> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> >> >> On 12/13/2020 12:42 PM, Josh Baird wrote: >> >> RHEL pricing is highly dependent on volume. Nobody typically pays >> advertised pricing. But, it's still not cheap, especially at scale. You >> can buy per instance (or guest) or license an entire hypervisor for >> unlimited instances of RHEL. >> >> >> >> Your subscription basically allows you to access their repository of >> updates (think yum/dnf update), knowledge base, and ability to open cases >> (with some levels of subscription). >> >> >> >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2020 at 2:47 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote: >> >> Just to cover all the bases, what does it cost to use RHEL? I find their >> web page a little confusing. Is it $350 or $800? And that’s per server >> per year, right? Does it turn into a pumpkin if you don’t renew the >> license every year? That seems pretty expensive especially if you don’t >> need support and are basically just getting a distribution and repositories >> for open source software. >> >> >> >> Actually I’m still a little confused about their pricing. The $350 >> version says no VMs and not intended for production use. Does that mean >> you are violating the terms of the license if you use it in production, or >> just their way of saying you can’t open support tickets? And are there >> add-ons that would be cost yet more for a basic server application? >> >> >> >> For the first few years I actually used RHEL, I forget if I had to pay >> upfront or every year. That just does not sound feasible. >> >> >> >> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Lincs Chel >> *Sent:* Sunday, December 13, 2020 1:27 PM >> *To:* af@af.afmug.com >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead? >> >> >> >> Hi Josh; >> >> OK. Thanks for expanding your thoughts and info on the Oracle Linux >> distro and Oracle. It allows one to appreciate the context. This will >> certainly educate and assist an inexperienced Linux user who is information >> gathering to make some sound judgements about the CentOS and Oracle Linux >> distros and where to go. >> >> Yeah, I concur with your view that the majority of users that is >> currently using the free CentOS distro, is most likely going to be seeking >> the same in any alternative they elect to use as a replacement for CentOS. >> Also Oracle's past history on acquisitions and Open Source projects >> certainly makes one really think hard about going into their camp; Java, >> MySQL, ZFS etc. comes to mind. >> >> Most of the Linux training I have come across so far also seems to use >> CentOS as a start. So this will be interesting as well. >> >> Lincoln >> >> On 13/12/2020 10:02 AM, Josh Baird wrote: >> >> Lincs, >> >> >> >> One could also say that Stream is also a "direct binary replacement" for >> CentOS. In fact, to switch a CentOS system to Steam, all you need to do is >> modify your repo definitions. >> >> >> >> You are correct, OL isn't meant to be only used for Oracle software and >> appliances, but it usually is. I didn't mean to insinuate otherwise. You >> will very rarely find a shop running OL just because they want to. >> >> >> >> Bottom line - Oracle is a monster that I don't want to get in bed with. >> I was in the enterprise sector for many years and saw first hand how >> terrible Oracle's products and software really is. I have watched >> companies spend *millions* of dollars on Oracle products that are barely >> functional and could have been replaced with other working solutions at a >> fraction of the cost. Nothing you say will convince me otherwise :) To >> each his own, though! >> >> >> >> Ultimately, I don't believe the majority of CentOS users will want to pay >> for RHEL/OL. They will just switch to Steam/Rocky/etc or make the move to >> Debian (which can be a massive undertaking in itself depending on how much >> time/effort/money you have invested in tooling, etc for EL based distros). >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> >> >> Josh >> >> >> >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2020 at 8:44 AM Lincs Chel <lhan...@enc-tech.com> wrote: >> >> Hi Josh; >> >> An interesting 'emotional' response to the CentOS dilemma . It seems to >> miss the objective of finding an immediate, short-term and/or possible >> long-term solution for a CentOS replacement for the community. If you look >> at the Oracle Linux information, it is a direct binary replacement for >> CentOS right out of the box; usable right-away. Nor does it appear to be >> just an appliance based product and only meant for Oracle software. That >> would be a misleading characterization of their product and to an >> inexperienced Linux end-user. It's almost suggesting to a person, that you >> can't run other software on top of Microsoft Windows unless it came from >> Microsoft itself, or iOS, unless it's from Apple and so on. It does >> however appear that they (Oracle) are suggesting that you will get a really >> great experience with their software running on top of Oracle Linux rather >> than RedHat's version or CentOS or some other Linux distro. I also think >> Oracle Linux is being positioned for the cloud based network in which all >> of the big-ones wants to compete head-to-head. Oracle Linux gives Oracle >> sort of control as to an OS you can readily and easily pick when on their >> cloud platform that is based on a well known Open Source Linux. Makes >> sense for them to keep it going. I suspect IBM is positioning itself like >> that as well. They now have RedHat on their cloud platform and control its >> direction. They're all aiming for AWS and Microsoft (which has Azure and >> Windows). >> >> Oracle Linux code and/or OS runs without any contortions for the >> end-user, both experienced and inexperienced Linux users can benefit from >> this. Essentially one can basically continue running a CentOS environment >> right now if they wish and/or choose to do so using the Oracle Linux >> software. And, more importantly without any subscription fees, i.e. for >> free. I think their subscription pricing looks very reasonable as well for >> what its worth especially if you're rookie and on a budget. Nothing like >> hand holding from a single source, than Googling the entire net and wading >> through tons of blogs and different ideas when you're stuck. >> >> Yes, Oracle doesn't appear to always play well with the Open Source >> community products. But that can be perception. But I would say most of >> the big companies who use and/or own Open Source software as their >> business, don't do things the free and Open Source users like all the >> time. All trying to protect their turf, products and revenue. >> >> Oracle can be seen as the 'evil' one, don't trust them with a 10-ft >> pole. Likewise Microsoft, RedHat, IBM, Amazon, Google, Apple and all those >> crazy new free-software licensing terms and models software companies. >> >> CloudLinux is also an option for a direct replacement. But this appears >> to be only by subscription only for right now. When I had last checked on >> it, it was not free and required a subscription that didn't appear >> inexpensive. But more expensive for someone that is usually accustomed to >> paying $0.00 for their server software. >> >> >> >> Lincoln >> >> On 13/12/2020 12:16 AM, Josh Baird wrote: >> >> Sorry, but nobody in their right mind runs Oracle Linux unless you're >> using Oracle software and appliances that require you to run OL for support. >> >> >> >> On Sat, Dec 12, 2020 at 10:22 PM Lincs Chel <lhan...@enc-tech.com> wrote: >> >> Hi; >> >> I think another option to consider would be Oracle Linux. Consider the >> following from their blog, news and website:- >> >> >> - If you are reading this blog, you are probably a CentOS user and >> are in the position where you need to look at alternatives going forward. >> Switching to Oracle Linux is easy. >> >> >> - >> >> https://blogs.oracle.com/linux/need-a-stable%2c-rhel-compatible-alternative-to-centos-three-reasons-to-consider-oracle-linux >> >> >> - Need a stable, RHEL compatible alternative to CentOS? >> >> >> - https://www.oracle.com/linux/ >> >> >> >> Another option if you're using cPanel & WHM is to most likely use them as >> a good guide:- >> >> - cPanel Support For CentOS 8 And More >> >> >> - https://blog.cpanel.com/centos-8-end-of-life-announcement/ >> >> >> >> And, if you're coming from the old Cobalt Networks RaQ server era days >> and/or BlueOnyx, they have a good blog, news & comments. Probably their >> posture may be the best position to take when looking and/or want to >> "marry" with a particular distro which had various roadmaps during their >> history. >> >> >> - BlueOnyx has been available on CentOS since CentOS 5, but as the >> CentOS project never was without issues and unpredictability. Therefore >> we've never been fully "married" to it. It's always been more of a matter >> of convenience than one of choice. We even departed briefly from CentOS >> during the CentOS 6 days and favored Scientific Linux 6 instead. Since >> then >> we kept our eyes and ears open for alternatives and also contemplated >> contingencies. >> >> >> >> - You are here: Welcome to BlueOnyx» News >> CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream >> >> >> - >> >> https://www.blueonyx.it/news/280/54/CentOS-Project-shifts-focus-to-CentOS-Stream/d,Simplex%20News%20Detail >> >> Based on BlueOnyx website news, they have indicated the original founder >> of CentOS is considering a possible return:- >> >> And like mentioned above: We're not the only ones whom RedHat pulled the >> rug out from under our feet. >> >> In fact Gregory Kurtzer (co-founder of CentOS) had this to say >> <https://blog.centos.org/2020/12/future-is-centos-stream/#comment-183642> >> : >> >> I am considering creating another rebuild of RHEL and may even be able to >> hire some people for this effort. If you are interested in helping, please >> join the HPCng slack (link on the website hpcng.org). >> >> Greg (original founder of CentOS) >> >> >> >> If you've installed and use cnMaestro and Cambium's software on CentOS, >> then the impact may even be more on your operations. I am guessing >> Cambium's cnMaestro may drop support for CentOS eventually. >> >> >> >> Lincoln >> >> >> >> On 12/12/2020 11:39 AM, Bill Prince wrote: >> >> Mostly. IBM charges quite a bit for it, but they're big blue. Not sure >> what they're getting out of their multi-billion dollar purchase, but we >> would have to sit in their board room to understand their thinking. I >> wouldn't be surprised to see that they are saving money by getting all >> those community developers do the work for next to nothing. Sure cuts down >> on the expenses in the development department. >> >> The only real issue is which version of linux you want hook your wagon >> to. I used Centos for quite a long time; mainly because it was >> "enterprise". Then it go too "enterprise" for my taste, and have since >> switched to Debian. It's the same, but different. Same enough for my taste, >> and down-homey enough for the small operation we are. >> >> NBD. >> >> >> >> bp >> >> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> >> >> On 12/12/2020 8:14 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote: >> >> Linux... linux is free... right? >> >> >> >> *From:* Ken Hohhof >> >> *Sent:* Saturday, December 12, 2020 8:39 AM >> >> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' >> >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead? >> >> >> >> I guess it would have been naïve of us all to expect no change when IBM >> acquired RedHat. >> >> >> >> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On >> Behalf Of *Steve Jones >> *Sent:* Friday, December 11, 2020 11:58 PM >> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> >> <af@af.afmug.com> >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead? >> >> >> >> Holy shit, I just took a cursory look at redhat pricing. Starts at 350 a >> year per server, physical server only, and not intended for production use. >> 2500 a year for the data center if I read it right >> >> >> >> I run webmin to manage package updates and BIND. If I'm reading correctly >> ubuntu isnt terrible, just less security patched since it's all opensource >> and not subsidized by a big dog like red hat. Probably doable, but no yum. >> >> >> >> Has something like this happenned with centos historically? I assume the >> linux community will bring about a comparable solution or resolution. >> >> >> >> This just stinks, I had my centos process down. >> >> >> >> Is this end of life like a microst end of life where they just keep >> patching and saying they mean it this time for years? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020, 11:28 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote: >> >> Supposedly there will be CentOS Stream? Kind of like RHEL beta instead >> of RHEL day old bread. I guess their answer would be if you are using it >> in a production environment you could always pay for RHEL. Or there’s >> Fedora. I believe Preseem runs on Fedora. >> >> >> >> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett >> *Sent:* Friday, December 11, 2020 10:19 PM >> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead? >> >> >> >> Debian is like Ubuntu ,only better. ;-) >> >> >> >> ----- >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL> >> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions> >> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix> >> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange> >> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> >> >> >> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From: *"Steve Jones" <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> >> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com> >> *Sent: *Friday, December 11, 2020 5:12:13 PM >> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Centos is dead? >> >> I've been a peasant my whole life, is there any other way? >> >> I think powercode is ubuntu now, so I'll probably go that route, are >> there major differences to it? >> >> I dont like saying ubuntu, too much like ubnt >> >> >> >> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020, 3:47 PM Seth Mattinen <se...@rollernet.us> wrote: >> >> On 12/11/20 13:21, Steve Jones wrote: >> > Am I reading all this right? Redhat officially killed centos and its >> > tombstoned in 2021? >> > >> > Everything I run is centos. It's not like I know centos but I have my >> > resource sets on where to go to resolve anything that pops up. >> > >> > Is this just a normal thing in the linux world where something is ended >> > but actually just rebrands and keeps going or is it a legit end of the >> OS? >> >> >> It happens. Someone will probably fork it and make up a new distro if >> that hasn't happened already. IMO the main reason to use CentOS was >> because it was rebuilt RHEL. >> >> I gave up on Red Hat about two releases into Fedora Core when it became >> obvious it was just rapidly changing garbage for testing on the peasants >> before bringing fixes into their commercial version. >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >
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