> Since I started this, let me explain to those who can't begin to understand > why I proposed something so "stupid". At work (branch of a federal gov't > big-5 Department) I need 40TB but have next to nothing in budget. (For some > reason all you damn citizens think you're entitled to keep most of your > paychecks to yourself instead living off what I decide to give you in > foodstamps and rent-controled housing.) Therefore, I can't afford let alone > justify the preposterous premium demanded by "enterprise" > EMC/Sun/IBM/NetApp. I can really use dedup, (integrity would be nice), and > reasonable rack and power footprint since I'm out of that too. > > I don't think anyone who has followed this thread had a problem understanding why you asked what you asked. The problem is that you won't accept the answer. The fact that you need 40TB and have next to nothing in budget is a major issue, but frankly that is your problem. You need to wake up and realize that in the real world you have to manage expectations.
> I can't exactly march into my boss' office and propose that we build my own > at-home special which is 16 WD RE2/3 drives $(60) in a $70 case, $100 power > supply, four 4-in-3 modules ($30) and a Chenbro SAS expander ($250) now can > I... > > And your boss can't expect you to buy a premium storage appliance at the same cost as your at home special. In the real world, you start with a budget, you look at the options, and you make the best compromise you can. It's that simple. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. > Aside: I find it laughable for anyone to claim a J4500 is "premium" > anything. IBM DS800, EMC Symetrix, NetApp FAS5xxx, sure. But a glorified > JBOD enclosure? Put down the damn cool-aid! > > I find it laughable that anyone would expect to buy a product like the j4500 without any drives. Again, you seem to be living in a fantasy world where you can pick a really great piece of hardware and get it at walmart prices. > The cheapest solution out there that isn't a Supermicro-like server > chassis, is DAS in the form of HP or Dell MD-series which top out at 15 or > 16 3" drives. I can only chain 3 units per SAS port off a HBA in either > case. > > Enter the J4500, 48 drives in 4U, what looks to be solid engineering, and > redundancy in all the right places. An empty chassis at $3000 is totally > justifiable. Maybe as high as $4000. In comparison a naked Dell MD1000 is > $2000. If you do the subtraction from SUN's claimed "breakthru" pricing of > $1/GB, the chassis cost works out to $4000. I can live with that. > But this isn't the way they are sold. It's that simple. Get over it. > > Now look up the price for 24TB and it's 28 freaking thousand! I can buy > 24TB worth of good SATA drives for $5000 all day long and twice on Sunday. ( > http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1531954) > > And you are FREE to do that, go buy those drives and build your own unit and stop trying to buy outside your budget. > I can buy Dell trays from DELL themselves let alone a bevy of 3rd parties > for as low as $12 each. SUN's are like $25 on the aftermarket and much > harder to come by. > > So, does my question make sense now? My only play is Dell at this time. I > was TRYING to see if the SUN route could be made possible since it would be > the better solution. But I guess I'm not "enterprisy" enough, ie with so > much more money than brains for the likes of SUN to give 2 (@Rts. Dell and > HP *WANT* my business by pricing things where I can reasonably get to them. > A fully-qualified 500GB SATA drive from DELL is $300, so a 3x multiplier. > Still quite a bit more than I think is warranted, but SUN wants 5x? Nothing > SUN makes is so much better than DELL/HP, indeed they are essentially > indistinguishable that they can get away with pretending to be EMC. Is it > any wonder they failed? > > Your question made sense, The problem is that you don't like the answer. I can totally understand why you'd inquire about it but at the same time you don't get to come in and make up your own prices. That is simply not how business is done. This is why people are laughing. > > Spare me the bit about how there is so much expensive and complex > engineering invested in something as stupid straight-forward as the J4500 or > in qualifying drive firmware. I've worked on qualifying SUN, IBM, and other > storage products (firmware, hardware, OS drivers) some of which were of our > own designs that the big names simply slapped their label on. They outsource > this stuff to a certain company just west of Chicago on route 355 (among > others). I know what I was paid. We had 4 guys in that lab and as a > overhead/GB we were no bigger a pimple on a gnat's hind end. There is no > mysterious voodoo in storage enclosure design that requires an army of > highly trained PhD's months to figure out. > > > > Wow, you have a hard time with reality huh? It's pretty funny that you think you know the product better than the people who make it. It's also funny that you want it so bad but you think it's "stupid" and "straight-forward" I'm truly sorry that you can't afford to buy the j4500, but don't cry foul just because you don't like the price. Its childish.
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